Dropping the British term "Middle East" and remembering Sumer might give young people a new goal

[Max Headroom]

One of the saddest ironies of history is that the area where humanity first unified to give us the very first civilisation, Sumer, is now so divided and constantly on the verge of war. The Sumerians built the world's first capital city Uruk which housed between 40 to 80 thousand people. Uruk developed agriculture but also a large enough population to encourage specialisation. This lead to metallurgy, money, mathematics, and writing. The Sumerians developed these 2000 years before the Babylonians took over! All because a small collection of city states cooperated and traded. More on their history here.

Sadly different religious and political empires have divided the region for centuries, often resulting in bloodshed and war. Young people in the Middle East are starting to dream a bigger dream for the entire region.

Remembering what was achieved in their glorious deep past, they look to the future. Let's abandon the names of the British Empire as it unimaginatively called the region the "Middle East" to distinguish it from the “Far East”. Dreams are not born in names of servitude, but of greatness!

Sumer is where their great ancestors invented the very idea of civilisation itself, so #Sumer should become their new dream, their new movement.

Modern day Sumerians dream of trade, not terror;
of conversation, not combat;
of building, not barbarism;
of wealth, not war.
Indeed, they want to end the proxie wars.

They want to build fast rail and travel and trade and jobs and economies and mutual interdependence. Modern Sumerians remember how Europe bombed each other back to the stone age in WW2. But through unity and increasing trade they prospered and in just 65 years have grown into a new superpower!


After the divisions of sects and sectarianism, a new generation of young people are tired of the old battles. They want to throw off the shackles and side effects of history. They are prepared to compromise. They are prepared for a secular government that guarantees freedom of religion and the special religious holidays of participating nations. They want their region to be appreciated for its rich history – and maybe encourage tourism? They want their shared identity as an ancient peoples to protect them from future proxie wars. They want #Sumer-now to become the greatest trend on social media, even if they don't know that's how it will happen. And they want it now.

REFERENCE (and there are many like it).
Arab Youth Survey: Religion 'too influential' in Middle East, say young people

 

[Aussie Pete]

One of the saddest ironies of history is that the area where humanity first unified to give us the very first civilisation, Sumer, is now so divided and constantly on the verge of war. The Sumerians built the world's first capital city Uruk which housed between 40 to 80 thousand people. Uruk developed agriculture but also a large enough population to encourage specialisation. This lead to metallurgy, money, mathematics, and writing. The Sumerians developed these 2000 years before the Babylonians took over! All because a small collection of city states cooperated and traded. More on their history here.

Sadly different religious and political empires have divided the region for centuries, often resulting in bloodshed and war.


Young people in the Middle East are starting to dream a bigger dream for the entire region.


Remembering what was achieved in their glorious deep past, they look to the future. Let's abandon the names of the British Empire as it unimaginatively called the region the "Middle East" to distinguish it from the “Far East”. Dreams are not born in names of servitude, but of greatness!


Sumer is where their great ancestors invented the very idea of civilisation itself, so #Sumer should become their new dream, their new movement.


Modern day Sumerians dream of trade, not terror;

of conversation, not combat;

of building, not barbarism;

of wealth, not war.


Indeed, they want to end the proxie wars.


They want to build fast rail and travel and trade and jobs and economies and mutual interdependence.


Modern Sumerians remember how Europe bombed each other back to the stone age in WW2. But through unity and increasing trade they prospered and in just 65 years have grown into a new superpower!


After the divisions of sects and sectarianism, a new generation of young people are tired of the old battles. They want to throw off the shackles and side effects of history. They are prepared to compromise. They are prepared for a secular government that guarantees freedom of religion and the special religious holidays of participating nations. They want their region to be appreciated for its rich history – and maybe encourage tourism? They want their shared identity as an ancient peoples to protect them from future proxie wars. They want #Sumer-now to become the greatest trend on social media, even if they don't know that's how it will happen. And they want it now.

REFERENCE (and there are many like it).
Arab Youth Survey: Religion 'too influential' in Middle East, say young people

All the best to their dreams. While Islam prevails, they have no hope.

 

[Tom 1]

One of the saddest ironies of history is that the area where humanity first unified to give us the very first civilisation, Sumer, is now so divided and constantly on the verge of war. The Sumerians built the world's first capital city Uruk which housed between 40 to 80 thousand people. Uruk developed agriculture but also a large enough population to encourage specialisation. This lead to metallurgy, money, mathematics, and writing. The Sumerians developed these 2000 years before the Babylonians took over! All because a small collection of city states cooperated and traded. More on their history here.

Sadly different religious and political empires have divided the region for centuries, often resulting in bloodshed and war.


Young people in the Middle East are starting to dream a bigger dream for the entire region.


Remembering what was achieved in their glorious deep past, they look to the future. Let's abandon the names of the British Empire as it unimaginatively called the region the "Middle East" to distinguish it from the “Far East”. Dreams are not born in names of servitude, but of greatness!


Sumer is where their great ancestors invented the very idea of civilisation itself, so #Sumer should become their new dream, their new movement.


Modern day Sumerians dream of trade, not terror;

of conversation, not combat;

of building, not barbarism;

of wealth, not war.


Indeed, they want to end the proxie wars.


They want to build fast rail and travel and trade and jobs and economies and mutual interdependence.


Modern Sumerians remember how Europe bombed each other back to the stone age in WW2. But through unity and increasing trade they prospered and in just 65 years have grown into a new superpower!


After the divisions of sects and sectarianism, a new generation of young people are tired of the old battles. They want to throw off the shackles and side effects of history. They are prepared to compromise. They are prepared for a secular government that guarantees freedom of religion and the special religious holidays of participating nations. They want their region to be appreciated for its rich history – and maybe encourage tourism? They want their shared identity as an ancient peoples to protect them from future proxie wars. They want #Sumer-now to become the greatest trend on social media, even if they don't know that's how it will happen. And they want it now.

REFERENCE (and there are many like it).
Arab Youth Survey: Religion 'too influential' in Middle East, say young people

It would be good to see more secular governments across the region. Erdogan seems bent on reversing that approach however.
What do you see as being the links between Sumeria and the later semitic peoples?

 

[Max Headroom]

What do you see as being the links between Sumeria and the later semitic peoples?

Honestly, the region has been so invaded and exiled and reinvaded and exiled that this would require a Phd, gene testing, and other anthropology to answer. The main link? The geography, and the memories of the world's first capital city, Uruk. The rest may just be dreams, but what dreams! Nations have been built on such things. Movements have been built on such things. "I have a dream."

 

[Tom 1]

Honestly, the region has been so invaded and exiled and reinvaded and exiled that this would require a Phd, gene testing, and other anthropology to answer. The main link? The geography, and the memories of the world's first capital city, Uruk. The rest may just be dreams, but what dreams! Nations have been built on such things. Movements have been built on such things. "I have a dream."

Yes it does seem like a good rallying point.

 

[Max Headroom]

While Islam prevails, they have no hope.

Maybe, and maybe not. Iran was once heading towards a liberal democracy but then the CIA messed them up. Now they're trying to find their way in the world again. I once wondered whether the old Persian empire might be relevant to build their dreams, but it is too parochial in an area with such a recent history of conflict (again a proxie war) between Iran and Iraq. But Sumer? While it probably had its own civil strife now and then, it seems so innocent and pristine from this tired old vantage point. It was the dawn of the world, and we had built our first capital city and developed writing for the first time. That's a vision to stir the heart!

 

[Tom 1]

Maybe, and maybe not. Iran was once heading towards a liberal democracy but then the CIA messed them up. Now they're trying to find their way in the world again. I once wondered whether the old Persian empire might be relevant to build their dreams, but it is too parochial in an area with such a recent history of conflict (again a proxie war) between Iran and Iraq. But Sumer? While it probably had its own civil strife now and then, it seems so innocent and pristine from this tired old vantage point. It was the dawn of the world, and we had built our first capital city and developed writing for the first time. That's a vision to stir the heart!

Fighting between city states became a regular feature of life in Sumeria once there were more than a few and competition for resources became and issue, unfortunately. Not that it wasn't a remarkable civilisation, but it was a human one and we tend to repeat the same things wherever people settle in one area.

 

[Quid est Veritas?]

The modern Middle East has precious little to do with Sumeria, so it would just be imposing another foreign name. There is strong opposition from religious groups to celebrate 'times of unbelief'. Besides, one possible derivation of Iraq is from Uruk (similarly biblical Erech), so they are already possibly named from old Sumerian times.

Saddam Hussein already tried this, by celebrating Babylon. This is not akin to Italians celebrating Rome or modern Greeks the Ancient Greeks. There is a complete cultural break here, via first Persification, then Hellenisation, before final Arabisation. In the process, Sumerian and Akkadian language and Cuneiform, along with most of the culture, was lost. To try and encourage this, is to make tenuous or non-existent connections, which if anything, reminds me of the Aryan-German connection or those madcap Maya/Atlantis ones. They should rather celebrate the authentic flowering of Abbasids, when Algebra and Medicine, Philosophy and Astronomy were encouraged - and before under the later Ilkhans and Timur, Islam again took up the sword in earnest (although a lot of that took place in Transoxiana, at least it is in the definite cultural sphere). Look at how gentlemanly Saladin was, that even Dante placed him in Limbo.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Maybe, and maybe not. Iran was once heading towards a liberal democracy but then the CIA messed them up. Now they're trying to find their way in the world again. I once wondered whether the old Persian empire might be relevant to build their dreams, but it is too parochial in an area with such a recent history of conflict (again a proxie war) between Iran and Iraq. But Sumer? While it probably had its own civil strife now and then, it seems so innocent and pristine from this tired old vantage point. It was the dawn of the world, and we had built our first capital city and developed writing for the first time. That's a vision to stir the heart!

Not so innocent and pristine.

https://sites.psu.edu/ancientmesopotamianwarfare/slavery
Slavery


In ancient Sumer, kings would send bands of men out to plunder neighboring city-states in the hill country in order to acquire slaves (Moorey). In order to justify the acquisition of slaves, these kings would claim that their gods had given them victory over an inferior people. Slavery was a huge part of civilization and how the ancient near east lived (Moorey). They depended on slaves to build their empires. Deportees were chosen for their abilities and were sent away where they could make the most of their talents. Not everyone in the conquered population was chosen for deportation and families were surely separated. The supply of war captives and native born slaves at times were not sufficient enough to satisfy the demand for help in agriculture, industry, and in the households of the wealthy. Therefore, the need for importing slaves from the neighboring countries was vital to the growth of powerful city-states. Importing and exporting slaves played an important role in the country’s economy, this could be a large portion of ones income and slaves were surely not cheap. Slaves were imported and exported by private merchants who dealt in various commodities. Strictly speaking, there were no slave merchants in the Ancient Near East or a single person just buying and selling slaves.

 

[Quid est Veritas?]

Not so innocent and pristine.
Slavery


In ancient Sumer, kings would send bands of men out to plunder neighboring city-states in the hill country in order to acquire slaves (Moorey). In order to justify the acquisition of slaves, these kings would claim that their gods had given them victory over an inferior people. Slavery was a huge part of civilization and how the ancient near east lived (Moorey). They depended on slaves to build their empires. Deportees were chosen for their abilities and were sent away where they could make the most of their talents. Not everyone in the conquered population was chosen for deportation and families were surely separated. The supply of war captives and native born slaves at times were not sufficient enough to satisfy the demand for help in agriculture, industry, and in the households of the wealthy. Therefore, the need for importing slaves from the neighboring countries was vital to the growth of powerful city-states. Importing and exporting slaves played an important role in the country’s economy, this could be a large portion of ones income and slaves were surely not cheap. Slaves were imported and exported by private merchants who dealt in various commodities. Strictly speaking, there were no slave merchants in the Ancient Near East or a single person just buying and selling slaves.

Did anyone mention their Human Sacrifice yet? The Death Pits of Ur.

One really cannot idealise any period. Humans are always human, and therefore flawed.

 

[Tom 1]

In ancient Sumer, kings would send bands of men out to plunder neighboring city-states in the hill country in order to acquire slaves

I don't know where you got this but it's a bit basic. For one thing, the hill country was many leagues away to the North and East, in Edom for example. Neighboring city states, like Ur and Lagash, were on the same plain and 'sending out bands of men to plunder' doesn't describe the kind of conflict and counter-conflict that went on. It's worth noting also that slaves in Sumerian cities had a greater range of rights and protections under the law than slaves have had in modern times.

 

[grasping the after wind]

I don't know where you got this but it's a bit basic. For one thing, the hill country was many leagues away to the North and East, in Edom for example. Neighboring city states, like Ur and Lagash, were on the same plain and 'sending out bands of men to plunder' doesn't describe the kind of conflict and counter-conflict that went on. It's worth noting also that slaves in Sumerian cities had a greater range of rights and protections under the law than slaves have had in modern times.

Does that make the slave owners innocent and pristine?

 

[Tom 1]

Does that make the slave owners innocent and pristine?

Meaning what?

 

[grasping the after wind]

Meaning what?

It was a question. It did not have any hidden meaning.
Let us follow the line of discussion

While it probably had its own civil strife now and then, it seems so innocent and pristine from this tired old vantage point. It was the dawn of the world, and we had built our first capital city and developed writing for the first time. That's a vision to stir the heart!

Not so innocent and pristine.

After which I quoted an article on Slavery in Sumeria

It's worth noting also that slaves in Sumerian cities had a greater range of rights and protections under the law than slaves have had in modern times.

Does that make the slave owners innocent and pristine?

Does that make it easier to answer my question?

 

[Max Headroom]

Hi guys,
I sometimes indulge in a little hyperbolic prose. Please, when I said "innocent and pristine" I was more influenced by my environmentalism than my sociology or anthropology. (The modern world's enormous environmental toll weighs heavily on me.)
I guess by "innocent" I meant new. The people involved running Uruk built a city with a scale and sophistication that had not been seen before. I was hoping that invoking the term Sumer would invoke pride in the core claim to the very first large scale city-state and writing - basic claims about basic things that any superpower today would love to own. But they don't. The divided Middle East owns this, sprawling across the lower reaches of Iraq into Kuwait.

 

[Tom 1]

It was a question. It did not have any hidden meaning.
Let us follow the line of discussion





After which I quoted an article on Slavery in Sumeria





Does that make it easier to answer my question?

Again, meaning what - people in Sumeria were either ‘clean and pristine’ (?) or they were, well, what?

 

[Max Headroom]

Again, meaning what - people in Sumeria were either ‘clean and pristine’ (?) or they were, well, what?

I'm the one who said it.
Grill me.
I explained it in the previous post.

 

[Tom 1]

I'm the one who said it.
Grill me.
I explained it in the previous post.

Aha yes, I didn’t recognise the quote.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Again, meaning what - people in Sumeria were either ‘clean and pristine’ (?) or they were, well, what?

They were said by the poster to be "innocent and pristine" but being slave owners they were neither.

Hi guys,
I sometimes indulge in a little hyperbolic prose. Please, when I said "innocent and pristine" I was more influenced by my environmentalism than my sociology or anthropology. (The modern world's enormous environmental toll weighs heavily on me.)
I guess by "innocent" I meant new. The people involved running Uruk built a city with a scale and sophistication that had not been seen before. I was hoping that invoking the term Sumer would invoke pride in the core claim to the very first large scale city-state and writing - basic claims about basic things that any superpower today would love to own. But they don't. The divided Middle East owns this, sprawling across the lower reaches of Iraq into Kuwait.

Sumer was most likely an environmental nightmare.
They lacked even the basics of modern waste management.

 

[Tom 1]

They were said by the poster to be "innocent and pristine" but being slave owners they were neither.

Yes, I didn't realise you were quoting the OP, I wasn't sure what you meant by that phrase.

Sumer was most likely an environmental nightmare.
They lacked even the basics of modern waste management.

I don't think it was that bad, comparative to its time no better or worse than any other city in it's own context.