Does the bible ever declare that being black is a curse from God??

[Rescued One]

"For behold, the Lord shall curse the land with much heat, and the barrenness thereof shall go forth forever; and there was a blackness came upon all the children of Canaan, that they were despised among all people"(Moses 7:8).

"And Enoch also beheld the residue of the people which were the sons of Adam; and they were a mixture of all the seed of Adam save it was the seed of Cain, for the seed of Cain were black, and had not place among them"(Moses 7:22).


"It was well understood by the early elders of the Church that the mark which was placed on Cain and which his posterity inherited was the black skin. The Book of Moses informs us that Cain and his descendants were black. Enoch taught the Gospel among all the people everywhere, except the people of Canaan. The people of Canaan lived before the flood, and were descendants of Cain."
Joseph Fielding Smith, The Way to Perfection, p. 107

3 Nephi 2:14-16 ". . . Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites . . . became exceedingly fair . . ."

 

[joneysd]

"For behold, the Lord shall curse the land with much heat, and the barrenness thereof shall go forth forever; and there was a blackness came upon all the children of Canaan, that they were despised among all people"(Moses 7:8).

"And Enoch also beheld the residue of the people which were the sons of Adam; and they were a mixture of all the seed of Adam save it was the seed of Cain, for the seed of Cain were black, and had not place among them"(Moses 7:22).


"It was well understood by the early elders of the Church that the mark which was placed on Cain and which his posterity inherited was the black skin. The Book of Moses informs us that Cain and his descendants were black. Enoch taught the Gospel among all the people everywhere, except the people of Canaan. The people of Canaan lived before the flood, and were descendants of Cain."
Joseph Fielding Smith, The Way to Perfection, p. 107

3 Nephi 2:14-16 ". . . Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites . . . became exceedingly fair . . ."

seems pretty clear.

 

[mmksparbud]

There were 8 people that lived through the flood--8. Which of those 8 were of the line of Cain??? And since God saved only the ones He felt loved Him, then each and everyone that was saved was ok in the sight of God.
why would God save from destruction in the flood, anyone that He felt had no place with Him????

 

[fatboys]

There were 8 people that lived through the flood--8. Which of those 8 were of the line of Cain??? And since God saved only the ones He felt loved Him, then each and everyone that was saved was ok in the sight of God.
why would God save from destruction in the flood, anyone that He felt had no place with Him????

Ham's wife. Cain was not banned from the priesthood. The posterity of Ham was.

 

[Rescued One]

Ham's wife. Cain was not banned from the priesthood. The posterity of Ham was.

The point is that Mormon scripture and non-scripture contains racist statements: "...the seed of Cain were black, and had not place among them."

If the seed of Cain were black and had not place among them and the "Gospel" wasn't taught to them, they couldn't possibly be ordained to the priesthood.

"Enoch taught the Gospel among all the people everywhere, except the people of Canaan. "
Joseph Fielding Smith

"For behold, the Lord shall curse the land with much heat, and the barrenness thereof shall go forth forever; and there was a blackness came upon all the children of Canaan, that they were despised among all people"(Moses 7:8).

"And Enoch also beheld the residue of the people which were the sons of Adam; and they were a mixture of all the seed of Adam save it was the seed of Cain, for the seed of Cain were black, and had not place among them"(Moses 7:22).

"It was well understood by the early elders of the Church that the mark which was placed on Cain and which his posterity inherited was the black skin. The Book of Moses informs us that Cain and his descendants were black. Enoch taught the Gospel among all the people everywhere, except the people of Canaan. The people of Canaan lived before the flood, and were descendants of Cain."
Joseph Fielding Smith, The Way to Perfection, p. 107

 

[korvus]

One of the thing's I'm still wondering is what makes being Black so Evil/Ugly/Unworthy?

 

[Rescued One]

One of the thing's I'm still wondering is what makes being Black so Evil/Ugly/Unworthy?

Black isn't! Neither is red hair, but some people have it.

According to Mormonism, God gave dark skin as a curse.

3 Nephi 2:14-16 ". . . Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites . . . became exceedingly fair . . ."

 

[mmksparbud]

Why would it be Ham's wife? Why wouldn't it have been Ham himself that was black?? There is no mention of color in the bible. There were many things said about who would be a priest--nothing is said about they couldn't be black. A priest was of the Levite tribe. They could have married a black woman or a black man, and the offspring would still be able to be priests. They had to have no blemish, or deformaty--black skin is not a blemish. There have been black priests for years--and still are in Ethiopia, there are black Jews. Nothing in the bible even hints at Cains mark being black.
And the OP asked was --Does the BIBLE ever declare that being black is a curse from God??---it does not.

 

[Rescued One]

Why would it be Ham's wife? Why wouldn't it have been Ham himself that was black?? There is no mention of color in the bible. There were many things said about who would be a priest--nothing is said about they couldn't be black. A priest was of the Levite tribe. They could have married a black woman or a black man, and the offspring would still be able to be priests. They had to have no blemish, or deformaty--black skin is not a blemish. There have been black priests for years--and still are in Ethiopia, there are black Jews. Nothing in the bible even hints at Cains mark being black.
And the OP asked was --Does the BIBLE ever declare that being black is a curse from God??---it does not.

There is mention of color in the Bible, but not in a negative way:

Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots?

That's in Jeremiah.

 

[mmksparbud]

There is mention of color in the Bible, but not in a negative way:

Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots?

That's in Jeremiah.

Yah--I know that one--There is no mention of color before or after the flood--not until we get to Moses having married an Ethiopian woman. It is mentioned in Song of Solomon and the Ethiopian Eunuch as one of the earliest Christians. Nothing is ever mentioned as being a curse from God.

 

[fatboys]

Look you can not judge people for what they say is racist. I can make a remark and it can sound racist to someone else. I have to deal with this everyday. And believe me kids can find anything comment as sexual or racist. The intent of the statements was not to be racist. It was not a racist remark at the time they said it, but because everything now days has to be politically correct, we limited ourselves. People said things at that time that was just common language. Of course people can take any word and make it offensive. LDS are not racist. Were their racist, and are there still racists? Of course, but the Leaders of the church loved and respected people from all walks of life and race. It is unfair and bigoted to force this to be a race issue.

 

[joneysd]

Look you can not judge people for what they say is racist. I can make a remark and it can sound racist to someone else. I have to deal with this everyday. And believe me kids can find anything comment as sexual or racist. The intent of the statements was not to be racist. It was not a racist remark at the time they said it, but because everything now days has to be politically correct, we limited ourselves. People said things at that time that was just common language. Of course people can take any word and make it offensive. LDS are not racist. Were their racist, and are there still racists? Of course, but the Leaders of the church loved and respected people from all walks of life and race. It is unfair and bigoted to force this to be a race issue.

it's not that simple is it, when the comments are about your colour being a curse, statements about neg.. and the priesthood was withheld from black people, that is not perception of racism, that is racism.

 

[korvus]

Black isn't! Neither is red hair, but some people have it.

According to Mormonism, God gave dark skin as a curse.

3 Nephi 2:14-16 ". . . Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites . . . became exceedingly fair . . ."

But wat makes black so 'cursed'?

 

[RevelationTestament]

But wat makes black so 'cursed'?

It's not. It's scripture-speak for darkness/sin/error while white is scripture speak for pure, clean, etc. Anyone can be black or white. Negroes can be white - anyone who cleans themselves in the blood of the lamb. The BOM says the Nephites became darker than the Lamanites. Well they weren't talking about their skin color. A skin of blackness is scripture-speak for being rejected as sinful or dirty.

The Bible does it too.
The virgin building of the temple.
Song 1:1 The song of songs, which is Solomon's.
Song 1:2 Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth: for thy love is better than wine.
Song 1:3 Because of the savour of thy good ointments thy name is as ointment poured forth, therefore do the virgins love thee.
Song 1:4 Draw me, we will run after thee: the king hath brought me into his chambers: we will be glad and rejoice in thee, we will remember thy love more than wine: the upright love thee.
Song 1:5 I am black, but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, as the tents of Kedar, as the curtains of Solomon.
Song 1:6 Look not upon me, because I am black, because the sun hath looked upon me: my mother's children were angry with me; they made me the keeper of the vineyards; but mine own vineyard have I not kept.

Jer 8:19 Behold the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people because of them that dwell in a far country: Is not יהוה in Zion? is not her king in her? Why have they provoked me to anger with their graven images, and with strange vanities?
Jer 8:20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.
Jer 8:21 For the hurt of the daughter of my people am I hurt; I am black; astonishment hath taken hold on me.

Is this talking about skin color, despair or sin? The church is black compared to the righteousness of the sun. Malachi 4:2

So here is the one of the main verses in question in the BoM
2 Nephi 5:21 And he had caused the cursing to come upon them[Nephites], yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be centicing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.
22 And thus saith the Lord God: I will cause that they shall be loathsome unto thy people, save they shall repent of their iniquities.
To those who still insist that the BoM is prejudiced against the Lamanites, see what it says about the Nephites:
Mormon 5:15 Later it says they would become dark, filthy and loathesome even beyond that of the Lamanites because of unbelief and idolatry.
Again, not a reference to skin color, but of purity.

Lam 5:10 Our skin was black like an oven because of the terrible famine.
Lam 5:11 They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah.
Lam 5:12 Princes are hanged up by their hand: the faces of elders were not honoured.
Lam 5:13 They took the young men to grind, and the children fell under the wood.
Lam 5:14 The elders have ceased from the gate, the young men from their musick.
Lam 5:15 The joy of our heart is ceased; our dance is turned into mourning.
Lam 5:16 The crown is fallen from our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned!

Dan 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
Lam 4:6 For the punishment of the iniquity of the daughter of my people is greater than the punishment of the sin of Sodom, that was overthrown as in a moment, and no hands stayed on her.
Lam 4:7 Her Nazarites were purer than snow, they were whiter than milk, they were more ruddy in body than rubies, their polishing was of sapphire:
Lam 4:8 Their[daughter] visage is blacker than a coal; they are not known in the streets: their skin cleaveth to their bones; it is withered, it is become like a stick.

 

[zeke37]

was Ruth white?
nope.

is she part of Christ's genealogy?
yep

is she directly related by blood, to David, and therefore to Christ?
yep.

what does that tell ya about this whole line of thought???
yep!...completely nutz.

 

[zeke37]

Ham had sexual relations with his mother (see Lev18)
it is the "son" of that relationship that Noah cursed.
neither the mother (Noah's wife) or the father (Ham) of Canaan (the incest conceived child) were cursed by NOAH

24 And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.
25 And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.
26 And he said, Blessed be the Lord God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.
27 God shall enlarge Japheth, and he shall dwell in the tents of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant.

 

[Rescued One]

Look you can not judge people for what they say is racist. I can make a remark and it can sound racist to someone else. I have to deal with this everyday. And believe me kids can find anything comment as sexual or racist. The intent of the statements was not to be racist. It was not a racist remark at the time they said it, but because everything now days has to be politically correct, we limited ourselves. People said things at that time that was just common language. Of course people can take any word and make it offensive. LDS are not racist. Were their racist, and are there still racists? Of course, but the Leaders of the church loved and respected people from all walks of life and race. It is unfair and bigoted to force this to be a race issue.

Mormonism teaches that God is racist!!!

 

[Rescued One]

It's not. It's scripture-speak for darkness/sin/error while white is scripture speak for pure, clean, etc. Anyone can be black or white. Negroes can be white - anyone who cleans themselves in the blood of the lamb. The BOM says the Nephites became darker than the Lamanites. Well they weren't talking about their skin color. A skin of blackness is scripture-speak for being rejected as sinful or dirty.

The Bible does it too.
The virgin building of the temple.
Song 1:1 The song of songs, which is Solomon's.
Song 1:2 Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth: for thy love is better than wine.
Song 1:3 Because of the savour of thy good ointments thy name is as ointment poured forth, therefore do the virgins love thee.
Song 1:4 Draw me, we will run after thee: the king hath brought me into his chambers: we will be glad and rejoice in thee, we will remember thy love more than wine: the upright love thee.
Song 1:5 I am black, but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, as the tents of Kedar, as the curtains of Solomon.
Song 1:6 Look not upon me, because I am black, because the sun hath looked upon me: my mother's children were angry with me; they made me the keeper of the vineyards; but mine own vineyard have I not kept.

Jer 8:19 Behold the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people because of them that dwell in a far country: Is not יהוה in Zion? is not her king in her? Why have they provoked me to anger with their graven images, and with strange vanities?
Jer 8:20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.
Jer 8:21 For the hurt of the daughter of my people am I hurt; I am black; astonishment hath taken hold on me.

Is this talking about skin color, despair or sin? The church is black compared to the righteousness of the sun. Malachi 4:2

So here is the one of the main verses in question in the BoM
2 Nephi 5:21 And he had caused the cursing to come upon them[Nephites], yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be centicing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.
22 And thus saith the Lord God: I will cause that they shall be loathsome unto thy people, save they shall repent of their iniquities.
To those who still insist that the BoM is prejudiced against the Lamanites, see what it says about the Nephites:
Mormon 5:15 Later it says they would become dark, filthy and loathesome even beyond that of the Lamanites because of unbelief and idolatry.
Again, not a reference to skin color, but of purity.

Lam 5:10 Our skin was black like an oven because of the terrible famine.
Lam 5:11 They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah.
Lam 5:12 Princes are hanged up by their hand: the faces of elders were not honoured.
Lam 5:13 They took the young men to grind, and the children fell under the wood.
Lam 5:14 The elders have ceased from the gate, the young men from their musick.
Lam 5:15 The joy of our heart is ceased; our dance is turned into mourning.
Lam 5:16 The crown is fallen from our head: woe unto us, that we have sinned!

Dan 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
Lam 4:6 For the punishment of the iniquity of the daughter of my people is greater than the punishment of the sin of Sodom, that was overthrown as in a moment, and no hands stayed on her.
Lam 4:7 Her Nazarites were purer than snow, they were whiter than milk, they were more ruddy in body than rubies, their polishing was of sapphire:
Lam 4:8 Their[daughter] visage is blacker than a coal; they are not known in the streets: their skin cleaveth to their bones; it is withered, it is become like a stick.

It is Mormonism that teaches dark skin is a curse from God.

 

[Ran77]

Mormonism teaches that God is racist!!!

That is false.

Our critics teach that. You seem to be getting the sides wrong on this.

 

[joneysd]

That is false.

Our critics teach that. You seem to be getting the sides wrong on this.

I think the evidence points to the fact that the LDS make God racist.