Do you believe in Creationism or Evolutionism?

[Job 33:6]

Second, Scripture is very clear that Adam and Eve were the first people. Genesis 10 records the table of nations. In that table there is no mention of hominids or ape men or pre-adamites.

If this is what you believe, then quite simply, you're left with an internally contradictory position as a young earth creationist.

Ignoring one part of scripture and grasping at another is not a solution, that's just cognitive dissonance.

Until you can actually address the scripture, as noted in details of my prior posts, you're left with a broken position.

The scripture I've laid out is as clear as day, and your YEC position contradicts the scripture. And that's all there is to it.

Here is a fine article on the topic:
First Human or First King? The Introduction of Adam in the Eden Narrative - Articles

And I'll just emphasize the prior point, ignoring one part of scripture and grasping at another is not a solution. Grasping at non canonical books such as the book of jubilee, or grasping at Paul's writings (which focus on the resurrection and actually have little to do with Genesis) is not a solution. That's just YEC cognitive dissonance. And as a Christian who also happens to be a professional geologist, I disagree that geology supports a young earth.

 

[Ragdoll]

If this is what you believe, then quite simply, you're left with an internally contradictory position as a young earth creationist.

Ignoring one part of scripture and grasping at another is not a solution, that's just cognitive dissonance.

Until you can actually address the scripture, as noted in details of my prior posts, you're left with a broken position.

The scripture I've laid out is as clear as day, and your YEC position contradicts the scripture. And that's all there is to it.

Here is a fine article on the topic:
First Human or First King? The Introduction of Adam in the Eden Narrative - Articles

Even Jewish tradition says Cain married his sister. One source, Jubilees, says Cain's wife was named Awan.

Scripture interprets Scripture. Scripture is very clear about Adam being the very first created human. Both Jewish and Christian tradition also affirm this. So modern positions are nothing more than Darwinist positions which the early church would not accept. I personally see no reason why I should trust Darwinist theology over orthodox theology. Scriptures says Adam is the first man created and tradition also says this. To me that's a done issue. No more debate. Done.

 

[Ragdoll]

No, the Bib Bang is what spit out the Earth. "Let there be light" BOOM! There was light, a million million stars sent through the cosmos.

You gotta deviate from Scripture to hold this erroneous position. To be fair, I also used to believe the big bang happened in v.3. But after a serious study on Genesis chapter 1, with strong focus on the first 2 days of creation, I realized my position was false. I studied ancient exegesis and knew I had no grounds to believe a big bang in v.3. After over a year of research, studying both Scripture and traditional exegesis, I came to the conclusion that the light God created was the earth's core. Here is an outline of Day 1.

Gen.1:1 - God creates the universe and the earth in it's most fetal stage.
Gen.1:2 - God now looks upon the earth and moves over it. He is about to create something for the earth.
Gen.1:3 - God creates the earth's core
Job 38:14 - the earth begins to take shape like clay to the seal.
Gen.1:4-5 - The day-night cycle begins (but doesn't see fruition until Day 4).

Day 4 - God creates the stars, sun and moon.

In big bang philosophy, the stars come immediately. The sun comes before the earth. But the Genesis account does not place the sun before the earth and be glad it's written this way. This is because the sun before the earth leads to an earth that cannot ever be habitable - and God created the earth to be inhabited. In early earth evolution, the earth does have a strong magnetic field until 500-million years ago. They say early forms of life began to evolve in the water. But this is a scientific impossibility. Without a strong magnetic field no life can exist on earth - not even water! So anything evolutionists could possibility get wrong they got wrong. God creates the earth's core and magnetosphere before creating the sun. That's God's order in creating habitable planetary systems. Since no scientist on earth has ever created a planetary system, I see no reason why I should believe that man somehow has more knowledge in creating planets than God. Therefore, I will trust the Genesis account over some deranged evolutionist myth that he borrowed from ancient pagans.

 

[Ragdoll]

If this is what you believe, then quite simply, you're left with an internally contradictory position as a young earth creationist.

Ignoring one part of scripture and grasping at another is not a solution, that's just cognitive dissonance.

Until you can actually address the scripture, as noted in details of my prior posts, you're left with a broken position.

The scripture I've laid out is as clear as day, and your YEC position contradicts the scripture. And that's all there is to it.

Here is a fine article on the topic:
First Human or First King? The Introduction of Adam in the Eden Narrative - Articles

I do not approve of this translation at all, but since you seem to like it, I post solely from the LEB.


1 Corinthians 15:45, LEB

"Thus also it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living soul”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit."


1 Timothy 2:13, LEB

"For Adam was formed first, then Eve,"


Romans 5:14, LEB

"But death reigned from Adam until Moses even over those who did not sin in the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of the one who is to come."

Romans 5:12, LEB (with subtitle)

Death Came through Adam but Life Comes through Christ

"Because of this, just as sin entered into the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death spread to all people because all sinned."

There is no death before Adam. This places OEC in a very hard place since they have to disagree with such a fundamental doctrine just to justify a modern myth. Its so much easier to just trust God at His word. There are literally no verses that mention pre-Adamites. There are no verses that mention how our origin came from evolution. The 5th word in Genesis is "created." That should settle the matter.

As for Genesis 6--9, the Flood, that has been proven in geology. Here is an outline of scientific proof for the Flood.

1 - several ancient works of antiquity confirm it.
2 - the fossils are found in sedimentary rock, just as we would expect to find fossil if there was a global Flood.
3 - There are marine fossils at the peaks of every mountain in the world - again, in sedimentary rock. This includes Mt.Everest. There are even numerous whale fossils up in the Andes mountains. How did they get there? The Flood!

So we have ancient witnesses plus modern geology proving that a global Flood did indeed happen. There is no excuse for those who reject the Flood. There is no scientific counter-argument that can refute the geological proof for the Flood either.

 

[FredVB]

I do not see how to believe everything, in the world and all else, came to be in any way other than God's direct creation. There are different ways God might do it. But why would it be very different than what was revealed as God's way, and why other than without suffering of any to start with?

 

[Job 33:6]

I do not see how to believe everything, in the world and all else, came to be in any way other than God's direct creation. There are different ways God might do it. But why would it be very different than what was revealed as God's way, and why other than without suffering of any to start with?

The Bible doesn't say that there was no suffering before the fall.

 

[eleos1954]

The Bible doesn't say that there was no suffering before the fall.

God is good ... suffering is NOT good ... not created by God. The world God created was VERY GOOD (that would not include suffering or death)

The Bible teaches that sin is the root cause of suffering and death, separating humanity from God. Romans 5:12 states that sin entered the world through one man (Adam), and death through sin, with death then spreading to all humanity. Romans 6:23 further emphasizes this by saying "the wages of sin is death".

Before Adam there was no sin in the world therefore no death.

 

[eleos1954]

I do not see how to believe everything, in the world and all else, came to be in any way other than God's direct creation. There are different ways God might do it. But why would it be very different than what was revealed as God's way, and why other than without suffering of any to start with?

In simple terms ... one either sees design or happen chance. If it's design .... there was a designer ... if not then it's theorized how things "could have happened". God is good ... In the beginning He created everything VERY GOOD (that does not include suffering and death).

 

[trophy33]

God is good ... suffering is NOT good ... not created by God. The world God created was VERY GOOD (that would not include suffering or death)

Dear brothers and sisters, when troubles of any kind come your way, consider it an opportunity for great joy. For you know that when your faith is tested, your endurance has a chance to grow.
Jm 1:2

And we know that God causes everything to work together for the good of those who love God and are called according to his purpose for them.
R 8:28

But he said to me, 'My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.' Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong.
2 Cor 12:9

We can rejoice, too, when we run into problems and trials, for we know that they help us develop endurance. And endurance develops strength of character
R 5:23

 

[jmldn2]

I believe God created everything. Everything. As for evolution, I believe each species God created could evolve over time. I do not care about the mechanics, technology of any of it. By faith I believe God Almighty is Maker of heaven and earth. Period

 

[PrincetonGuy]

God is good ... suffering is NOT good ... not created by God. The world God created was VERY GOOD (that would not include suffering or death)

The Bible teaches that sin is the root cause of suffering and death, separating humanity from God. Romans 5:12 states that sin entered the world through one man (Adam), and death through sin, with death then spreading to all humanity. Romans 6:23 further emphasizes this by saying "the wages of sin is death".

Before Adam there was no sin in the world therefore no death.

This post assumes without any solid Biblical or scientific support that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historic events even though at least as early as the 2nd century Christians realized and wrote that such a concept was in direct conflict with what they could see with their eyes and touch with their hands. Indeed, the interpretation that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historic events comes to us from a book written by Henry M. Morris and John C. Whitcomb that was published in 1961, The Genesis Flood: The Biblical Record and its Scientific Implications—an emotional reaction to the Christian classic by Bernard Ramm, The Christian View of Science and Scripture, that was published in 1954.

Henry M. Morris never completed even so much as one college-level course in biology or any college-level courses in any way related to the concept of a worldwide flood. John C. Whitcomb was almost as ignorant as Morris. Nonetheless, millions of Christians were so hungry for what they wanted to be true that they purchased and devoured this book without ever bothering to seriously question the validity of it.

Because of the uniqueness of Genesis 1-11, it is studied today as a distinct body of literature by Christian and Jewish scholars giving us entire volumes on Genesis 1-11 by such men as the ultra-conservative Baptist scholar Kenneth A. Matthews (644 pages) in 2022, the renown Old Testament scholars Claus Westermann (648 pages) in 1974 (German) and 1984 (English), and Ronald S. Hendel (466 pages) in 2024.

 

[Job 33:6]

This post assumes without any solid Biblical or scientific support that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historic events even though at least as early as the 2nd century Christians realized and wrote that such a concept was in direct conflict with what they could see with their eyes and touch with their hands. Indeed, the interpretation that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historic events comes to us from a book written by Henry M. Morris and John C. Whitcomb that was published in 1961, The Genesis Flood: The Biblical Record and its Scientific Implications—an emotional reaction to the Christian classic by Bernard Ramm, The Christian View of Science and Scripture, that was published in 1954.

Henry M. Morris never completed even so much as one college-level course in biology or any college-level courses in any way related to the concept of a worldwide flood. John C. Whitcomb was almost as ignorant as Morris. Nonetheless, millions of Christians were so hungry for what they wanted to be true that they purchased and devoured this book without ever bothering to seriously question the validity of it.

Because of the uniqueness of Genesis 1-11, it is studied today as a distinct body of literature by Christian and Jewish scholars giving us entire volumes on Genesis 1-11 by such men as the ultra-conservative Baptist scholar Kenneth A. Matthews (644 pages) in 2022, the renown Old Testament scholars Claus Westermann (648 pages) in 1974 (German) and 1984 (English), and Ronald S. Hendel (466 pages) in 2024.

That's creationism 101. Sell books now, ask for forgiveness later. All the while they're laughing their way to the bank in the end.