Discussion: Prophetic Seers?

[Heart2Soul]

Oscarr you have given a lot of advice and teaching on something you said yourself (to me that is) that you have no knowledge of. I am concerned that you teach on something that has a lot of "meat" to it without the knowledge of it. Are you so certain that you are teaching God's Word effectively on this matter?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Oscarr you have given a lot of advice and teaching on something you said yourself (to me that is) that you have no knowledge of. I am concerned that you teach on something that has a lot of "meat" to it without the knowledge of it. Are you so certain that you are teaching God's Word effectively on this matter?

I was well-discipled over three years by an old-school, strict Pentecostal pastor who had extensive experience in the ministry of the Holy Spirit. I have also been involved, since 1999, in a prophetic ministry, founded by his son-in-law, who was also discipled by him over more years than I was. Those two men would not have been comfortable with any ministry that called itself a "seer", even though both, the pastor (before he passed away), and his son-in-law (who is still in his international prophetic ministry) have extensive experience in prophecy and the Word of Knowledge. What I have yet to learn is how the modern "seer" ministry aligns itself with the New Testament.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I was well-discipled over three years by an old-school, strict Pentecostal pastor who had extensive experience in the ministry of the Holy Spirit. I have also been involved, since 1999, in a prophetic ministry, founded by his son-in-law, who was also discipled by him over more years than I was. Those two men would not have been comfortable with any ministry that called itself a "seer", even though both, the pastor (before he passed away), and his son-in-law (who is still in his international prophetic ministry) have extensive experience in prophecy and the Word of Knowledge. What I have yet to learn is how the modern "seer" ministry aligns itself with the New Testament.

I invite you to research it in depth, from well known teachers of the Prophet....Prophet and Prophet Seer only differs in how they communicate...one hears another sees (as in visions)....other than that they operate the same....to minister (in love) whatever God is speaking (and whatever God is speaking it is to lead or direct towards salvation, towards Jesus, towards the Word of Truth)......I already shared this with you awhile back.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Have you persecuted a prophet today?
Have you persecuted a prophet today?
Perhaps this article can help...if you are willing to read it...

 

[Heart2Soul]

I was well-discipled over three years by an old-school, strict Pentecostal pastor who had extensive experience in the ministry of the Holy Spirit. I have also been involved, since 1999, in a prophetic ministry, founded by his son-in-law, who was also discipled by him over more years than I was. Those two men would not have been comfortable with any ministry that called itself a "seer", even though both, the pastor (before he passed away), and his son-in-law (who is still in his international prophetic ministry) have extensive experience in prophecy and the Word of Knowledge. What I have yet to learn is how the modern "seer" ministry aligns itself with the New Testament.

Well here is another concept....how about replacing the word Prophet and say "messenger". You have been involved since 1999 in a prophetic ministry.....I have been walking in it since 1984. Give me the names of these pastors (or the ministry)...I would like to look at their teaching as well. Maybe there is something I can be taught.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Well here is another concept....how about replacing the word Prophet and say "messenger". You have been involved since 1999 in a prophetic ministry.....I have been walking in it since 1984. Give me the names of these pastors (or the ministry)...I would like to look at their teaching as well. Maybe there is something I can be taught.

Go on to Youtube and put "Rodney W Francis" into the search. You will see a number of his Prophetic School teaching videos.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Have you persecuted a prophet today?
Have you persecuted a prophet today?
Perhaps this article can help...if you are willing to read it...

I am aware that you have a personal stake in this, hence your reaction. No one likes their ministry being questioned, but if you feel that you are being persecuted when people ask reasonable questions about the ministry, then that brings up more questions. Any ministry should be open to examination and evaluation. No ministry is perfect because we have the treasure in earthen vessels and reasonable questioning confirms the strong points and exposes the flaws.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I am aware that you have a personal stake in this, hence your reaction. No one likes their ministry being questioned, but if you feel that you are being persecuted when people ask reasonable questions about the ministry, then that brings up more questions. Any ministry should be open to examination and evaluation. No ministry is perfect because we have the treasure in earthen vessels and reasonable questioning confirms the strong points and exposes the flaws.

Did you read this article? I am trying my best to open up your understanding of it. I have not prophesied to anyone other than our mutual friend Hidden in Him and it is something between him and God....I will not prophesy on this forum....so I am not personally feeling persecuted....I only feel the ministry is and for that I am truly saddened. I would like to see people research on their own and seek Wisdom in this area. For the young lady who felt attacked....I never prophesied to her...and her report was very biased. I did present scripture and ask questions, very much like I do you. But you do tend to open threads that are specifically related to the spiritual gifts, prophets and so forth. Some of what you say is sound advice, other things you say are like ???? and creates confusion. I basically quit interacting on your threads because it doesn't serve any purpose and only creates strife....you speak of a spirit of divination when often your threads create a great deal of debate and divination. I am not attacking you, I am humbly suggesting that you research more of what you advise others on the Prophets. I went and read the article by Rodney W. Francis Jonah the Prophet of Knowledge...it was a good article...he does not negate NT prophets in this article...here is a part of it...
Jonah ~ Prophet of Knowledge
amaic ♦ July 5, 2013 ♦ Leave a comment




By Rodney W. Francis

The Book of Jonah shows us something of God’s dealings with the man He chooses to accomplish His divine mission. It reveals how God prepares a man (or woman) to deliver a specific message to a specific people. We see how God can use such a man, change lives through such a man, even though it costs that man his reputation, all he has and is. We see the same principles shining out through the life of Jesus. Both Jonah and Jesus have been very misrepresented.

If we really desire to see a greater impact made on the world through God’s Word, then we must be willing to let God prepare us for what He wants done. As we study the lives of Jonah and Jesus we soon learn that there is “a price to pay” to be a real disciple of Jesus. How desirous are we of letting God prepare us for service like He did with those two great prophets? Only you can answer that question for your life – and only I can answer it for mine.

The next time someone calls you “a Jonah” – if it is the Jonah of the Bible, then count yourself honoured for such a high compliment. I trust your ministry is equally as powerful as his. And preachers, please preach Jonah for who he really was – a prophet of knowledge!

Here is the link: Jonah ~ Prophet of Knowledge

 

[Heart2Soul]

I am aware that you have a personal stake in this, hence your reaction.

I have no personal stake in this....I answer to my Father and the Holy Spirit. So not to worry, I am not trying to defend myself, I never came here to defend my calling or to prove it. It isn't about me...it is about Him and will always be about Him.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

If our mutual friend concurs with your prophetic word then I have no argument against that. I read the post from the other young lady and it seemed an overreaction from her, because you did ask her permission to share your word with her, and at the advice of her pastor she turned you down. She has the right to do that. I don't know what the pastor believes about the prophetic and felt that he was too quick in condemning your word when you hadn't even given it yet. You gave a word to me that I should not neglect my prophetic gift, and it made sense to me because I am wondering whether I should become more involved with a local prophetic ministry (Eagle Ascend Ministries here in Auckland. Len Buttner is the director of that ministry and he came to my church about three weeks ago and gave prophetic words over everyone there, quite something for my church! All of his prophetic words were bang on. At a previous men's breakfast he gave a word to one of the elders of my church, and he had never met him before, and the prophecy was so accurate it nearly blew me away! Len has been labelled a prophet, and I have no doubt about it. At an all day conference about three years ago, where he was one of the speakers, I asked him to impart the confidence to give prophetic words to people because I was to preach at that particular Presbyterian church at their next Sunday service. What happened was that I did give good prophetic words to several in that service and they were welcomed. I just needed to let you know that).
There are only two people whom I trust in the prophetic, Rodney is one, and Len is the other. They have proved to me over 10 years that their prophetic words are totally consistent with God's Word, and everyone who has been affected by their ministry has recognised their true prophetic gift.

Also, my old school, strict Pentecostal pastor who discipled me in the ministry of the Holy Spirit, in 1970, heard me give prophetic words and tongues interpretations in a weekend convention where he was ministering, and when we got home, he confirmed to me that my gift was genuine and that I should continue with it and not give it up. Coming from him, that was a badge of honour for me because I knew that he was a very strict man when it came to the prophetic.

At around 2000 I gave a written prophetic word to Pastor Hunt's son Ian concerning a mission that he was going to be involved in. Being the son of that very strict prophetic pastor, and knowing the true prophetic, he wrote back to me, telling me that my prophecy was totally accurate and that I had said things I could never have known. This was when I was invited to participate in Rodney's ministry when he had one-day prophetic workshops in Auckland. You should watch Rodney's Youtube videos when he teaches on the prophetic, because he has years of experience, can relate many remarkable prophetic events, and gives very sound teaching on the prophetic.

I am very discriminating concerning the prophetic. I don't believe every spirit at face value. I want to see that it either concurs with statements in Scripture or, if not, is in total harmony with Scripture. I have seen the damage caused by unsolicited personal prophecies, giving false guidance and false revealing of sin. This has given me the attitude that a person is guilty until proved innocent, or in other words. a personal prophecy is from the flesh unless proved to be from the Holy Spirit. When I have given personal prophecies it always has been in the form of an encouraging love letter from God.

I believe that it is better to ask searching questions and express doubts, than to accept every prophetic word at face value. This is in harmony with John's warning not to believe every spirit but test the spirits to see if they are from God.

I know that some heavily involved in the personal prophetic won't like my attitude, but there it is. If I can prevent one vulnerable person being led astray by a flesh prophecy, then my position is fully justified.

Many local Pentecostals didn't like Pastor Hunt's ministry and his strictness, but he adamantly maintained his position, and I have never experienced the intense presence of God in anyone else's ministry like I did with his on two occasions. Even some of the really big name ministries that came from Britain and the US did not achieve what Pastor Hunt did in his ministry. Yet, in the account of the Brownsville revival, where people broke down and wept under conviction and got saved or right with God, I saw the same Spirit that I experienced in Pastor Hunt's meetings. Strict holiness of life was stressed by the preachers at Brownsville, and this was identical to the strict holiness that Pastor Hunt preached.

So, raising questions about a prophetic ministry in order to ensure that it is of the Holy Spirit is not persecution, but Scriptural testing.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I have no personal stake in this....I answer to my Father and the Holy Spirit. So not to worry, I am not trying to defend myself, I never came here to defend my calling or to prove it. It isn't about me...it is about Him and will always be about Him.

Because that is so, then any test that can be applied to your prophetic ministry should show its genuineness.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Because that is so, then any test that can be applied to your prophetic ministry should show its genuineness.

His ministry is genuine, perfect in Love.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I believe that no matter what you are determined to bring criticism and judgment upon the prophetic ministry....I won't bother you again as it continues to profit nothing except create opportunities for more strife.
FYI- although you only trust 2 people in the prophetic ministry there are many, many out there who deliver God's message with signs and wonders following.

This didn't come out the way I wanted.....okay here's the deal....I get worked up and angry when I read stuff that is not true concerning Prophets and Prophetic Ministry...so rather than get angry and start spitting and spewing I am better off not watching those threads....so that's how it is with me....I hate striving with a fellow brother or sister in Christ.

 

[Heart2Soul]

You gave a word to me that I should not neglect my prophetic gift,

This was a word of wisdom....not a prophetic word. But I am glad that you are pursuing the idea of it. If God imparted that gift and calling upon you then you should be obedient to it. I pray that He does move you forward with it...and that many will be blessed because of it, Amen!