Did Yahshua and his Disciples Abstain from Meat?

[HARK!]

All the prophecies concerning the first coming were fulfilled and heaven and earth passing is referring to ages not the literal places.

So now you're saying that we can't take Yahshua at his word?

(CLV) Mt 24:35
Heaven and earth shall be passing by, yet My words may by no means be passing by.

This prophecy has NOT been fulfilled!

 

[HARK!]

Pot meet Mr. Kettle. You keep posting bible passages from the new testament with 'Yahweh' and Elohim' in them which are not found in the Greek.

At least they're in context.

 

[HARK!]

We no longer need sacrifices because the one sacrifice was made which abolished the old law. Not a small part, the whole thing. And Paul said if you go back to that law, you reject Christ.

Matthew 7:23

But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who work lawlessness.

 

[ewq1938]

This prophecy has NOT been fulfilled!

It has been fulfilled that is why the law was able to change.

Heb_7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

 

[Dkh587]

The old law was gone. Paul taught against serving that law. Please don't call Paul names.

Paul never taught that - stop slandering Paul. You make Paul out to be a flip-flopper, not me.

Paul delights in the law of Moses - do you follow his example? Do you delight in the law of God like he does?

 

[HARK!]

It has been fulfilled that is why the law was able to change.

Heb_7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

I already went over this with you in post #224: Did Yahshua and his Disciples Abstain from Meat?"

Why do you ignore scripture, and cherry pick, to twist the scripture to what you want it to say?

 

[ewq1938]

Paul never taught that

Paul says differently.

Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
Gal 4:22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Gal 4:23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Gal 4:27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
Gal 4:28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
Gal 4:30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
Gal 4:31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

 

[Dkh587]

Paul says differently.

Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
Gal 4:22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Gal 4:23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Gal 4:27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
Gal 4:28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
Gal 4:30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
Gal 4:31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

paul’s letter was written to the Galatians about a specific issue, not to you or me, and Paul was not teaching the Galatians to sin and disobey God’s law.

Do you delight in the law of God like Paul?

We don’t negate the law via faith, according to Paul, we uphold the law of God.

why aren’t you upholding the law of Moses? Why are you teaching disobedience to the law of God?

 

[HARK!]

paul’s letter was written to the Galatians about a specific issue, not to you or me, and Paul was not teaching the Galatians to sin and disobey God’s law.

Do you delight in the law of God like Paul?

We don’t negate the law via faith, according to Paul, we uphold the law of God.

why aren’t you upholding the law of Moses? Why are you teaching disobedience to the law of God?

Paul certainly wouldn't contradict Yahshua.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens.

 

[Dkh587]

Paul certainly wouldn't contradict Yahshua.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens.

And he(Paul) certainly wants people to be great in the kingdom. He’s not going to lead them to destruction by leading them to disobey God.

 

[HARK!]

And he(Paul) certainly wants people to be great in the kingdom. He’s not going to lead them to destruction by leading them to disobey God.

No doubt. It really annoys me when people paint Paul as a heretic.

 

[ewq1938]

why aren’t you upholding the law of Moses?

Because aren't supposed to. Paul taught to be free from it. To uphold it is to teach bondage and to return to the to the weak and beggarly elements.

Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
Gal 4:11 I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.
Gal 4:12 Brethren, I beseech you, be as I am; for I am as ye are: ye have not injured me at all.
Gal 4:13 Ye know how through infirmity of the flesh I preached the gospel unto you at the first.
Gal 4:14 And my temptation which was in my flesh ye despised not, nor rejected; but received me as an angel of God, even as Christ Jesus.
Gal 4:15 Where is then the blessedness ye spake of? for I bear you record, that, if it had been possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes, and have given them to me.
Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
Gal 4:17 They zealously affect you, but not well; yea, they would exclude you, that ye might affect them.
Gal 4:18 But it is good to be zealously affected always in a good thing, and not only when I am present with you.
Gal 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,
Gal 4:20 I desire to be present with you now, and to change my voice; for I stand in doubt of you.
Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
Gal 4:22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Gal 4:23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.


Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

You teach in contradiction to what Paul says about the old law.

 

[HARK!]

Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

(CLV) 2Pt 3:16
as also in all the epistles, speaking in them concerning these things, in which are some things hard to apprehend, which the unlearned and unstable are twisting, as the rest of the scriptures also, to their own destruction.

CLV) 1Jn 2:4
He who is saying that "I know Him" and is not keeping His precepts, is a liar, and the truth of God is not in this one.

 

[HARK!]

Because aren't supposed to. Paul taught to be free from it.

(CLV) 2Pt 3:16
as also in all the epistles, speaking in them concerning these things, in which are some things hard to apprehend, which the unlearned and unstable are twisting, as the rest of the scriptures also, to their own destruction.

The only support you seem to be able to find for the abolishment of the law, is in Paul's letters. Why do you ignore every other witness, including Yahshua, and YHWH himself?

 

[Dkh587]

Because aren't supposed to. Paul taught to be free from it. To uphold it is to teach bondage and to return to the to the weak and beggarly elements.

Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
Gal 4:11 I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.
Gal 4:12 Brethren, I beseech you, be as I am; for I am as ye are: ye have not injured me at all.
Gal 4:13 Ye know how through infirmity of the flesh I preached the gospel unto you at the first.
Gal 4:14 And my temptation which was in my flesh ye despised not, nor rejected; but received me as an angel of God, even as Christ Jesus.
Gal 4:15 Where is then the blessedness ye spake of? for I bear you record, that, if it had been possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes, and have given them to me.
Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
Gal 4:17 They zealously affect you, but not well; yea, they would exclude you, that ye might affect them.
Gal 4:18 But it is good to be zealously affected always in a good thing, and not only when I am present with you.
Gal 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,
Gal 4:20 I desire to be present with you now, and to change my voice; for I stand in doubt of you.
Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
Gal 4:22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Gal 4:23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.


Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

You teach in contradiction to what Paul says about the old law.

Paul teaches that faith upholds the law of God, which is also called the law of Moses. You are opposing Paul and not in line with his teachings if you do not uphold the law of God via faith.

Romans 3:31 ESV
Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

We no longer need sacrifices because the one sacrifice was made which abolished the old law. Not a small part, the whole thing. And Paul said if you go back to that law, you reject Christ.

I just said that. But no, not the whole thing. No Paul said if you go back to the law as your justification, you reject Him...if you love GOD, HOW do you show it...if you love your neighbor, HOW do you show it?? Do you murder him? Do you steal from him? Do you worship idols? Do you get my drift?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

This is not a fact at all. Jesus kept the old law perfectly and it was part of his purpose that he do so. One, to show us that it was in fact possible for a man to do that, but because also it couldn't be fulfilled until someone did keep it perfectly. To bring in the new covenant he had to fulfill that law perfectly. He did that.

YOU said He kept ALL the requirements...Yeshua was not a woman was He?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

This is not a good point to raise. To keep all the law is to keep all that applies to someone. The laws concerning woman don't have to be kept by men, and the same in reverse. It is highly disturbing that anyone believes in a Messiah that didn't and couldn't keep the law perfectly. I say that is not the true Messiah.

No, you said He kept ALL the requirements...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Which we know was not because he was trying to obey the Torah but to keep to what the Holy Spirit had directed him to do. He taught that the old law was abolished. You can't use this in an attempt to nullify his teaching on that. Shame on you for using the scriptures against themselves.

He was doing it to show he was not preaching against Torah. If Paul was against Torah, this would have been the perfect time to show it. But he didn't...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

All the prophecies concerning the first coming were fulfilled and heaven and earth passing is referring to ages not the literal places. This is why the law changed after the cross. That couldn't happen if what Christ said wasn't accomplished.

But all the prophesies were not fulfilled regarding His second coming. Heaven and earth are not "ages...