Did Abraham observe the Sabbath day?

[GDL]

I don't see how betting resolves this. You still have to decide who wins and that's not going to have any more of a resolution than this thread.
(BTW, for those who call gambling a sin, there is technically no scripture on that subject either. That doesn't make it a smart thing to do though.)

If you watch the video @tonychanyt linked, the wager is simply another step in determining the outcome of the method. Nothing nefarious.

 

[GDL]

That's exactly right and exactly the point. That's why I prefer to discuss specifics and not abstract or hypothetical things.

AI development is hypothetical?

 

[tonychanyt]

Agreed they don't use your gambling method.

What makes you think it is gambling?

 

[oikonomia]

Hi Oikonomia

Nice to meet you.

Hello. I will likely re-quote partially.

Paul is not contradicting himself or God.

I think you, rather, are not in agreement with the New Testament.
My experience is that this kind of disagreement with the New Testament has a symptom of voluminous references to the Old Testament.

No man is above God’s works Exo 32:16

Here's your first OT reference to nullify the NT, in Exodus.
The Pharisees preceded you and criticized Jesus' disciples for violating the Sabbath.
They were picking ears of corn to eat. And Jesus had to point the critics away from thier beloved law
and tell them - For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath. (Matt. 12:8)

Once God blesses something like God did with the weekly Sabbath Genesis 2:3 no man has authority to reverse Num 23:20 ,

Here are your second and third reaching for the OT to exalt the law keeping.
Colossians is the oracles of God after the speaking of Genesis and Numbers.

The principle of "Thus Says The Lord" is now superceded by the principle of incarnation.
The Triune God is working Himself into man. The Triune God is wroughting His life and nature into the fabric of His
new testament apostles and prophets. Paul is not an OT style prophet beginning His letters with "Thus Says The Lord . . . . thus and such"

Now the Christ filled man speaks and he even his opinion is the word of God.
Sometimes he volunteers to point out his God anointed speaking from a specific command of God.
But then Paul says " . . . according to my opinion; but I think that I also have the Spirit of God." (1 Cor. 7:40b)

Colossians, Galatians, Ephesians, . . . have no "Thus Says the Lord" Old Testament dictaphone style utterances.
Do you dare hint that these books are not the oracles of God because they are not written that way?

No, we do not need a OT style "Thus Says The Lord" to hold Colossians on equal authority to Exodus or Numbers.
You should get use to salutations of the new covenant inspiration -
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Cor. 1:3)
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (2 Cor. 1:2)
Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, (Gal. 1:3)

This reflects the New Testament priciple of Christ the Spirit speaking in oneness with His
Holy Spirit filled and anointed apostles. And you will not undermind the divine authority of New Testament
books, disqualifying their preeminence on the basis of the absence of "Thus Saith Jehovah God . . . thus and such."

You should get use to utterances carrying divine authority such as this -
Paul, an apostle (not from men nor through man but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised Him from the dead), (Gal. 1:1)
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus through the will of God, and Timothy the brother, (Col. 1:1)
Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the sojourners of the dispersion . . . (1 Pet. 1:1a)
Simon Peter, a slave and apostle of Jesus Christ, to those who have been allotted faith equally precious as ours (2 Pet. 1:1a)
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus through the will of God, and Timothy the brother, (2 Cor. 1:1a)

and there is no such verse.

Many Pentacostal clergy trying to impress their audience with OT authority will act as dictaphones saying . . . "Thus says the Lord . . . "
Other's like yourself are attempting to put heft on your opinions by demanding a New Testament or Old Testament "Thus says the Lord . . ."
No SabbathBlessing. You will not undercut the authority of the oracles of the New Testament saying we should not believe something
the apostles wrote unless the "qualifying" "Thus Says the Lord . . . " is present.

Now you do use the New Testament quotations after trying to give preeminence to earlier utterances in the progressive
unfolding of God's will in the Bible.

Paul says what matters is keeping the commandments of God 1 Cor 7:19 and kept every Sabbath long after the cross Acts 18:3, Acts 13:42-44 and Jesus tells us the Sabbath will be kept for eternity Isaiah 66:22-23 so it does not fit with this interpretation of Col 2:16

This is now you selective appeal to Paul's authority. This is what he wrote in verses 18,19 -

Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of God’s commandments is what counts.
Each one, in the calling in which he was called, in this let him remain.

Yes, the words say "the keeping of God's commandments is what counts."
But the reverting back to the Law keeping you are attempting to prove here is not taking into account that
he also says both "Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing."

This practice was one of the foundation pillars of ordinances to KEEP in the old covenant.
Seamlessly, in one breath, Paul says what matters in keeping the commandments of God not whether or not you kept the ordinance.

The commandments of God in the letter is to abide in the indwelling living Jesus who is one spirit with those joined to Him.
But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit. (1 Cor. 6:17)

The conclusion of his advice on the matter is to remain with God, not worring about your status as to this OT ritual.
And he says do not be slaves of men.
You were bought with a price; do not be slaves of men.
Each one, brothers, in what status he was called, in this let him remain with God.

So I think you need to read chapter seven again in the spirit of his ministry.

The context doesn’t fit and context dictates scripture, not our own interpretations.

Your selective appeal to Pauline authority is trying to exalt your love for the Sabbath keeping ordinance.
You are not entering into the spirit or context of Paul's ministry there. You are exploiting a few words to exalt ritual keeping.

Now you are about to do what I already pointed out. I expect you to munipulate Colossians wrongly to force upon it your legalism.

The context is given in the earlier verse, that most people don’t quote….

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

If he meant to make an EXCEPTION for the 4th commandment, I think he would have clearly EXEMPTED it. He did not.

There are more than one Sabbath in the scripture and if you look at the context in v14 it tells us which sabbath(s) it is referring to.

That there are plural Sabbath(s) is not ground for you to imagine he EXEMPTED the 4th commandment from the handwriting or ordinances that was against the believers, which was nailed with Christ to His cross.
When Paul writes - "for you are not under the law but under grace." (Rom. 6:14) he makes not special exception for the 4th law of the Ten.
When Paul writes - "So then, my brothers, you also have been made dead to the law through the body of Christ " (7:4) he makes no
special exception for the 4th commandment to keep the Sabbath.
When Paul writes - "But now we have been discharged from the law, having died to that in which we were held" (7:6) he makes no
special exception for the law of keeping the seventh day Sabbath.

You labor to try to prove the Sabbath keeping is somehow exempted in Christians being under grace rather than under the law.

Colossians 2:14 - gives you absolutely no ground to specify any one of the several "Sabbaths" is not included in his teaching.
Christ the Head which we are exhorted to hold fast to contains all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge are hidden.(vs.3,19)

Because he knows the subtlety of the spiritual enemy trying to DISTRACT the believers FROM Christ even with "good things" he warns -
This I say that no one may delude you with persuasive speech. (2:4)
Beware that no one carries you off as spoil through his philosophy and empty deceit, (2:8)

The church there was under the persuasive speech used by Christ's enemy to draw their attention away
to focus not on sinful things, but high sophisticated things that were "good". Even some of the "good" distractions
had some basis in God's law in the Old Testament.

Sadly, you are under the same deception, working hard here to artificially exempt the 4th commandment from the apostle's
representative list of distractions from Christ.

 

[oikonomia]

The weekly Sabbath is holy and blessed by God, not the definition of contrary or against and handwritten is not finger written by God.

Paul says that the whole law was spiritual, holy, and good. You have no need to hand wave that the 4th commandment was.
So then the law is holy, and the commandment holy and righteous and good. (Rom. 7:12)

The righteousness, holiness, and goodness of the law is not the point.
The principle of man working for God is done away by God working Himself into man to be everything for him as grace.

And the commandment, which was unto life, this very commandment was found to me to be unto death. (Rom. 7:10)
"[T]he commandment" refers to all the commandments of the law. A particular Sabbath keeping is not an exception as you wish.

When Paul writes that there was not a law which was able to give divine life, he made no special exception for the 4th commandment.
He did not write "a law BESIDES the law about keeping the Sabbath".

For if a law had been given which was able to give life, righteousness would have indeed been of law. (Gal. 3:21)
His emphasis is like that of the Lord Jesus who sent him. The believers must abide in Christ that Christ's life
flow into them as grace. Without Him all that they do is nothing. He is the True Vine in which the attached branches
derive ALL of their life supply. See John 15 of course.

The context does not fit, yet sadly, people do not care. Plus do we see the weekly Sabbath ending in scripture at the Cross? No, we do not. If Jesus was going to do away with one of the commandments that He gave and kept and said was made for us Mark 2:27,

Mark 2:27 is not a good teaching to prove Christians are legally obligated to keep the 4th commandment.

He would have told someone, not silence.

We do not have silence. We have the (as He promised) the Holy Spirit leading the church into all of the truth.
And He, the Spirit utilized among others, the Apostle Paul.

And His apostle said under inspiration that when one brother holds a day above all other days, for unity's sake he should not be despised.
And if another brother holds all days equally, he should be received and not judged.

Now you may demand a "Thus Says the Lord" there. But the apostle's fellowship and teaching is with authority.

One judges one day above another; another judges every day alike. Let each be fully persuaded in his own mind.
He who regards that day, regards it to the Lord; and he who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who does not eat, does not eat to the Lord, and he gives thanks to God. (Rom. 14:5,6)

The peace, and righteousness, and joy in the Holy Spirit is the kingdom of God NOW. (Rom. 14:17)
Paul makes provision for levels of maturity, knowing that along the path of growth, some linger in holding certain days above others.
Not all in the church life will do this. And there needs to be tolerance and accomadation for others' convictions.

The unity, the oneness of the church life is more important to the Lord. We all live not to ourselves but to the Lord in our convictions.
For none of us lives to himself, and none dies to himself;
For whether we live, we live to the Lord,
and whether we die, we die to the Lord. Therefore whether we live or we die, we are the Lord’s. (Rom. 14:7,8)

In Colossians he is stronger. He writes that we should not be robbed of our enjoyment of the prize of Christ
by persuasive religious speech ustilized by God's enemy to SIDETRACK the believers from Christ the Head and His Body.

"Let no one defraud you by judging you unworthy of your prize . . . And not holding the Head, out from whom all the Body, being richly supplied and knit together by means of the joints and sinews, grows with the growth of God." (Col 2:18a,19)

God’s people kept the Sabbath after the cross according to the commandment Luke 23:56,

Luke 23:56 showing what the Jewish women had a habit of doing is not a good basis for trying to prove Christians are bound today
to keep the seventh day Sabbath. And there is a difference at times between what Jesus TAUGHT and what was RECORDED as having occurred.

the apostles kept every Sabbath just as Jesus told them to observe everything He commanded, Jesus expected His people to be keeping the Sabbath decades after the Cross Matthew 24:20

Matthew 24:20 is neither a stong basis to prove the Christian church is obligated legally to keep the 7th day Sabbath.
It is a prediction that some Israelites will have turmoil come upon them during their religious custom. There is often a difference
between what Jesus TAUGHT and what He predicted would happen.

and we see the Sabbath being kept for all eternity Isa 66:22-23. If one of the commandments of God was going to end in scripture, it would be just as clear as God wrote and Spoke. We are to live by every Word of God Mat 4:4

Now this verse seems handy for some to teach we should keep the 4th commandment legally forever.
But I think it comes short of saying that because the moon does mark out time and seasons.
And at least days are numbered and one named during the millennium. Perhaps in the eternal age of the new heaven and new earth as well.
So if the seventh day is still called then the Sabbath, may just mean the numbering system for a typical week is still the norm.
"And from new moon to new moon and from Sabbath to Sabbath" doesn't really say what is being DONE on those days.
It could be just indications of the markers of time as God arranged from the beginning in Genesis.

But even if I am wrong and he is speaking of KEEPING the Sabbath, the nations around the New Jerusalem walk in its light.
Within the city itself there is no NEED for sun or moon or any light other than the Triune God Himself.

And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon that they should shine in it,
for the glory of God illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb. (Rev.21:23)

God is our Sabbath. God Himself is our REST eternally.
That is where the sons of God are, as constituents of the New Jersalem,

Even in the Gospel of Matthew Christ taught that He HIMSELF is the REST of all His people.

Come to Me all who toil and are burdened, and I will give you rest.
Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am meek and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
For My yoke is easy and My burden is light. (Matt. 11:28-30)

This and Colossians 2:16,17 certainly agrees with such ordinaces being a shadow of things to come in Christ Himself.

Let no one therefore judge you in eating and in drinking or in respect of a feast or of a new moon or of the Sabbath,
Which are a shadow of the things to come, but the body is of Christ.(Col. 2:16,17)

Notice also in verse 16 it is not an areguable plural "Sabbath(s)". It is "THE . . . Sabbath."
For length's sake I must end here.

 

[oikonomia]

No one should be judging each other, we only have one righteous Judge and that is Jesus who we all have to stand before at Judgement Day. That said, Jesus commissions us to teach each other the commandments Mat 5:19 and sadly the majority has been deceived into thinking that we do not need to keep one of God’s commandments, when there is no scripture in all of God’s Word that says this.

Now you cannot on one hand claim you are not judging anyone of the brothers and also say "the majority has been deceived."

We are warned the Sabbath would be changed, not by God Dan 7:25 and we see clear history of this prophecy playing out. Jesus warns us about following man’s traditions over the commandments of God quoting right from the unit of Ten Mat 15:3-9. We all have a choice to make, we can follow man or we can follow God. God said Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy Exodus 20:8-11- it is My holy day Isa 58:13 Jesus said was made for man Mark 2:27 which man is made in the image of God to follow. Him. Man tells us to forget the Sabbath. My faith is in God and in His every Word, but we are all given free will.

This summary is not at all in the spirit of Colossians.
Christ is the one reality of all. Without Him all our ritual keeping is vanity and empty.
Christ is our real Sabbath, our real new moon, our real clothing, our real food, our real celebration - not only day by day, week by week, month by month, but moment by moment.

Christ is our real rest. Christ is the expression of God and the reality of every positive thing in the universe.
Christ is profound. And the OT is like the picture in shadows. The New Testament is the caption under the picture.

. . . . the full knowledge of the mystery of God, Christ,
In whom all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge are hidden.

All the treasures of wisdom and knowledge are not in keeping the seventh day Sabbath.
They are in Christ. And as we RECEIVED Him we must continue to WALK in Him.

As therefore you have received the Christ, Jesus the Lord, walk in Him, (Col. 2:6)

 

[Semper-Fi]

So where was the actual COMMAND?

"And unto man he[God] said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom;
And to depart from evil is understanding. Job 28:28 (KJV)

Where is it recorded elsewhere that God said that to mankind?
This shows God spoke to mankind more then we know.


"And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one,
I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I think you, rather, are not in agreement with the New Testament.
My experience is that this kind of disagreement with the New Testament has a symptom of voluminous references to the Old Testament.

I will let Jesus and His disciples address these accusations. The second one first, the Old Testament is God’s Word. Jesus quotes directly from the OT in His teachings often.

2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

Let’s see if in the NT if Jesus, His followers and the disciples agree with your assessment of God’s holy Sabbath commandment.

The Sabbath before the Cross kept by Jesus Himself who is our example 1 John 2:6

Mark 1:21 Then they went into Capernaum, and immediately on the Sabbath He entered the synagogue and taught.
Luke 4:16 So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read.
Luke 4:31 Then He went down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee, and was teaching them on the Sabbaths.
Mark 2:27 And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.- (Man was Created on the 6th day in the image of God Gen 1:26 right before the first Sabbath that God hallowed Gen 2:1-3 Exo 20:11)
Mark 2:28 Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”
Mat 12:8 For the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.
Luke 6:9 Then Jesus said to them, “I will ask you one thing: Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do evil, to save life or to destroy?”
Luke 13:10 Now He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath.
Mark 6:2 And when the Sabbath had come, He began to teach in the synagogue. And many hearing Him were astonished, saying, “Where did this Man get these things? And what wisdom is this which is given to Him, that such mighty works are performed by His hands!


After the Cross

Mark 15:42 Now when evening had come, because it was the Preparation Day, that is, the day before the Sabbath,
Luke 23:54 That day was the Preparation, and the Sabbath drew near.
Luke 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.
Acts 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and sat down.
Acts 13:27 For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him.
Acts 13:42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.
Acts 13:44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God.
Acts 15:21 For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”
Acts 16:13 And on the Sabbath day we went out of the city to the riverside, where prayer was customarily made; and we sat down and spoke to the women who met there.
Acts 17:2 Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures,
Acts 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.
Heb 4:9 NIV There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;
Mat 24:20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath.

And will be kept for eternity

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

Here's your first OT reference to nullify the NT, in Exodus.
The Pharisees preceded you and criticized Jesus' disciples for violating the Sabbath.
They were picking ears of corn to eat. And Jesus had to point the critics away from thier beloved law
and tell them - For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath. (Matt. 12:8)

Wow, do the Pharisees nullify the Words of Jesus? The same Pharisees who falsely accused Jesus of violating the Sabbath and not being God and crucified Him without cause, you’re going to side with them over God’s Word? The Pharisees never gave the Sabbath commandment- God did- personally written and spoken by our Heavenly Creator Exodus 20:8-11, Exo 31:18. We are told not to edit -adding or taking from the commandments Deut 4:2. The Pharisees were added their rules to God’s holy Sabbath, this is what Jesus was rebuking, not the Sabbath that He kept His whole life. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath because He Created it and knows how it is to be kept- He said it was made for man Mark 2:27 to be a blessing and for sanctifying Isai 58:13, Eze 20:12 because man can't sanctify themselves, yet they think they can . Now people are doing the opposite and are taking away from the Sabbath by saying we do not need to keep it, which is contrary to God’s Word.

Jesus defines false worship as keeping man's rules over the commandments of God and Jesus quotes right from the unit of 10 Matthew 15:3-9

God's people keep God's commandments through love and faith. Rev 14:12, Rom 3:31 1 John 5:3, John 14:15, Exo 20:6 Rev 22:14

 

[tonychanyt]

"And unto man he[God] said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom;
And to depart from evil is understanding. Job 28:28 (KJV)

What does this verse have to do with the topic of this OP?
Did Abraham observe the Sabbath day?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

God is our Sabbath. God Himself

Says no Text in scripture. God did not became a commandment He gave Exodus 20:8-11 and observed Exo 20:11 nor is God a day. Exo 20:10

God is our Creator- not the creation.

The Sabbath points us back to the God of Creation (Remember) Gen 2:1-3 Exo 20:11 there are many gods of this world, but only one God capable of Creation. The Sabbath is a sign of His creative and redemptive powers and when we obey Him the way He asks and keep His holy Sabbath, it shows we are worshipping the one True God of Creation the Exo 20:11 which is the same God of Judgement Rev 14:7.

The Sabbath is the day God set aside, blessed, sanctified and made for holy use to spend time with man. Mark 2:27 because man cannot sanctify themselves, only God can, Eze 20:12 but sadly many try anyway.

 

[Semper-Fi]

What does this verse have to do with the topic of this OP?

Like I said This shows[proves] God spoke to mankind more then we know.

Did Abraham observe the Sabbath day?

Genesis 26:5 (KJV)​

because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge,
my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

my commandments, my statutes, and my laws. | YouVersion Search | The Bible App

Search results for: my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

www.bible.com

 

[oikonomia]

. . . Jesus quotes directly from the OT in His teachings often.

I know Jesus quotes from the only Scripture they had then, the Old Testament.

2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

Yes of course all Scripture is inspired of God and profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction, and instruction in righteousness.
"Money solves everything" Ecclesiastes 10:19 is Scripture. But the Christian cannot be naive about the intention and spirit of what is written.

The Devil quoted Scripture. But it was not for instruction in righteousness but for tempting the Son of God to err.
None of us are above being occasionally deceived in our "teaching" which is not proper spiritual "reproof, correction, [proper ] doctrine, or instruction in God ordained righteousness." I am not above misaiming. And you are not either. If you think you are, I don't trust you.

Now I will reply to some of your reasons (other than) the fact they are quotations from the OT.
You may disagree. But I would like you to read and enjoy all the passages we speak about for pure nourishment's sake.
After all ALL scripture is God-breathed [inspired] and profitable for inhaling as God's breath.
I practice what I advise others even when passages are used in debate.

Let’s see if in the NT if Jesus, His followers and the disciples agree with your assessment of God’s holy Sabbath commandment.

We already covered many passages in Romans showing in Christ we are discharged from the law, made dead to the law through the body of Christ. You should not just whistle by Romans, a basic NT book of foundational Christian teaching of "the gospel of God."

Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus, a called apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
Which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures, (Rom. 1:1,2)

Are you going to argue that the author of Romans was unfaithful and unfit to lay out the crucial basics of our faith?
If you have been at this a long time, I suspect you will bring forth you standard taught apologetics for SDA.

The Sabbath before the Cross kept by Jesus Himself who is our example 1 John 2:6

"[To] walk even as He walked" is not a proof that keeping Sabbath is obligatory in legality to those abiding in Him.
It does mean as Jesus was abiding constantly in His Father, in like manner He is now in the disciples. And they should abide in
Jesus. Like this:
As the living Father has sent Me and I live because of the Father, so he who eats Me, he also shall live because of Me. (John 6:57)

He lived by the living Father within Him. He did so as a model to us. And we have both the Father and the Son abiding in us
as a living One. His commandments are minute, many, detailed, and on a grandularity small enough to touch every thought, feeling, inclination,in our hearts.

You are reading "walk even as He walked" and imagining religiously "keep the Ten Commandments in imitation of Jesus."
The difference is subtle. The Humanist, Agnostic, even Atheist, let alone Moslem may desire to "walk even as He walked" in that regard.
He need not abide in the available resurrected Christ as Spirit. He need not even BELIEVE Jesus is Son of God, but just a good example
of a good person to be imitated.https://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1 John 2.6

Mark 1:21 Then they went into Capernaum, and immediately on the Sabbath He entered the synagogue and taught.

That only indicates it was on the Sabbath He went to a Jewish synagogue.
You read ". . . on the Sabbath He entered the synagogue and taught" as Jesus instructing the NT church to legally keep the 7th day Sabbath.

Luke 4:16 So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read.

The same applies here. You are reading "as His custom was" and putting it together with "walk as He walked" to offer "proof" that
Christ taught the NT church not to work on the 7th day Sabbath as Israel was taught at Mt. Sinai.

Luke 4:31 Then He went down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee, and was teaching them on the Sabbaths.

Same kind of forcing this as a proof Jesus was a re-run of Moses.
The New Testament draws a contrast between living under the law Moses gave and the indwelling grace which is Christ Himself.
For the law was given through Moses; grace and reality came through Jesus Christ. (John 1:17)

Mark 2:27 And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.- (Man was Created on the 6th day in the image of God Gen 1:26 right before the first Sabbath that God hallowed Gen 2:1-3 Exo 20:11)

You have many verses. While there is safety in numbers, I will not respond or re-respond to all them now.
Inundating me with MANY passages may seem effective to you. But if there is an underlying misconception being applied, many verses
won't help this.

We will come back perhaps to a more indepth look at the meaning of the Sabbath. I think you need to "graduate" from
too superfiscial an understanding.

Mark 2:28 Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath.”
Mat 12:8 For the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.
Luke 6:9 Then Jesus said to them, “I will ask you one thing: Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do evil, to save life or to destroy?”

This last passage, Luke 6:9 should have indicated to you that Jesus debunked the "Sabbath Police."
For the NT believer to "do good" is to live the Good One - Christ the indwelling life giving Spirit.
Not only is Saturday reserved for that but every day and every MOMENT.

I would think you would realize Luke 6:9 is not saying what you may be wishing it to say - "Keep the Sabbath and you will be doing GOOD."

 

[oikonomia]

Luke 13:10 Now He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath.

Again, this is not proof Jesus taught the NT church "Keep the 4th commandment every 7th day."
The law was given through Moses. Grace and truth [reality] comes with the coming of Jesus.
For the law was given through Moses; grace and reality came through Jesus Christ. (John 1:17)

Your treatment is more like - "the law was given through Moses. Then the law was given again through Jesus Christ."

Mark 6:2 And when the Sabbath had come, He began to teach in the synagogue. And many hearing Him were astonished, saying, “Where did this Man get these things? And what wisdom is this which is given to Him, that such mighty works are performed by His hands!

This again is no proof text that Jesus instructed the new covenant church to imitate Israel about the 7th day - "Only rest and worship and NO LABOR. And don't walk but so far." Rather Jesus pointed to HIMSELF as the REST and the worship of the Father in spirit and in truth.

You recall the "religious" discussion the woman at the well had with Jesus. She argued about which was the right physical place to worship God. Jesus pointed to neither on this mountain or in Jerusalem, but in the regenerated human spirit where reality and real worship was.

Jesus said to her, Woman, believe Me, an hour is coming when neither in this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.
You worship that which you do not know; we worship that which we know, for salvation is of the Jews.

But an hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father in spirit and truthfulness, for the Father also seeks such to worship Him. God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truthfulness. (John 4:21-24)

He could have also said "[Not on THIS day or on THAT day,] but in spirit and in truthfulness."

Below you bemoan that the seventh day Sabbath is not taken more seriously.
Your sorrow should be that Jesus as the PERSON of REST is not taken more seriously.
Those who hunger and thirst for righteousness and mourn are to be blessed.
But our mourning should be for the right thing, or rather that men would experience the PERSON of the Lord Jesus.

In John chapter four the Lord Jesus links the true worship to the welling up of the Spirit as eternal life within.
That is not reserved only for the 7th day of the week. That gushing up enjoyment of Christ as life is for continuous worship.

But whoever drinks of the water that I will give him shall by no means thirst forever; but the water that I will give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into eternal life. (John 4:14)

It is not "Thou shalt not keep the Sabbath." Nor is it "Thou shalt keep the Sabbath." It is a call to worship the Lord Jesus
continously enjoying His thirst quenching presence. He is willing to spring forth at any time on any day.

 

[oikonomia]

After the Cross

Mark 15:42 Now when evening had come, because it was the Preparation Day, that is, the day before the Sabbath,

This verse records what happened. It is not positive teaching that the New Testament church is commanded to keepthe Sabbath.

Luke 23:54 That day was the Preparation, and the Sabbath drew near.

Same appplies here. You have many examples which record what happened WHEN.
You want to read into those verses and teach that they prove new covenant believers MUST be under the law.
Ie. They must not fail to keep the 4th commandment.

Luke 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.
Acts 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and sat down.
Acts 13:27 For those who dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they did not know Him, nor even the voices of the Prophets which are read every Sabbath, have fulfilled them in condemning Him.
Acts 13:42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath.

Anyone can get a concordance out and look up all the verses on the Sabbath.
You have probably ALL of them ready. So far none are proof of the commandment of keeping the 4th law is demanded by Jesus to
the new testament church.

While I certainly enjoy the remaining six or so passages you submit, the issue is the same.
Listing passages about the Sabbath and what occurred on that day, doesn't make your case Christians are under the law.

You have a right to be sorrowful that believers do not seem spiritually healthy enough for you.
But if your medicine of going back to Law Keeping is your cure, it is worst then the ailment.

Long, long before you and SDA came along, the Apostle Paul dealt with this subtle tendency in books like Galatians, Colossians, Hebrews, Philippians, Romans. He labored to bring the Christians always BACK TO CHRIST. The enemy used "good" things and even things
having some basis in the OT to distract lovers of Jesus away from Him.

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

I gave some reply to your usage of Isaiah 66:23 already.
It is not strong enough imo to prove NT believers are for eternity under the law.

Wow, do the Pharisees nullify the Words of Jesus? The same Pharisees who falsely accused Jesus of violating the Sabbath and not being God and crucified Him without cause, you’re going to side with them over God’s Word?

And some modern day "Sabbath Police" do similarly if the "first day of the week" or the Lord's day, seems to them the appropriate
day to have main worship.

The tone of Romans 14 about how Christians should receive one another, teaches accomodation, tolerance, general broad minded sanctified liberal attitudes. If you can do that, I applaud that. But you may have to grow into that attitude. As of yet your seem fiesty to prove
all Christians like you better realize their obligated to keep the 7th day Sabbath.

The Pharisees never gave the Sabbath commandment- God did- personally written and spoken by our Heavenly Creator Exodus 20:8-11, Exo 31:18. We are told not to edit -adding or taking from the commandments Deut 4:2. The Pharisees were added their rules to God’s holy Sabbath, this is what Jesus was rebuking, not the Sabbath that He kept His whole life.

I said before the many passages in the NT teaching our discharge from the law of Moses to live under and in GRACE (a living Person) do not make special exceptions for the 4th commandment. In fact they do not make mention usually of religious traditions ADDED to the Torah latter.

In the Sabbath keeper's manual you work hard to TRY to convey any NT teaching saying no legal obligation to Sabbath keeping refers not
to the 4th commandment but to additions scribes and teachers came up with after Sinai.

No SabbathBlessing. No special exemption is devized setting aside the 4th commandment OR its amendations.
Grace as Christ living in man is the total focal point that we may bear fruit to God.
And we may bear fruit to God not in oldness of letter but in newness of the life imparting Spirit.

But now we have been discharged from the law, having died to that in which we were held, so that we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of letter. (Rom. 7:6)

I must leave off further discussion until latter.
Thanks for all the delicious passages.
But miss application or miss interpretation of them, I cannot go along with.

Grace and reality came with Jesus Christ.
Do not change John 1:17 to say "the law was given through Moses AND Jesus"

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Again, this is not proof Jesus taught the NT church "Keep the 4th commandment every 7th day."
The law was given through Moses. Grace and truth [reality] comes with the coming of Jesus.
For the law was given through Moses; grace and reality came through Jesus Christ. (John 1:17)

Your treatment is more like - "the law was given through Moses. Then the law was given again through Jesus Christ."

Who wrote the Ten Commandment? Not Moses, God did.

Exo 32:16 Now the tablets were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God engraved on the tablets.

Who gave the Ten Commandments? Jesus, God the Son, who came to do the will of the Father John 6:38

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

Did Jesus teach we could forget His commandments or did He ask us to keep them through love.

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. Same thing He asked right in the Ten

Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

It's easy to have the emotion of loving God, but its different than hearing His voice and obeying what He asks, which is what His people do.

There is no scripture that says we can break any of God's commandments-the Sabbath is a commandment of God regardless of people's objection to it and they are kept until the very end for God's people Rev 14:12 Rev 22:14, but it is a remnant Rev 12:17 although all are invited

God gave the commandments to Moses and this is what scripture says about those who do not listen to Moses in the NT

Heb 10:26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Similar to what Jesus says Mat 7:21-23

 

[SabbathBlessings]

This verse records what happened. It is not positive teaching that the New Testament church is commanded to keepthe Sabbath.

Same appplies here. You have many examples which record what happened WHEN.
You want to read into those verses and teach that they prove new covenant believers MUST be under the law.
Ie. They must not fail to keep the 4th commandment.


Anyone can get a concordance out and look up all the verses on the Sabbath.
You have probably ALL of them ready. So far none are proof of the commandment of keeping the 4th law is demanded by Jesus to
the new testament church.

While I certainly enjoy the remaining six or so passages you submit, the issue is the same.
Listing passages about the Sabbath and what occurred on that day, doesn't make your case Christians are under the law.

You have a right to be sorrowful that believers do not seem spiritually healthy enough for you.
But if your medicine of going back to Law Keeping is your cure, it is worst then the ailment.

Long long before you and SDA came along, the Apostle Paul dealt with this subtile tendency in books like Galatians, Colossians, Hebrews, Philippians, Romans. He labored to bring the Christians always BACK TO CHRIST. The enemy used "good" things and even things
having some basis in the OT to distract lovers of Jesus away from Him.

I gave some reply to your usage of Isaiah 66:23 already.
It is not strong enough imo to prove NT believers are for eternity under the law.


And some modern day "Sabbath Police" do similarly if the "first day of the week" or the Lord's day, seems to them the appropriate
day to have main worship.

The tone of Romans 14 about how Christians should receive one another, teaches accomodation, tolerance, general broad minded sanctified liberal attitudes. If you can do that, I applaud that. But you may have to grow into that attitude. As of yet your seem fiesty to prove
all Christians like you better realize their obligated to keep the 7th day Sabbath.



I said before the many passages in the NT teaching our discharge from the law of Moses to live under and in GRACE (a living Person) do not make special exceptions for the 4th commandment. In fact they do not make mention usually of religious traditions ADDED to the Torah latter.

In the Sabbath keeper's manual you work hard to TRY to convey any NT teaching saying no legal obligation to Sabbath keeping refers not
to the 4th commandment but to additions scribes and teachers came up with after Sinai.

No SabbathBlessing. No special exemption is devized setting aside the 4th commandment OR its amendations.
Grace as Christ living in man is the total focal point that we may bear fruit to God.
And we may bear fruit to God not in oldness of letter but in newness of the life imparting Spirit.

But now we have been discharged from the law, having died to that in which we were held, so that we serve in newness of spirit and not in oldness of letter. (Rom. 7:6)

I must leave off further discussion until latter.
Thanks for all the delicious passages.
But miss application or miss interpretation of them, I cannot go along with.

Grace and reality came with Jesus Christ.
Do not change John 1:17 to say "the law was given through Moses AND Jesus"

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.

Your opinion is noted, but I am going to stick with the scriptures.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

But an hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father in spirit and truthfulness, for the Father also seeks such to worship Him. God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truthfulness. (John 4:21-24)

He could have also said "[Not on THIS day or on THAT day,] but in spirit and in truthfulness."

Below you bemoan that the seventh day Sabbath is not taken more seriously.
Your sorrow should be that Jesus as the PERSON of REST is not taken more seriously.
Those who hunger and thirst for righteousness and mourn are to be blessed.
But our mourning should be for the right thing, or rather that men would experience the PERSON of the Lord Jesus.

In John chapter the Lord Jesus links the true worship to the welling up of the Spirit as eternal life within.
That is not reserved only for the 7th day of the week. That gushing up enjoyment of Christ as life is for continuous worship.

But whoever drinks of the water that I will give him shall by no means thirst forever; but the water that I will give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into eternal life. (John 4:14)

It is not "Thou shalt not keep the Sabbath." Nor is it "Thou shalt keep the Sabbath." It is a call to worship the Lord Jesus
continously enjoying His thirst quenching presence. He is willing to spring forth at any time on any day.

I don't think we can be called to true worship according to scripture if one does not keep His commandments.

All of God's commandments are Truth Psalms 119:151 and righteous Psalms 119:172 and testify about the character of God.

Scripture tells us if we claim we know God, but do not keep His commandments, there is no truth in us.

1 John 2:4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. We are told those who do not have truth will be outside the gates. Rev 22:15

So its impossible to say one knows God, but does not do what He asks through faith. Jesus even helps us obey Him so we don't have to do it alone John 14:15-18 but I would be real careful thinking one of God's personally written and personally spoken commandments ended, especially the one God said Remember and is holy and blessed by God. Sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4 and Paul points right to this unit of Ten to define sin Romans 7:7 without the law, we would not know we are sick and need Jesus so its not Jesus telling us we don't have to obey one of His commandments, but the other spirit who has been deceiving man from the beginning. 1 John 3:8 Jesus tells us to obey the commandments John 15:10 John 14:15, Matthew 15:3-9 Matthew 19:17-19 and if we break one we break them all James 2:10-12. Jesus kept all the commandments including the Sabbath and is our example to follow. 1 John 2:6. My faith is in Jesus.

I don't see us agreeing so will leave it as agree to disagree and this all gets sorted out soon enough.

 

[tonychanyt]

Like I said This shows[proves] God spoke to mankind more then we know.

I prefer precision when I quote a verse. This verse does not precisely mention Abraham or the Sabbath.

 

[oikonomia]

Who wrote the Ten Commandment? Not Moses, God did.

Ah. There is no argument from me about God is giver of the law.
I am clear about that. I am also clear that in contrast this same God became a man, and the man became a life giving Spirit
to impart divine life into my being.

"[T]he last Adam became a life giving Spirit." (1 Cor. 15:45)
The Sabbath Rest is now a Person - the divine life imparting Spirit Whom Jesus BECAME in resurrection.

This is the grace and reality that comes to a man when Jesus comes to live in a man.
Wake up in the morning and proclaim it in thanksgiving "Lord Jesus, You came to be the life giving Spirit in me. Thankyou Lord."
You'll have all the rest you need AND all the worship too.

This is important that the Son of God in resurrection became divine life giving Spirit.
Why? Because the Law written by the finger of God and delivered to Moses and Israel could not give life.
Argue not with me. Both Paul said it and Jesus from Whom he got this truth, said it.

Paul said it - Is then the law against the promises of God? Absolutely not! For if a law had been given which was able to give life, righteousness would have indeed been of law. (Gal. 3:21)

Jesus taught it first - You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life;
and it is these that testify concerning Me. Yet you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life. (John 5:39,40)

They searched the Scripture to find eternal life. Eternal life came to them in the man Jesus, the Son of God.
And they refused to come to Him. But the Scriptures testified to Him. Galatians 3:21 and John 5:39,40 are saying the same thing.

Exo 32:16 Now the tablets were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God engraved on the tablets.

You cannot get over the fact that God progressively unveiled His eternal purpose.
The law was a school instructor like a tutor to lead man to grace.
Now being under the grace of the indwelling Person of Jesus the new covenant people are no longer under the law.

So then the law has become our child-conductor unto Christ that we might be justified out of faith.
But since faith has come, we are no longer under a child-conductor. (Gal. 3:24,25)

The New Testament says Christians are no longer under the child-conductor. Why do you rebel and teach, "Yes Christians are still under the child-conductor on commandment #4. Why it was written by the finger of God !!"

There is no debate over who wrote the commandments.
Why do you revolt against the up-to-date revelation of His will - we are all "organic" sons of God no longer being child-conducted by that Law?

But since faith has come, we are no longer under a child-conductor.
For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. (Gal. 3:25-27)

The law now is the law of life. The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus we must learn to inwardly regulate and empower us.

Who gave the Ten Commandments? Jesus, God the Son, who came to do the will of the Father John 6:38

There is no argument about God being the source of the Ten Commandments.
There is no argument about the Son coming with the Father who never left Him, to live the Father and the Father's will.

There is no disagreement about the AUTHOR of the Law or the obedience of the Son of God.
There is disagreement about living in the New Testament salvation of faith and grace - oneness with the indwelling Christ as the divine life giving Spirit.

With Christ there is the law of the Spirit of life automatically, even "scientifically" doing everything innately in us if we learn to WALK by the Spirit in our reborn spirit.

There is now then no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus.
For the law of the Spirit of life has freed me in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and of death. (Rom. 8:1,2)

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

There is no argument here about the Triune God being the Creator. All things came into being through the Word who was with God and was God. You cannot point to this as grounds to rebel against New Testamnt grace in favor of returning to law keeping.

Did Jesus teach we could forget His commandments or did He ask us to keep them through love.

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. Same thing He asked right in the Ten

Taking all things into account, John 14:15 is about keeping His instant inward commandments. You are reading into the passage
"If you love Me you will keep the Ten Commandments."

We realize after receiving Christ the Spirit of life, that His commandments are so expressly minute, personal, calibrated to our every inclination
and reaction, they cannot be codified.
Christ living in me may command me where to turn my eyes.
His inward command may be to not think this but think something else instead.
Christ's commandments during the day may be:
How much to raise my voice,
How to fix my face when speaking to someone,
How to know at what point I should not reach for another helping of food.
How to adjust the very tone of my voice.
How to smile at someone.
How to refrain from laughing at something said.

The commands of Christ in those in whom He lives are on a quantum level. They go deeper and deeper. They become finer and finer.
We are inwardly transformed into the same image as He by the highly calibrating Holy Spirit.

And the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
But we all with unveiled face, beholding and reflecting like a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord Spirit. (2 Cor. 3:17,18)

He will get down to what I should do Tuesday morning, Thursday evening, Saturday afternoon.
The Spirit of Christ may tell me to do some work on Saturday. And WHILE I am working STILL set the mind
on the Spirit in my spirit. This is the root of our worship in the new covenant grace - to walk step by step with the mind set on the Spirit of life.

Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

I love the entire Bible SabbathBlessing - all sixty six books I love.
But God's revelation is unfolding. And we must not linger in the OT economy to rebel against the NT economy.

In the latter revelation "the work of God" is to believe ourselves INTO the Son and "eat" Him as the living bread of life.

Then they said to Him, What shall we do that we may work the works of God?
Jesus answered and said to them, This is the work of God, that you believe into Him whom He has sent. (John 6:28,29)

He pointed to Himself as "food" to take in and live by - the reality of the MANNA from heaven to sustain God's people.
He did not point them to making certain they kept the laws given by God on Mt. Sinai.

You know "manna" means "What is it?" This was a new reality to man - to live by "consumming" by eating the man who
came down from heaven.

we must learn to eat Him and live by Him. We should not in perplexity to this "MANNA" of Christ the bread from heaven, decide it is too hard to understand compared to just keeping the Sabbath on Saturday. That is easy to understand. That is easy to make us think we are doing
what God wants.

There is no scripture that says we can break any of God's commandments-the Sabbath is a commandment of God regardless of people's objection to it and they are kept until the very end for God's people Rev 14:12 Rev 22:14, but it is a remnant Rev 12:17 although all are invited

Another error is to use freedom from the law as an occasion for the sinful flesh. So you are right that we are not to go out of our way
to break His laws. The fact is that we will break them no matter what if we do not learn to live Christ.

You have not noticed so many verses from Paul warning not to use our freedom for indulgence in sin?
There are SO MANY passages guarding against Satan pushing us to the other extreme of "lawlessness."

If we are led by the Spirit we are not under the law.
But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. (Gal. 5:18)

Now you may protest that you WANT to be under the Ten Commandments.
You go ahead and live for that ambition if you wish.
I want to learn to be led by the Spirit.

God gave the commandments to Moses and this is what scripture says about those who do not listen to Moses in the NT

Heb 10:26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

The sinning willfully there is about foresaking the assembling of the church.
The audience of the letter to the Hebrews were staggering, hesitating, procrastinating living in the new covenant economy.
The fear of some of them was so great that they were forsaking the assembling of the church meeting.
For them to forsake this assenbling together and RETURN to the OT sacrifices at the temple was to sin willfully.

Look at the verse immediately preceding verse 26.

Verse 25 - Not abandoning our own assembling together, as the custom with some is, but exhorting one another; and so much the more as you see the day drawing near.

Verse 26 - For when we sin willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice of bulls and goats for sins,

The writer of Hebrews is warning of the seriousness of discipline which will accompany them going BACK to the old covenant way.
He is warning them of temporary loss of kingdom reward and application of discipline during the 1,000 year coming kingdom.

He is also saying it is not POSSIBLE to re-enact the purposes of the old sacrifices.
It is not RIGHT to do so. It is not POSSIBLE to do so.
And they ought not to sin willfully by abandoning the New Testament assenmbling as the Lord's church.

This would be to treat the precious blood of God's Son as common.
This would be to insult the Spirit of grace.
And if God was strict about rebellion in the OT they should not expect so great a spurning of His Son's shed blood would
go without some divine rebuke in the future.

"The Lord will judge HIS . . . people" implies that they are still His people. He can discipline them fearfully. Yet they are not because of this
lost forever. It is fearful though that before the judgment seat of Christ the One who shed His blood for them was so treated.

Similar to what Jesus says Mat 7:21-23

Okay. I am familiar with this warning. While you reach for this sober warning, understand that it could apply to
some teachers who replace grace with legalistic law keeping holding BACK disciples from enjoying Christ's salvation.

Do not be too quick to assume exalting the Sabbath keeping above the Son of God could not be someone THINKING he is
doing things for the Lord. "I never knew you" contains the same word as acknowledge in Romans 7:15 -

For what I work out, I do not acknowledge; for what I will, this I do not practice; but what I hate, this I do.

It can be accurately translated as "I never acknowledge you" or that He never ALLOWED or APPROVED of those methods.
Now I certainly take to heart the warning of Matt, 7:21-23. Ministry has to be along the lines that the Christ approves.

I would suggest you consider Matt. 7:21-23 about teaching law keeping rather than living under NT grace.
You don't want to hear the Lord Jesus say something like - "Yes, you argued all the time about keeping the Sabbath. But I didn't tell you
to do that. You had Paul as an example of a faightful steward. He taught My people were not under the law but under grace."

I'll take my methods to the Lord in careful prayer.
Why don't you do so also.

Now, we have gone back and forth about "You're suppose to keep the Sabbath vs Living under grace not law" many times.

I think we should shift to discussing what is the real meaning behind the REST.
You can start by expounding the passage in Hebrews.

So then there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.
For he who has entered into His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His own.
Let us therefore be diligent to enter into that rest lest anyone fall after the same example of disobedience.

If "there remains a Sabbath rest" even though all Christians set aside Saturday for main worship, there is a deeper significance
of its meaning.

I want to talk with you, if you will, about the deeper significance of this Sabbath from the Bible.

 

[GDL]

@oikonomia

Not intending to derail this discussion, I'd appreciate it if you could integrate into it your thinking about the lawful use of the law (1Tim1) and Paul's instruction about the summarization of commandments as Lev19:18 in Rom13:9.