Demonic Influences

[kdet]

Is there scriptural basis for that Kitty?

1) blinding the minds of the unregenerate (2 Cor. 4:4).
2) snatching away the good seed of the word (Matthew 13:19).
3) lulling the unbeliever into a false sense of security (Luke 11:21).
4) laying snares for the unwary (2 Timothy 2:25-26).
5) masquerading as an angel of light (2 Cor 11:13-14).
6) deceiving those whose minds are not subject to the Word of truth (Rev 12:9).
7) mixing truth with error (Matthew 13:25-8).

 

[cbk]

I have used a Oija board and nothing happened. A friend of mine gave me two Tarot readings, and no supernatural entities showed up (and the readings didn't make much sense either).

PT Barnum was right.

Well, if there are X number of demons in the world, and X+3 billion people in the world, maybe they don't think that you and your friend are worth their time.

 

[Nathan David]

Maybe the writers of the New Testament had a contemporary understanding of mental illness, and wrote down their impressions of Jesus's actions as they understood them? Or maybe they were speaking allegorically? Someone can be wrong once in a while, or not have the whole truth, and still be credible.

For a Christian to deny the credibility of the writers of the New Testament would probably place them on a more slippery slope than to deny demons ever existed to begin with.

A slippery slope to the truth.

To non-Christians, this is of little matter, they have other, more serious issues to deal with.

Yes, we have to deal with real problems instead of the boogey-men of superstition.

All Satan has to do to win is convince people he doesn't exist.

Well he's doing a pretty good job!

 

[kdet]

Well, if there are X number of demons in the world, and X+3 billion people in the world, maybe they don't think that you and your friend are worth their time.

Also he wouldn't necessarily know that they were influencing him.

 

[prince didymus]

Demonic influences are seemingly everywhere. There is always spiritual warefare occuring around us. It's just that people can't see it going on. There are some Christians however who have seen the things that go on in the spiritual realm. Like some have already mentioned, these influences are numerous and one of the most common would possibly be getting people to not believe in the existence of both God and Satan.

 

[good4u]

Actually, Nathan David you are in grave error. That kind of mindset in your last post is "exactly" what Satan is looking for to continue such blindness to demonic activity. It is much easier for Satan to operate when men deny his existence and activity than for them to believe that he is and will do harm to men.

I will give you an example from my own life. I was a very young in age (probably 13 or 14) and immature in my faith as a Christian, the new "coolest" game at the time (it is very old, but repackaged as new by toy makers) was the Ouija Board game by Milton Bradley. I believe they still make it today. At any rate, my brother and I were playing the game one night in the living room. At the beginning of the game, the "pointer" would just go off the board and for a while nothing really happened. Then as we continued playing, the room got noticeably "colder" but not the rest of the house. I tell you the pointer literally leviataed off the board as I asked if a demon was in the room and that pointer said, "yes." I swear to you on the Word of God, that this is the truth!!!!

It frightened me so badly, that I asked God to remove the demon and repented before God from such foolish behavior. I have never again touched another Ouija Board in my life, nor do I plan to willingly.

Now take this from a very serious poster, who now knows better. For the Lord means what He says, and says what he means. Without a doubt, that little incident cured me from ever going near what God has clearly forbidden for his children.

I also recommend unbelievers not do this, for you will be playing with fire that you cannot stop on your own accord. I assure you.

 

[Nathan David]

Good4U, is demonic influence the only possible explanation for what you experienced?

 

[good4u]

Yes.

 

[prince didymus]

Good4U, is demonic influence the only possible explanation for what you experienced?

What other explanation is there?

 

[Nathan David]

I can think of several.

Perceptions of temperature can change due to a minor medical condition, a flush of hormones, or an active imagination - the latter two being quite common in 13-year-olds. I've never seen something levitate, but the power of suggestion coupled with an active imagination can easily cause someone to think they've seen something like that. The way Ouija boards work is by the users subconsciously pushing the pointer to the answer they're expecting.

When I was 12 I was convinced my best friend could read my mind. I was wrong, and thinking back it was pretty silly.

When I was 14 the girl I had a crush on used to hang out in the office of the student newspaper. I got the idea that if I imagined the office door being open, it would be closed when I walked by, so if I wanted to see her I had to imagine it being closed. The system only worked about 50% of the time, but for a year I was convinced it was true.

 

[prince didymus]

Interesting, but two people seeing the same thing?

 

[good4u]

Nathan,

I don't expect you to believe me. I am stating that I have not nor will I willing use an Ouija board again.

What I experience was real enough for me to learn a very serious lesson. A lesson I plan never to repeat. I frankly don't like learning the hard way, maybe you do.

 

[cbk]

Maybe the writers of the New Testament had a contemporary understanding of mental illness, and wrote down their impressions of Jesus's actions as they understood them? Or maybe they were speaking allegorically? Someone can be wrong once in a while, or not have the whole truth, and still be credible.

A contemporary understanding of mental illness is possible in many instances, but I do not believe that it applies to the illness of the man in Mark 5. Do you believe this to be a contemporary understanding? Or is it demon possession?

If the account of Mark 5 be a contemporary understanding, than Jesus was either leading his followers astray by putting on an act that he was speaking to demons, or the writers are not telling the truth in this account, or Jesus had the power to heal those with mental illness but he did NOT have the knowledge of understanding the difference between being mentally unstable and being influenced from an outside source, or a combination of any of the first three.

Therefore, in the account of Mark 5, which of these hold true? And how can we explain the pigs??

 

[Nathan David]

If the account of Mark 5 be a contemporary understanding, than Jesus was either leading his followers astray by putting on an act that he was speaking to demons, or the writers are not telling the truth in this account, or Jesus had the power to heal those with mental illness but he did NOT have the knowledge of understanding the difference between being mentally unstable and being influenced from an outside source, or a combination of any of the first three.

All three sound pretty plausible. All the Christians I know personally would lean towards the second and third explanations.

Therefore, in the account of Mark 5, which of these hold true? And how can we explain the pigs??

We can explain the pigs as poetic license on the part of the writer(s). This would also explain the walking on water and coming back from the dead, but that's another discussion.

 

[Nathan David]

Nathan,

I don't expect you to believe me.

I believe you experienced what you experienced, but I don't think it means what you think it means.

 

[good4u]

I believe you experienced what you experienced, but I don't think it means what you think it means.

Well then, by all means...please tell me what YOU believe happened.

I am most interested.

I am not stupid.

I did NOT make it up.

I am not a liar.

So please...I'm listening...really.

 

[Nathan David]

I already gave one possible explanation above. I never said you were lying.

Another possible explanation is your friend tricked you.

Let me ask you this: Thousands and thousands of Catholics have seen visions of the Virgin Mary. Is the Virgin Mary really appearing to them?

 

[good4u]

No, Nathan your changing the subject. Visions are not the same as verifiable events.

My brother and I experienced the SAME event. We were sober and not in an altered state of consciousness. A room does not grow colder on its own in a short period of time. He did not get up and change the temperture. If I thought it was a trick, I would have realized it. It was no trick. Why was I so frightened?

Excuses are not the same as solid explanations....no?

 

[revolutio]

Personally I think Ouija boards are funny. They were first released in the 1800s already bearing the title of 'supernatural' this alone was enough to get people to expect things from them. They produce results in accordance with what people already know. The reason they work is because people expect them to. They do what people want them to, whether the person is aware of it or not. Since you consciously can't move it and still have the proper effect you were looking for, your subconscious prevents you from recognizing yourself as being the source of the Ouija board's actions.

That is just my opinion.

 

[cbk]

We can explain the pigs as poetic license on the part of the writer(s). This would also explain the walking on water and coming back from the dead, but that's another discussion.

And him raising from the dead and ascending into heaven,,,, let's not leave this poetry out.