Demon/devil threads

[JCFantasy23]

I don't believe discussing the issue of demons would make me susceptible to them. I am protected by my faith, and I don't see God having an issue with me discussing these topics rationally.

 

[Left]

I don't believe discussing the issue of demons would make me susceptible to them. I am protected by my faith, and I don't see God having an issue with me discussing these topics rationally.

Seems to be the concensus on this thread.

At least I have learned a thing or two from the posts in this thread.

 

[Solomons Porch]

Are you sure that saying "I am a child of God and you cannot come near me!" will make demons go away? I feel like certain demons just stick around me sometimes and oppress, oppress, oppress. I don't think it's that simple for me.

I think you being cautious is good. The eyes are the window to the soul. I could get into deep subject matter here, but I will not or else the thread you have posted may "explode" with controversy. Oppress vs Tormented vs Demonized. May you find the answers you are looking for, God Bless !!

 

[PropheticTimes]

I have to agree with AnticipateHisComing on this. If you do not know your enemy, you won't know how to fight against it. As believers we cannot be possessed (2 Corinthians 6:14), but we most certainly can be, and are, oppressed and harrassed by evil spirits. I recommend Derek Prince on this topic, he spent his life in the deliverance ministry. He has a multitude of YouTube videos on the subject.

When we live in the spirit, we must learn to see the world through spiritual eyes and we must learn to fight spiritually (Ephesians 6:12). Yes, we must resist the devil, and he will flee from us, but how can you resist what you don't know? The devil is the sneakiest sucker to ever come into being, and because of this, spiritual discernment is a must if we want to live on the victorious side of this life and not the enslaved.

I make it a point to study his tactics and learn as much about his paths of attack as I can.

 

[SLB]

All good points. If you are fearful of demons, evil spirits and the like hanging around you, the best way to get rid of them is to spend more time with God. reading copious amounts of the Word helps to clear the crap out of your mind.
Ephesians 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Alternating reading the word with prayer about what you are reading helps to keep your mind focussed on God. If you are "unsettled" and you spend too much time in prayer, your own mind can deceive you. But if you alternate short prayer with reading and more prayer and more reading, your mind doesn't get a chance to wander off. It helps to keep you grounded and it's amazing what the Holy Spirit can teach you when you are reading the Word in an attitude of prayer.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I don't know what Apostle Paul meant about this. But I think many Christians got it wrong.

I actually think there's something wrong with people who practice, unintelligible babbling they call "speaking in tongues". Often when I encounter them, they can't seem to get near me. They seem to fear me somehow.

I sense something evil about it. If I am the one evil, why I'm not afraid of it at all but those who do it seem afraid of me and wants to avoid me?

Off topic. This isn't a thread about speaking in tongues. There are other threads that discuss that topic and you'd be best going there.

 

[KWCrazy]

If you are a Christian demons hate you and will put temptations into your head at your weakest moments. They cannot possess you. As others have pointed out, the Holy Spirit indwells Christians and no demon could share a space with the Holy Spirit. Discussing these things does not make them any more or less active in your life. They may try to scare you but you have nothing to fear from a demon. You deal with them as Jesus dealt with Satan; by quoting Scripture. They can't stand it. Demons can and do posses the unsaved. They can and do lead the unsaved to drugs, alcohol and suicide. Remember, Isaiah 26:3 "Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on thee: because he trusteth in thee." Also remember from the 23rd Psalm "Though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I will fear no evil; for thou art with me."

Angels and demons are as real as your own soul. All are spirits. Angels are God's messengers and can fly or float through the air. Demons are earthbound and have to walk. Your own spirit shares your body with the Holy Spirit; your direct connection to the Father. When you die your spirit will be carried to the Father by angels. Yes, demons are real and they are powerful. However, you have God. Nothing is more powerful than the Lord.

 

[timewerx]

Off topic. This isn't a thread about speaking in tongues. There are other threads that discuss that topic and you'd be best going there.

I'm sorry but I didn't think my post was off topic.

I do feel there's something wrong about those who misuse speaking in tongues. It's the same bad feeling I get on those who might be possessed by evil spirits.

After all, we've been discussing all this time about demon possession, oppression. Is it possible that false teachings in Christianity could get someone possessed?

If you insist I did go off topic, you can have my post reported to the mods.

I am simply voicing my concern on those who practice something they think is from the Holy Spirit but maybe not. The Bible is very clear about "Speaking in other tongues" and it isn't unintelligible babbling. If at least one person from each nation is present, one of them is going to understand it.

If someone is doing something beyond their control that is not from God or the Holy Spirit, where is it coming from?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I'm sorry but I didn't think my post was off topic.

I do feel there's something wrong about those who misuse speaking in tongues. It's the same bad feeling I get on those who might be possessed by evil spirits.

I agree that in many groups tongues is misused and that is why visitors to those churches think that the people are loopy. That's what Paul warned about in 1 Corinthians 14. If the people are born again, they cannot be actually possessed by evil spirits. I believe that if they are speaking in faith, then God understands it. Paul says that those who speak in tongues give thanks to God well. But the problem arises with uninitiated (untaught) or unbelievers coming into a public service and hearing what they view as gibberish being spoken. Paul says that it is better for people to speak in tongues in private to God but in the public service to say things that build others up not put them off and turn them away.

After all, we've been discussing all this time about demon possession, oppression. Is it possible that false teachings in Christianity could get someone possessed?

My answer to your last question is no. A born again Christian cannot be possessed because he already has the Holy Spirit dwelling in him. But if the person has unresolved garbage in their lives that needs to be cleaned out, then it is possible for a demon to influence the person through oppression or obsession. If a person becomes obsessed with speaking in tongues in public to impress others of his or her super- spirituality, and to try and compensate for feelings of inferiority, which may come from a defective understanding of what that person stands with Christ, then I can believe that the obsession could come from the influence of a demon. But once the garbage is cleaned out by good counselling, then the nature of the tongues would change and the person would no longer have the obsession to speak out in public. Of course some have the gift of tongues which is always followed by the interpretation, but that is another topic.

If you insist I did go off topic, you can have my post reported to the mods.

Not at all. I'm happy to give my view. I respect your view based on your experience of tongues, and it goes right along with Paul's warning about public tongues without interpretation. But a good, close study of 1 Corinthians 14 puts it into its right perspective. I know that there are cessationists who don't believe in the modern practice of tongues, and I have encountered some who are so prejudiced against it that they won't accept anything other than their own view, which is usually based on half an obscure verse in 1 Corinthians 13. But I believe that it is defective hermeneutics to base a doctrine on half an obscure verse of Scripture.

I am simply voicing my concern on those who practice something they think is from the Holy Spirit but maybe not. The Bible is very clear about "Speaking in other tongues" and it isn't unintelligible babbling. If at least one person from each nation is present, one of them is going to understand it.

That's not how Paul taught it. It is what happened at Pentecost, but then that was a specific one-off occurrence because of the gathering of pilgrims from all over the region and the tongues were heard in their own dialects. I have reliable testimonies of that happening these days, and two of these happened in my own church with close friends. But Paul taught that tongues were directed to God and that no person could understand them. Private tongues are for enhancing the private prayer time, and God understands what is being spoken. I have been praying in tongues for 50 years, and I have asked God about it, and He has assured me that He understands it and loves to hear me speak it to him. But I never speak in tongues in public because of what Paul taught. Actually God told me, "Why do you think I devoted a whole chapter of the New Testament to tongues when I didn't intend all believers to pray in it until Jesus comes again?" That was enough for me. God's direct words to me carry much more authority than anyone else. But I don't put anyone who does not speak in tongues down, because Paul did ask: "Do all speak in tongues?" So I conclude that not all believers get the revelation of it. So, I respect believers who do not feel that tongues is for them. But I don't respect the cessationist hockey pucks to try and teach that tongues is of the devil and try to talk people out of seeking it when those people want that gift. I don't mean you though, because you are asking sincere and reasonable questions about it.

If someone is doing something beyond their control that is not from God or the Holy Spirit, where is it coming from?

Yes. If that person is compelled to speak in tongues and loses control, then it cannot be of God because self control is a fruit of the Spirit. Out of control behaviour is a work of the flesh and is at the same level as riotous behaviour, except that it as based on a compulsive religious act, and would commonly come from a religious spirit instead of the Holy Spirit.

But a genuine speaker of tongues is always self controlled. Paul says that the spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet. In other words, the speaker has total control over how, when and what he is speaking. When I speak, I speak an articulate language and I am just as controlled about it as when I am praying in English. I can choose to pray in English and then pray in tongues as I feel inclined. Some say that tongues is an ecstatic gift, suggesting that a person has to go into some type of ecstacy in order to speak it. I don't believe that for one minute. I am cold-blooded and deliberate when I speak in tongues. There are times when I get joyful because I am praying in tongues because I get a new filling of the Spirit, and I start giggling and laughing, but even that is totally controlled. Therefore when I am praying in tongues, I have a deliberate intent to express my heart to God, and when I don't know what to pray I asked Him to guide my tongue, and sometimes I find that I am speaking a new language. It happens a lot when I am interceding.

So tongues is not an out-of-control, haphazzard thing. It is a directed communication with God, and I find it opens up my sensitivity to hear His voice back to me; not some weird type of voice, but usually a verse of Scripture that is totally relevant to what I am thinking or asking. I find that remarkable.

I hope that is helpful.

 

[swordsman1]

But Paul taught that tongues were directed to God and that no person could understand them.

No he didn't. The context of 1 Cor 14 is the assembled congregation, and the specific problem Paul is dealing with is people speaking in an unrecognized tongue during the service. In v2 Paul said that an unrecognized tongue would be understood by God but no one in the congregation would understand it. That doesn't mean it was not a human language. If someone suddenly spoke Swahili in your church then no one would understand, but God would. Nowhere in scripture does it say tongues are a non-human language. The only description of the gift is Acts 2:4-11 - foreign human languages.

But I believe that it is defective hermeneutics to base a doctrine on half an obscure verse of Scripture.

Which is exactly what glossolalists do by taking 1 Cor 14:2 out of context, and not following the hermeneutical principle of allowing the clearer passage (Acts 2) to shine light on the more obscure passage.

Paul says that it is better for people to speak in tongues in private

Where does he say that? It would be very odd for Paul to say such a thing when spiritual gifts are only meant to be used for the benefit of others (1 Pet 4:10, 1 Cor 12:7).

 

[lsume]

I feel all these demon/devil threads open the door for bad things. I feel even asking about them out of genuine curiosity can be harmful. I don't think there should be a rule against it, as what if someone had real problems with them and needed help, I'm just saying. I created one of these threads myself, but that was before I knew better.

I agree that focusing on the enemy and or using the names of the fallen is not a good idea. In fact, I think that perhaps one of the reasons that The Book of Enoch is not in The Bible is because of the names it gives. Also, even the archangel didn't bring railing accusations over the dispute about the body of Moses. We are not the judge but are meek and lowly followers of Christ always praying for help to be obedient and faithful to God's Word. Man shall live by every Word that proceeded out of The Mouth of God.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

No he didn't. The context of 1 Cor 14 is the assembled congregation, and the specific problem Paul is dealing with is people speaking in an unrecognized tongue during the service. In v2 Paul said that an unrecognized tongue would be understood by God but no one in the congregation would understand it. That doesn't mean it was not a human language. If someone suddenly spoke Swahili in your church then no one would understand, but God would. Nowhere in scripture does it say tongues are a non-human language. The only description of the gift is Acts 2:4-11 - foreign human languages.



Which is exactly what glossolalists do by taking 1 Cor 14:2 out of context, and not following the hermeneutical principle of allowing the clearer passage (Acts 2) to shine light on the more obscure passage.



Where does he say that? It would be very odd for Paul to say such a thing when spiritual gifts are only meant to be used for the benefit of others (1 Pet 4:10, 1 Cor 12:7).

Obviously tongues is not for you. We have gone to great lengths on this topic and I can't be bothered continuing it. What I do in my private prayer life is my own business and if I believe that what I am speaking is correct and a great way of communicating with God then nothing is going to convince me otherwise. Let all the other readers judge whether tongues is a good prayer resource or not. The way I read 1 Corinthians 14 is right for me. and your way of reading it may be right for you. I have tried putting my cup of instant coffee, the one I have to strengthen me for drinking real coffee, into my microwave to try and go back in time and ask Paul directly what he meant, but I wasn't successful. I went back only 10 seconds to see myself putting the cup into the microwave!

 

[Winken]

I think a key word here is oppressed, not possessed. Generally if you are living a good life, you will probably never get possessed. You probably have as good of odds as being hit by an ice cream truck.

Now a much greater and more common worry, is oppressed.

Oppressed, yes. Possessed, never. We wear the whole armor of God: Jesus.

 

[Flowernbloom]

I feel all these demon/devil threads open the door for bad things. I feel even asking about them out of genuine curiosity can be harmful. I don't think there should be a rule against it, as what if someone had real problems with them and needed help, I'm just saying. I created one of these threads myself, but that was before I knew better.

I used to feel that way. If you're a child of God, He has given you authority over them. LUKE 10:19 you're not to fear them. At the mere mention of the Name of Jesus they flee. Resist the devil and they will flee from you. God Bless you

 

[BobRyan]

I feel all these demon/devil threads open the door for bad things. I feel even asking about them out of genuine curiosity can be harmful. I don't think there should be a rule against it, as what if someone had real problems with them and needed help, I'm just saying. I created one of these threads myself, but that was before I knew better.

How often does the NT speak about them?? Were they right to do so?

If the intent is to toy with the subject or invent evil angels into one's home - then the less we talk about it the better. But if "being forewarned is forearmed" as the NT states about it - then let's have full disclosure.

Ephesians 6 says we are in a war... a battle -- we need the full armor and we can expect daily assaults. Whatever insights God gives us into the plans of the enemy and the best means of defeating him -- the better.

The devil does not care about popular "fake news about the devil' -- he probably authors much of that disinformation to give him even more advantage over the humans.

But "real news" -- real God-ordained-news about the devil that more fully unmasks his plan -- truly does enrage him.

 

[BobRyan]

Oppressed, yes. Possessed, never. We wear the whole armor of God: Jesus.

We "can" wear the armor of God in Ephesians 6 -- "IF" we choose to do so... to take the time... to look at what the armor actually is --- and to put it on.

But how many actually choose to do that in real life? Matthew 7 says "FEW" no matter that most claim to attend church in some form. The devil knows that as well.

 

[Winken]

Jesus is the whole armor of God. We put him/it on when we confess Him as Savior.

 

[BobRyan]

Jesus is the whole armor of God. We put him/it on when we confess Him as Savior.

Jesus said --
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.


22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 

[Winken]

Jesus said --
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.


22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Read up on who "not everyone" is. Check out His audience. Understand the Kingdom of Heaven: audience. Check out "doeth the will of my Father," audience. (BTW, we of the Faith did His will when we confessed Him as Savior.) "Many will say in that day" is at the GWTJ. Who will the audience be in "I never knew you."

G'Nite...........

 

[Episaw]

My stance is that demons cannot Possess a Christian because the Holy Spirit occupies us already.. For a demon to possess us the Holy Spirit would have to agree to share us with a demon.. If you really think the Holy Spirit would live in the same body as a demon then i don't think i can say anything more...

1 Corinthians 6:KJV
19 "What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? {20} For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s."

I am not sure this is true. The verse says......therefore, glorify God in your body and your spirit, which are Gods.

The fact that Paul said this indicates to me that some believers were not glorifying God in their body and spirits and if they were not doing that then sin had to be present.

In addition, there are denominations that do not acknowledge the ministry of the Holy Spirit in their bodies or their corporate lives. That being the case, how can the Holy Spirit indwell the believer?

As I am a person who exercises the gift of discernment, I can assure you that I have been in many meetings where the Holy Spirit is no more there than the man in the moon. If we are indwelt by the Spirit why is that the case?

Many times I have discerned that the person preaching is devoid of all life in the Spirit. His words are as dead as a dodo. What he says may be right but there is no life in the words so they do not impart revelation. They are just words.

So, I would not be so sure that there cannot be demon activity in the life of the believer especially as I have seen and been used by God to bring deliverance to many believers from demonic activity.