Decision Making

Sparagmos

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2018
8,632
7,319
52
Portland, Oregon
✟278,062.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
It comes down to this - and if anyone can give me scriptures and literal passages that help back it up, I'd like to know, does the husband literally have the "final decision making authority" in decisions that can't be agreed upon? And is his word the end all/be all and I must submit, no matter what? Obviously, if he's asking me to sin, than the answer would be no. I get that. But I'm asking does he have the right in THIS scenario to force me to submit, no matter what? And doesn't that negate the whole Christ-like submission thing, if he's "demanding that I comply" with his answer?

This is what he's told me about his "decision making":



Update: So we're still at an empasse. I haven't the balls when face to face with him, to just tell him I'm going, that's it. On one hand I want to just go, but I feel a sense in my gut that'd be wrong to just go against his wishes, even though I feel very strongly that his wishes are selfish and controlling. I too have to answer to God, and maybe that gut instinct making me feel it's wrong, is Gods voice? After all, submission does mean to submit, regardless of how unGodly I feel he's being. I understand it to be an unconditional thing regardless of whether he's behaving how he should or not. But on the other hand, I also feel if I just continue to submit to what I feel is a genuine selfish leadership, that just enforces it even more, and could even be sinful on my part. But where is the line and how do I know? Am I just not trusting God enough?

Despite how much my husband KNOWS it is upsetting me and how hurt I am by his refusal to just give me his blessing for me to go, he keeps insisting he hasn't made a decision yet, and he's not sure what it's going to be, but his concerns still stand. This after all my pleas and (what I feel, to be very valid) counter arguments to his concerns. I also feel his concerns, while somewhat valid, are also very petty, and excuses for him to use, to tell me no. He claims his concerns trump any desires I have. Apparently, his personal aversion to traffic, crowds, driving in weather, holiday travel, my neices Catholic church not being "his brand", etc...are affecting his decision, that much is obvious. And I've told him, I feel very insulted that he is literally telling me he doesn't trust me at all, nor is he allowing me my rights as a mother to take our kids somewhere with family, since he's holding onto his concerns in those areas. Nothing I've said thus far, no amount of communicating, sharing my feelings, desires, wishes, concerns, pouring out my heart, etc, seems to make a difference to this guy...it's all about HIM and what HE feels, and he claims he's doing it all under Gods direction. I still feel no matter how much Godly influence he claims to be getting in his decisions, that so far, he's still acting selfishly. And based on the things he's said, I feel he's going to end up negating me going on this trip because of his selfish feelings about it, because he keeps telling me there's a decision made here in there in the near future, that I'm not going to like. A decision made, probably because we couldn't agree on it. But he can't be afraid of me, he can't be afraid of anything except for upsetting God. So all he can do, is just make sure he's a good man to me and a good husband and a good father, and try to make the best decisions possible, if we find ourselves at a fork in the decision-making Road..

I feel like he's relegated me to being the oldest child, the way he's going about this. Sure he claims to hear me and he discussed with me about how I feel, my opinions and thoughts and what not. But what's the point, when he's still sticking to his stupid logic claiming HIS reasons are more legit and HIS reasons matter more than what I desire. And then worse, he's holding out on answering me, making me wait, kind of holding it over my head that it's still undecided, teasing me with it, making jokes about "decision making", knowing how badly I want to go, how important it is and how much it means to me (and my family) to go. He tells me on one hand, he wants to be the loving, caring husband, putting me first and serving and loving me as Christ did the church...and yet, he's totally discounting (or ignoring) my wishes, desires, opinions and needs. He tells me that "it doesn't matter what my family thinks or wants, he does not care". He told me basically that what I want, desire or need, doesn't matter, because "his concerns". I've told him that a "no" answer would cause resentment and animosity, moreso than already exists, not just with me, but with our kids, and he doesn't care. And he wonders why I want to separate from him and why the kids can't wait to get away from him. How am I supposed to feel or act, if he's dead set on not allowing me to go? Am I supposed to just suck it up? Because I'm totally stressed over this, totally depressed thinking he's going to disappoint me, and thinking how can a No, be a Godly answer to me? Why would God not want me to go be a part of a family wedding?

Everyone I've talked to about this, people who know me, people who don't, all say the same thing. He is being selfish. He is being controlling. He is not being a loving, Christ-like husband. They all agree, I should be able to go to my families wedding, considering everything I've detailed thus far. They see no reason why I should be held back. They also agree his reasons are minute. And everywhere I search for how husbands and wives should interact in a Godly marriage, it seems to me (especially taking the model of my parents into account, as that is the image of marriage I respect and long to emulate), they work as a team, a unit, coming together equally to discuss wants, desires, needs, etc. And I believe the husband is to put the wife first, before his needs, wants and desires - laying down his life, if necessary. If she wanted something, his first response should not be a "No"...it should be a "Yes", unless there was some financial or scheduling conflict or something that would cause consequence to the family as a whole. And my husband does not see it that way. His initial response to anything I want, is always a "No". Then after talking about it, sometimes he gets over himself, and his opinions, and his ideas of thinking, and eventually can say yes and agree. But it's a constant fight over everything I want to do, when it's something he does not. This is a pattern that has been happening over other things, not just this trip.

Of course, then he wants a pat on the back for every "yes" he's given...it's just exhausting. It's scorekeeping and I loathe it. I can see that he's trying to be a better man, I'd be lying if I didn't admit that he has worked hard on controlling his temper and mood swings (he's Bipolar-Stage 2) and that he has done a better job communicating to me and treating me better. But I feel there is this somewhat chauvenistic approach to our marriage lately, and it feels totally out of place and wrong. I feel like he's either being taught, instructed or advised that his "headship" means he takes more control over me, or at least, that is how he's applying it. I don't feel "loved", I don't even feel trusted, and it certaily doesn't feel like a serving, sacrificial love, at all. It does not feel Christ-like. I feel like he's literally using scripture to use it over me and to control me to submit to his will, all under the guise of it being "Gods will". And his response to my objections, or concerns is typical, "Trust God, if you don't trust me", which is something you can't argue....and just feels more like manipulation, than it does Godly leadership.

Counseling - ha. That's laughable. He won't go to my church or pastor, because I'm "protestant". And I even asked him about going to one of his Priests for advice/counsel on this, but he said there's no need, because he just is going to do what God tells him....whatever that means. Truth be told, after 20 years of experience with him, I don't trust his relationship with Christ to be that strong and I don't believe he has a true connection to hear Gods word, when all he reads is his stupid Missil and never the actual Bible. And I've heard his prayers, and it's all the prewritten, memorized prayers he gets out of his missil. I'm not claiming to know his heart and I may not be there for all of his prayers, but by their fruits you shall know them, right? I'm just saying, by his fruits, I don't detect much of a personal relationship with Christ. And if he's refusing to get any counsel from his own Priest, because he can do it all on his own...where does that leave me?

I'm venting here....and I have given this issue to God, since we're called to cast all our cares and concerns to him. And I'm continually praying....but this issue is still upsetting and depressing me. It's like a big elephant in the room and talking about it, only distresses us both more and seems to further solidify his stance. I almost don't want him to give me an answer because I fear I would have to either accept it or defy it. I just wish he'd relent.
It sounds like you know that your husband is wrong and his controlling behavior is destructive. Yet you do not take action. Continuing to vent and talk about it is a way to avoid ACTION. You are going to have to take action to get control of your life back. You can’t just blame him for being a jerk if you continue to choose to accept it. You have a role to play in this unhealthy relationship. You could already be on the road to a different place but you have chosen to play a passive role. @Endeavourer has given you some great advice but you seem to prefer to complain rather than take advice and take action.
 
Upvote 0

Endeavourer

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2017
1,719
1,472
Cloud 9
✟89,718.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It sounds like you know that your husband is wrong and his controlling behavior is destructive. Yet you do not take action. Continuing to vent and talk about it is a way to avoid ACTION. You are going to have to take action to get control of your life back. You can’t just blame him for being a jerk if you continue to choose to accept it. You have a role to play in this unhealthy relationship. You could already be on the road to a different place but you have chosen to play a passive role. @Endeavourer has given you some great advice but you seem to prefer to complain rather than take advice and take action.

Lucky, I went back and read your threads. Very sad reading. Your husband is as mean and abusive today as he was then. Nothing has changed. Your threads in 2017 were also about a trip, with your husband saying you could only go if you did 30 things to compensate him, some of which were over the top sexual acts. You should go back and read your threads to see that it has always been same-old, same-old abuse of you, and always will be until you stop it.

Women tend to get irreversible autoimmune illness(es) when they are abused so long. Most autoimmune diseases are irreversible once they flare up, and the flare up can be caused by stress. Go to this site to review the menu that might be your future:
List of autoimmune diseases - Wikipedia

The longer you stay in this cycle, the more damage is being done to your health. You'd be much better off to bear up the strength to follow my advice now so you can at last have a more peaceful future. Your husband will not change. Your marriage has no hope unless you take hard action - and likely has no hope even if you do take hard action. Abusers who are that entrenched in their entitlement rarely change.

And, as for all of this "head of the household" talk you do, you profoundly misunderstand the application of 1 Cor 11:3, per your descriptions of it, and are holding yourself to a Pharisaical doctrine that is not of the Lord. The Lord's doctrines sync up with the full counsel of the rest of His Word. If any doctrine does not do so you can assume that you are suffering under a twisting of Scripture, not Scripture.
 
Upvote 0