Darwin - Half Right

MIDutch

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Well, as far as I know, that's what you are doing. I see no references.
Scientific journals, universities, museums, research laboratories, research hospitals, scientific organizations, popular magazines, etc..

There are, literally, thousands and thousands of ways you can get "references" concerning scientific evidence and research.

Creationism, OTOH, only has this one book of bronze age writings.

The world, in general, knows who's just making stuff up.
 
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AV1611VET

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Creationism, OTOH, only has this one book of bronze age writings.
Interesting that the so-called Bronze Age is considered a prehistoric era.

Prehistoric means it came before writing.

Yet one of the things Adam was able to do in his first day of existence is not only walk and talk and tend the Garden ... but write.

And years and years later, came the metallurgists.

Genesis 4:22a And Zillah, she also bare Tubalcain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron:

This means that writing came BEFORE the Bronze Age.

Meaning the Bronze Age is a joke.

Another mislabel that might fool college students, but not those who know their Bible.
 
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Brihaha

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I wonder if @timf, OP, is coming back.

That made me laugh out loud. I was wondering the same thing. I'm a recent college graduate (5 years ago) at age 46. I managed to graduate summa cum laude, but I never quite got this far in my physics class. Interesting reading thru the thread. Lots of knowledgeable people kinda left many of us behind. I do remember there's four steps to the scientific process. Documenting the results is extremely important. Perhaps that is why his peers couldn't endorse that fellows research book. If he had trouble quantifying his terms, one can surmise the data is suspect as well. The scientific process is supposed to minimize variables so results can be replicated. I'm enjoying my new environs here. It is quite refreshing to have rational discourse and disagreement without the childish name-calling and insults. Have a good day my friend.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Interesting that the so-called Bronze Age is considered a prehistoric era.

Prehistoric means it came before writing.

Yet one of the things Adam was able to do in his first day of existence is not only walk and talk and tend the Garden ... but write.

And years and years later, came the metallurgists.

Genesis 4:22a And Zillah, she also bare Tubalcain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron:

This means that writing came BEFORE the Bronze Age.

Meaning the Bronze Age is a joke.

Another mislabel that might fool college students, but not those who know their Bible.

Who says that "Bronze age = before writing"?

The general definition of "pre-historic" is before written records.

The general definition of "Bronze Age" is a technology using bronze (alloy of tin & copper) for tools and weapons rather than stones tools or iron tools. There are also usually an intermediate period between stone and bronze with copper tools prior to the discovery of the copper alloy (or due to a lack of tin).

There are many "Old World" literate, Bronze Age civilizations: Sumerians, Akkadians, Minoans*, Indus Valley civilization*, Assyrians, Amorites, Egyptians (Old, Middle, and New Kingdoms), Hittites, Eblaites, and Hurrians, to name a few.

Bronze/Iron isn't the "historical" divider, it is writing (as you noted correctly).

The OT isn't the product of Bronze-age goatherders (another part of the invective some times used) but of Iron-age scribes.

Quit trying to discredit scholarly terms by misusing them, about evolution or history.

*Texts not deciphered by modern scholars.
 
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AV1611VET

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Who says that "Bronze age = before writing"?

The general definition of "pre-historic" is before written records.
QV please:
The Bronze Age is a prehistoric period that was characterized by the use of bronze, in some areas proto-writing, and other early features of urban civilization.

SOURCE
Prehistory, also known as pre-literary history, is the period of human history between the use of the first stone tools by hominins c. 3.3 million years ago and the invention of writing systems.

SOURCE
 
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Hans Blaster

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It looks like the Wikipedia editors have some clean up to do. I got my list by going through various Bronze Age civilizations and identifying the ones that had writing.

Also, read the *second* paragraph of the second article you quoted (on pre-history).
 
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sjastro

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Interesting that the so-called Bronze Age is considered a prehistoric era.

Prehistoric means it came before writing.

Yet one of the things Adam was able to do in his first day of existence is not only walk and talk and tend the Garden ... but write.

And years and years later, came the metallurgists.

Genesis 4:22a And Zillah, she also bare Tubalcain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron:

This means that writing came BEFORE the Bronze Age.

Meaning the Bronze Age is a joke.

Another mislabel that might fool college students, but not those who know their Bible.
Your interpretation of the verse is a joke.
If this is supposed to be a reference to the Bronze Age then why does Tubalcain also work in iron?
That's why it was called the Bronze Age because the technology of extracting iron from ores was unknown let alone working with it.
 
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Frank Robert

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Scientific journals, universities, museums, research laboratories, research hospitals, scientific organizations, popular magazines, etc..

There are, literally, thousands and thousands of ways you can get "references" concerning scientific evidence and research.

Creationism, OTOH, only has this one book of bronze age writings.

The world, in general, knows who's just making stuff up.
@renniks constintly complains about other commenters not including references but he doesn't appear to include any sources himself, he just alludes to reading books.
 
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sjastro

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Your interpretation of the verse is a joke.
If this is supposed to be a reference to the Bronze Age then why does Tubalcain also work in iron?
That's why it was called the Bronze Age because the technology of extracting iron from ores was unknown let alone working with it.
An example where a iron object appearing in a bronze age civilization is Tutankhamun's dagger.

dagger.jpg

The iron was not produced by smelting, the source of the iron was from a meteorite.
Analysis of the metal using XRF (X-Ray Fluorescence) spectroscopy indicated the presence of Ni (nickel) along with Fe (iron) which is the chemical signature for an iron meteorite.

46f7e9cd-7c46-4df1-ab75-19a2ced2b914.jpg
Another illustration of the power of science.
 
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Subduction Zone

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So, since you say he didn't 'do any of this, I assume you studied his books and articles? Or are you just parroting something you read on the internet?
Actually if he did so it is once again your job to find it. I don't expect you to accept my example about his book on genetic entropy. If I feel like doing a massive Google search I might try to find the article, but it does not really matter. It was merely an explanation of why his book is not peer reviewed.
 
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MIDutch

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Yet one of the things Adam was able to do in his first day of existence is not only walk and talk and tend the Garden ... but write.
This is your belief because of what you read in that book. There is nothing, repeat, nothing outside of the ink in that book that show it is true.
 
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AV1611VET

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This is your belief because of what you read in that book. There is nothing, repeat, nothing outside of the ink in that book that show it is true.
That "ink in that book" is all I need.

That's how God set it up, and that's how it works.

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Even better than an eyewitness from the dead.

Luke 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
 
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MIDutch

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That "ink in that book" is all I need.
I have never found it convincing, even when I was a wee lad of 7 or 8.

TThat's how God set it up, and that's how it works.
So you believe the book is right about god because god wrote the book about the book being right about god.

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Even better than an eyewitness from the dead.

Luke 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
In other words, "the Bible is right because it says right in the Bible that the Bible is right".
 
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AV1611VET

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I have never found it convincing, even when I was a wee lad of 7 or 8.

So you believe the book is right about god because god wrote the book about the book being right about god.

In other words, "the Bible is right because it says right in the Bible that the Bible is right".
God gives us all what you might call a "sixth sense" that we can experience His convictions.

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

Some resist that pull and end up you know where.

Hebrews 10:39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

Aside from that, we experience:

Psalm 34:8 O taste and see that the LORD is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in him.

Psalm 51:12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation;

Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,


I wouldn't call that circular reasoning.
 
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AV1611VET

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I have never found it convincing, even when I was a wee lad of 7 or 8.
It could be that you reached your Age of Accountability at that age and decided, for whatever reason, to go your own way.

Don't worry though, God hasn't given up on you.

Hebrews 3:15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.

2 Corinthians 6:2 ( For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. )

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
 
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