BobRyan said:
I agree that the domination seen in the days of "The Holy Roman Empire" no longer exists for the Catholic Church (though its deadly wound has yet to fully heal) - but you can see persecution of non-Catholics in central and south America when it comes to government , politics etc. But my claim about Dan 7 is not that "just the RCC persecutes" it is that "persecution itself" -- the fact of Christianity under persecution -- even in cases where it is Catholics being persecuted by atheist or communist states - etc. All forms of persecution against Christians will continue until that Dan 7 judgment completes
Bob, I will post here, your 3rd statement of post #1. 3. "The (little horn) persecution of the saints does not stop until after the judgment completes. So it is the key to ending that problem of the little horn."
You even bolden, "does not stop until after the judgment completes. Which I questioned because as I understand it, it is not according to prophecy. Your response is above.
In your response above you state, "I agree that the domination seen in the days of "The Holy Roman Empire" no longer exists for the Catholic Church." So then, you are in agreement with me? If so then perhaps you should consider reediting your 3rd statement in your original post for clarity.
The reason I don't do that is that in Rev 13 and in Dan 7 we have statements that make the little horn problem more expansive than just the 11th horn RCC. Bigger than just the 1260 year problem.
Dan 7:
11 Then I kept looking because of the sound of the
boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was killed, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. 12
As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away
, but an extension of life was granted to them for an appointed period of time.
that horn was
waging war with the saints and prevailing against them, 22
until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was passed in favor of the saints of the Highest One, and the time arrived when the saints took possession of the kingdom.
and another will arise after them, and he will be different from the previous ones and will humble three kings. 25 And he will speak against the Most High
and wear down the saints of the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and in law; and they will be handed over to him for a time, times, and half a time. 26
But the court will convene for judgment, and his dominion will be taken away, annihilated and destroyed forever. 27
Then the sovereignty, the dominion, and the greatness of
all the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be given to the people of the saints of the Highest One; His kingdom
will be an everlasting kingdom
"some" Identifiers in Dan 7 - details
1. Little horn - 11th horn
2. Uproots 3 of the initial 10 horns
3. Little horn may be recognized as tormenting saints for a 1260 year period of time
4. But torment of saints continues (in whatever form) -- until the court/judgment event completes
5. All the 4 beasts continue on PAST their time "An extension of life given them"
* nothing in Dan 7 says that the judgment must complete within the 1260. But the text is very clear that when it does complete all torment ends.
Rev 13:
Then I saw a beast coming up out of the sea, having ten horns and seven heads, and on his horns
were ten crowns, and on his heads
were blasphemous names. 2 And the beast that I saw was like a leopard, and his feet were like
those of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. And the dragon gave him his power and his throne, and great authority. 3
I saw one of his heads as if it had been fatally wounded, and his fatal wound was healed. And the whole earth was amazed
and followed after the beast; 4 they worshiped the dragon because he gave his authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who is able to wage war with him?” 5 A mouth was given to him speaking arrogant words and blasphemies,
and authority to act for forty-two months was given to him. 6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemies against God, to blaspheme His name and His tabernacle,
that is, those who dwell in heaven.
7 It was also
given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority was given to him over every tribe, people, language, and nation.
1. All 4 beasts of Dan 7 represented in part in the composite beast of Rev 13:1-2
2. The Rev 13 composite beast torments for the SAME 1260 period as in Dan 7 -
3. Composite Rev 13 beast specifically torments saints.
4. That composite beast is the first of TWO beasts that bring in the end-time scenario of the mark of the beast.
* Nothing in Rev 13 says the composite beast ends after 1260 years just that it is known as the one that specifically tormented saints for that period.