Could it be possible that John was wrong?

[woobadooba]

"And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." (Rev 20:10)

Why would he use the word "tormented", within the context of eternal judgment?

I am troubled by this verse. There are many passages in the Bible that indicate that the wicked will be destroyed. So why would John use such a word as "tormented"?

It seems to me that he was either wrong, that this is an unwarranted addition by an impostor, or I am just simply not understanding him.

Any thoughts?

Please note that I am aware of all of the passages that we use to support our position on hell and the lake of fire. I would like to address this passage, not the others, since this passage does not seem to agree with the other ones.

 

[moicherie]

In order to answer this what was the orignal language that John wrote? John did not speak or write 15th century English.

 

[woobadooba]

So tell me what the Greek says.

 

[moicherie]

So tell me what the Greek says.

I don't know, that's why I responded thus. I'm sure someone on the board can tell us.

 

[woobadooba]

I don't know, that's why I responded thus. I'm sure someone on the board can tell us.

Truth is, the Greek says the same thing. So now where do we go?

 

[moicherie]

Truth is, the Greek says the same thing. So now where do we go?

why not copy paste the Greek here?

 

[honorthesabbath]

Woob--we are told that there will be a season of torment for the wicked. The bible makes it clear that will be degree's of punishment--to fit the crime so to speak.

But the wicked WILL eventualy die in the flames. My understanding is that satan burns the longest as the flames also 'come from within him". Mal.4

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

Like most Greek words there are a few meanings.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]The KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica] Strong's Number: 928[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica] Browse Lexicon[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Original Word[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Word Origin[/FONT] basanivzw[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]from (931)[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Transliterated Word[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]TDNT Entry[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Basanizo[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]1:561,96[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Phonetic Spelling[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Parts of Speech[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]bas-an-id'-zo [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Verb [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica] Definition[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica] [/FONT]

1. [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]
   [*] to test (metals) by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal
   [*] to question by applying torture
   [*] to torture
   [*] to vex with grievous pains (of body or mind), to torment
   [*] to be harassed, distressed
   1. of those who at sea are struggling with a head wind
   [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica] King James Word Usage - Total: 12[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]torment 8, pain 1, toss 1, vex 1, toil 1[/FONT]

 

[Mankin]

I am troubled by this verse as well. Notice, it says the Devil will be tormented not people.

 

[JonMiller]

Image

Devil, not people

One verse, I don't think it is correct to consider just one verse

JM

 

[TrustAndObey]

Woob, I think it's along the same lines as wailing and gnashing of teeth. There will be torment, but it won't be forever.

The biggest torment is knowing you (not you personally...."you" in general) could've had everything, but you chose the things of this world instead.

 

[Endium]

I'm not really sure, but this is what came to my mind when I first read your post.

The people described in this post will be going through the second death. In order to see in what way they are tormented, we must look at what happened to the only other person who died the second death, which was Jesus.

Now we we think of the excruciating experience Jesus went through (I'm not talking about the physical pain either) then that can certainly be described as being tormented.

What tormented Jesus was the fact that God had turned His back on Him. The separation from God was the real torment that Jesus felt, and it is what eventually killed Him.

So I think whatever torment the lost will go through will be the torment of coming face to face with the fact that God has turned His back on your and you are forever separated from Him. That's the worst torment that anyone could ever experience.

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

The people described in this post will be going through the second death. In order to see in what way they are tormented, we must look at what happened to the only other person who died the second death, which was Jesus.

There is however noting in the Bible to indicate that Jesus experienced or as you said "going through" the second death. Obviously if the definition of the second death is a death from which there is no resurrection you can't say Jesus died that. Unfortunately the Larger View people have accepted the extra Biblical idea that Jesus died the second death and it leads to some major distortions.

The amazingly cryptic book of Revelation was not really likely meant to lead to all the speculations that many people have read into its pages. In fact the expectations of what God might do instead of what He has done is probably one of the main causes for people to reject Christianity.