continuing churches

[Esdra]

hi

can that be that there are more evangelical and more Catholic continuing Anglican churches?
so continuing doesn't automatically mean Anglo-Catholic, as I've always thought?

and low church and high church also exists?

and another question: how do I have to imagine a high church, evangelical church service?

esdra

 

[Merrily]

hi

can that be that there are more evangelical and more Catholic continuing Anglican churches?
so continuing doesn't automatically mean Anglo-Catholic, as I've always thought?

and low church and high church also exists?

and another question: how do I have to imagine a high church, evangelical church service?

esdra

Some of the continuing Anglican denominations are quite 'low' church.
Here in England the Free Church of England Evangelical Connexion is one such as is the Church of England ( Continuing).

 

[Willie T]

Boy..... I had to go look that one up. For any of you reading, that like me, had no idea what they were talking about...... A "Continuing" church is basically a "split-off" from the original parent denomination. Usually because of a disagreement in some part of the doctrine.

 

[ebia]

Boy..... I had to go look that one up. For any of you reading, that like me, had no idea what they were talking about...... A "Continuing" church is basically a "split-off" from the original parent denomination. Usually because of a disagreement in some part of the doctrine.

Presumably callling oneself Continuing [Anglican] is meant to imply that the rest of us have ceased to be Anglican

 

[Albion]

hi

can that be that there are more evangelical and more Catholic continuing Anglican churches?

That's right, although most are on the Catholic-leaning side of things.

so continuing doesn't automatically mean Anglo-Catholic, as I've always thought?

No. It means that the validity of the Apostolic Succession has been maintained.

The Continuing Anglican movement came into existence believing that the ordination of women to the priesthood in The Episcopal Church and the Anglican Church of Canada represented an interruption of their episcopal lineage. That's what "Continuing" (at least in the Anglican case) means.

and low church and high church also exists?

Yes.

and another question: how do I have to imagine a high church, evangelical church service?

esdra

If you're asking if such a thing is possible, the answer is 'Yes." But it is not common. "High Church" means ceremonial. "Evangelical" means Protestant in doctrine, specifically adherence to the Thirty-nine Articles. It is possible to be both or neither. The original Anglo-Catholics, for example, were Low Churchmen.

Some of the continuing Anglican denominations are quite 'low' church.
Here in England the Free Church of England Evangelical Connexion is one such as is the Church of England ( Continuing).

And we should probably add the Free Church of England to that list also.

 

[Esdra]

hi

Thanks to all of you for your answers first of all.

If you're asking if such a thing is possible, the answer is 'Yes." But it is not common. "High Church" means ceremonial. "Evangelical" means Protestant in doctrine, specifically adherence to the Thirty-nine Articles. It is possible to be both or neither. The original Anglo-Catholics, for example, were Low Churchmen.

Albion, really? The original Anglo-Catholics were Low Church?
I think I have a completely wrong picture of the Anglican Church.
I've always thought that Anglo-Catholics means that they are more or less "liberal Roman Catholics", with the (Anglican/British) liturgy. With incense, and liturgical clothes and candles and everything.
Apparently Anglicanism is more influenced by the Reformation (especially from the Reformed spectrum) than I've thought. Is that correct?

Low Church means for me more or less a church service as the Prebyterians or Reformed would have, with the pastors wearing a cassock and (probably) a stole, and no incense, and less candles.

Esdra

 

[Albion]

hi

Thanks to all of you for your answers first of all.



Albion, really? The original Anglo-Catholics were Low Church?

Yes. And, by that same token, I know Anglicans who are very much Evangelicals in belief but go in for lots of ceremony at the same time.

I think I have a completely wrong picture of the Anglican Church.
I've always thought that Anglo-Catholics means that they are more or less "liberal Roman Catholics", with the (Anglican/British) liturgy. With incense, and liturgical clothes and candles and everything.

It sounds like you're describing "High Church" Anglicans there, not Anglo-Catholics per se. Usually, of course, those who see the nature of the church as a non-Roman kind of Catholic church tend to worship in the style of 'other' Catholics. There's a certain logic to that, but the two terms are not interchangeable, even if many people do use them that way.

Apparently Anglicanism is more influenced by the Reformation (especially from the Reformed spectrum) than I've thought. Is that correct?

Apparently. But I didn't realize this before.

Low Church means for me more or less a church service as the Prebyterians or Reformed would have, with the pastors wearing a cassock and (probably) a stole, and no incense, and less candles.

Roughly speaking, that's probably fair to say. However, the main difference is that Low Church Anglicans still use the Book of Common Prayer, so there is a very Catholic-like RITUAL being followed. It's not unlike the Lutheran liturgy. The Reformed churches OTOH have a certain standard format for worship, but it's not what we'd call "Liturgical."

 

[MKJ]

i wouldn't really be quick to describe either high or low church, or more catholic or evangelical Anglicans as being like liberal Catholics. Some are for sure, but that isn't a necessary connection.

In fact if I were to say any type of Anglican is more likely to be like a "liberal Roman Catholic", I would say it was the very middle of the road sorts that wouldn't identify with any of those names.

 

[Yardstick]

hi

Thanks to all of you for your answers first of all.



Albion, really? The original Anglo-Catholics were Low Church?
I think I have a completely wrong picture of the Anglican Church.
I've always thought that Anglo-Catholics means that they are more or less "liberal Roman Catholics", with the (Anglican/British) liturgy. With incense, and liturgical clothes and candles and everything.
Apparently Anglicanism is more influenced by the Reformation (especially from the Reformed spectrum) than I've thought. Is that correct?

Low Church means for me more or less a church service as the Prebyterians or Reformed would have, with the pastors wearing a cassock and (probably) a stole, and no incense, and less candles.

Esdra

There are certainly strands within Anglicanism that are heavily influenced by Reformed theology. Really though, the 39 Articles are meant to reign in the extremes of Reformed and Roman doctrines both.

I've also never heard 'Evangelical' used to mean an adherence to the 39 Articles but rather describes a certain kind of piety. On the other hand the Oxford Movement wasn't trying to do away with the articles either.

I can't speak to whether those in the Oxford Movement were high or low churchmen but I can say that I have personally never seen a church or member that self described as Anglo-Catholic not also be of a High Church persuasion. Albion is right though that the two ideas are not necessarily connected.

 

[MKJ]

There are certainly strands within Anglicanism that are heavily influenced by Reformed theology. Really though, the 39 Articles are meant to reign in the extremes of Reformed and Roman doctrines both.

I've also never heard 'Evangelical' used to mean an adherence to the 39 Articles but rather describes a certain kind of piety. On the other hand the Oxford Movement wasn't trying to do away with the articles either.

I can't speak to whether those in the Oxford Movement were high or low churchmen but I can say that I have personally never seen a church or member that self described as Anglo-Catholic not also be of a High Church persuasion. Albion is right though that the two ideas are not necessarily connected.

Well, the members of the Oxford movement weren't all inclined to be particularly hoity-toity. You might say that there theology of worship was in some ways compatible with a high church approach, and I think it would be fair to say it is incompatible with a lot of modern evangelical thoughts on worship. But I think what you see among a lot of modern Anglo-Catholics is really something quite different. It almost seems to be an aesthetic more than a theological decision.

 

[Rurik]

It almost seems to be an aesthetic more than a theological decision.

Bingo and they seem to want to ignore larg parts of the church's history to believe what they want & carry on at everybody they disagree with

 

[Yardstick]

Bingo and they seem to want to ignore larg parts of the church's history to believe what they want & carry on at everybody they disagree with

I'm not sure what you mean. Could you explain in more detail?

 

[FireDragon76]

Here in Central Florida you will find several examples of "Evangelical high church", Episcopalian congregations.

 

[Albion]

I've also never heard 'Evangelical' used to mean an adherence to the 39 Articles but rather describes a certain kind of piety.

Used in a general , non-denominational sense, yes. However, Protestant-leaning Anglicans are most often referred to (or refer to themselves) as "Evangelical Anglicans" when distinguishing themselves from Anglo-Catholics.

On the other hand the Oxford Movement wasn't trying to do away with the articles either.

Well, sure. They couldn't just come out for doing that, so they reinterpreted them to mean something other than they had meant before. That's why "Evangelical Anglicans" often qualify what they believe by saying "the Articles in their original sense" (or something like that).

I can't speak to whether those in the Oxford Movement were high or low churchmen but I can say that I have personally never seen a church or member that self described as Anglo-Catholic not also be of a High Church persuasion.

And of course I can't speak for whom you've met in life, but I certainly know High Churchmen who are also Evangelical Anglicans. I woud agree (and already have) that if one is an Anglo-Catholic he most logically is also going to be a child of the so-called Ritualist Movement that, historically, developed shortly after the Oxford Movement made its mark.

 

[RickardoHolmes]

I perused the website of the Diocese where I live. I found One High Church, several broad churches and the rest (majority) were small evangelical or low churches.

I love the High Church, and will travel downtown past churches which are closer to attend it, and happily, I am not the only one.

 

[MKJ]

Bingo and they seem to want to ignore larg parts of the church's history to believe what they want & carry on at everybody they disagree with

Generaly those types of congregations are practicing a very liberal sort of Christianity - almost UU in some cases. They don't really see anything intrinsically important in the tradition of the Church or Scripture for that matter. The high church usages speak to them aesthetically, and so they squeeze a little spiritual sustenance from that.

They are not the same as either those who are wanna-be Romans, or that come out of the Oxford movement, both of whom are interested in the theology.

 

[RickardoHolmes]

Generaly those types of congregations are practicing a very liberal sort of Christianity - almost UU in some cases. They don't really see anything intrinsically important in the tradition of the Church or Scripture for that matter. The high church usages speak to them aesthetically, and so they squeeze a little spiritual sustenance from that.

They are not the same as either those who are wanna-be Romans, or that come out of the Oxford movement, both of whom are interested in the theology.

I am an aestheticist. Always have been. But i am interested in the theology as well. The preservation of the Mass is something which I have long respected about the Episcopal church. THe mysticism surrounding the theology, that is what appeals most to me. May not be so for everyone, but the great thing about God speaking to each of us in just the way that we can be reached is Divine.

 

[Albion]

I am an aestheticist. Always have been.

You specialize in skin beautification?

 

[crimsonleaf]

You specialize in skin beautification?

Oh, for a LIKE button...

 

[luckyfredsdad]

According to a friend of mine who is in an American Continuing Church,the Anglican Catholic Church, there are three,'Continuing Churches,' who are the result of the Discussions held several years ago that resulted in the Declaration of S.Louis. By this they understand these continuing Churches to be those who hold to ancient doctrines of the Church as put forward at the Congress of S.Louis and are in communion with each other. These three plus a more recent development stemming from later sesession from the Neo Anglicanism of the modern American Church form the,"Continuing Church, all the others are simply believed to be protestant sects.