Cinema World Views

[Resha Caner]

How much variety do you see in the world view of the films you watch?

 

[durangodawood]

Once in a while I feel like going to see a movie. So I see whats on and the local multiplex has 3 of 9 screens playing the same crappy superhero movie. Then theres maybe 2 horror flicks and 3 semi lame Pixar knockoff sequels.

So I stay home and watch a Netflix series instead.

 

[essentialsaltes]

For broad appeal on the world market, I doubt most films have much of a 'worldview', other than platitudes about good and evil, striving for a goal, boy meets boy, that sort of thing. There are 'message' films, but their message is usually pretty simple and not part of a larger worldview.

I doubt we'll see a remake of Birth of a Nation, but I've seen Birth of a Nation.

 

[Nithavela]

How much variety do you see in the world view of the films you watch?

This year I watched one single film, Deadpool 2.

So.. not much, I guess.

 

[Resha Caner]

So I stay home and watch a Netflix series instead.

So then apply the question to what you watch on Netflix.

 

[Resha Caner]

For broad appeal on the world market, I doubt most films have much of a 'worldview', other than platitudes about good and evil, striving for a goal, boy meets boy, that sort of thing. There are 'message' films, but their message is usually pretty simple and not part of a larger worldview.

I didn't mean specific message films. Is it possible to create a film that doesn't have a worldview? I wouldn't think that's the case, so I'll ask how much variety you see in these platitudes you mentioned.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Is it possible to create a film that doesn't have a worldview? I wouldn't think that's the case, so I'll ask how much variety you see in these platitudes you mentioned.

Films that are meant to appeal to a broad audience would not seem very likely to have a well-defined distinct worldview.

Does Solaris (1972) have a Communist worldview? Does Solaris (2002) have a capitalist worldview? Not that I can see.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

Most films have a worldview- except for certain types of indie/art films. I look at a variety of films because I enjoy other cultures and Hollywood is in a rut. We watch a fair amount of Asian movies in our household- Chinese, Korean & Japanese specifically.

 

[Resha Caner]

Films that are meant to appeal to a broad audience would not seem very likely to have a well-defined distinct worldview.

Does Solaris (1972) have a Communist worldview? Does Solaris (2002) have a capitalist worldview? Not that I can see.

I've not seen those films, so I can't comment. Remakes are a great way to look at this question, though. So what are the differences between those two films?

I saw an excellent comparison of the different versions of A Star is Born that shows how views on the roles of men and women have changed, views of alcoholism, views about music, even views about profanity.

I've done similar things with one of my wife's favorite movies: The King and I, comparing 3 different film versions, and one of my favorite movies Walter Mitty, comparing 2 different film versions.

 

[Resha Caner]

Most films have a worldview- except for certain types of indie/art films. I look at a variety of films because I enjoy other cultures and Hollywood is in a rut. We watch a fair amount of Asian movies in our household- Chinese, Korean & Japanese specifically.

The cross-cultural thing is interesting as well. It was fascinating to compare The Debt (2010, British) with The Debt (2007, Israeli).

So, are you tired of Hollywood because you think the rut is unoriginal or because you don't like the view presented by those films?

 

[essentialsaltes]

I saw an excellent comparison of the different versions of A Star is Born that shows how views on the roles of men and women have changed, views of alcoholism, views about music, even views about profanity.

I guess I don't see these as worldview (which I find a vague term anyway). This is culture. Modern American films reflect a modern American culture. More guns but fewer boobies than European films.

 

[Resha Caner]

I guess I don't see these as worldview (which I find a vague term anyway). This is culture. Modern American films reflect a modern American culture. More guns but fewer boobies than European films.

Granted it's a vague term, and I'm not sure I can clarify it much. Still, I guess IMO the term means almost anything that influences how you interact with other people. Culture is part of that. Don't different cultures view the world in different ways? Though you say the term is vague, it's not so vague that you don't have an opinion that culture should be excluded from the definition. Why do you think that?

And I'm still curious what differences you see in your example of different versions of Solaris?

 

[essentialsaltes]

And I'm still curious what differences you see in your example of different versions of Solaris?

Couldn't say. I was bored by the original and haven't seen the remake. I was just trying to find a comparison of 'the same' film made with different worldviews.

 

[Resha Caner]

Couldn't say.

OK. Well, if you've got an example for something you've seen and recall effectively, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

 

[Resha Caner]

This year I watched one single film, Deadpool 2.

Sorry. Better luck next year.

 

[essentialsaltes]

OK. Well, if you've got an example for something you've seen and recall effectively, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Perhaps the best example I can think of is Seven Samurai and the Magnificent Seven (1960). Both are great movies (Seven Samurai often makes critics' best of all time lists). The Magnificent Seven is, I think, a quite faithful adaptation of the original. The themes of honor, protecting the weak, the humble nobility of ordinary farmers are all there. It's too much for me to juggle 14 people, but clearly some of the characters are direct analogues of each other, with their own stories.

Obviously there are differences when your settings are feudal Japan and the Wild West. Race is a minor issue in The Wild West that doesn't exist (so far as I can see) in Seven Samurai. But largely these differences are just set dressing: swords for sixguns, kimonos for leather. The stories and worldview are quite similar (though perhaps this wouldn't be the case for a less faithful or unfaithful adaptation, like the more recent Magnificent Seven).

A reviewer's take.

 

[RDKirk]

Perhaps the best example I can think of is Seven Samurai and the Magnificent Seven (1960). Both are great movies (Seven Samurai often makes critics' best of all time lists). The Magnificent Seven is, I think, a quite faithful adaptation of the original. The themes of honor, protecting the weak, the humble nobility of ordinary farmers are all there. It's too much for me to juggle 14 people, but clearly some of the characters are direct analogues of each other, with their own stories.

Obviously there are differences when your settings are feudal Japan and the Wild West. Race is a minor issue in The Wild West that doesn't exist (so far as I can see) in Seven Samurai. But largely these differences are just set dressing: swords for sixguns, kimonos for leather. The stories and worldview are quite similar (though perhaps this wouldn't be the case for a less faithful or unfaithful adaptation, like the more recent Magnificent Seven).

A reviewer's take.

Cowboys and samurai (particularly ronin) share enough similarities that the stories swap easily between the countries. I once explained the plot of Shane to a Japanese guy, and he immediately "got it" as a ronin story.

 

[RDKirk]

The most consistent moral worldviews I see in American cinema are either dualistic or vague Buddhist/Hindu.

European cinema tends to be more nihilist.

 

[Resha Caner]

I once explained the plot of Shane to a Japanese guy, and he immediately "got it" as a ronin story.

Sure. I've never thought one culture is so different from another that we can't get the larger themes. But it has been my experience that we often misunderstand the more subtle differences.

Perhaps the best example I can think of is Seven Samurai and the Magnificent Seven (1960). Both are great movies ...

Agreed.

But largely these differences are just set dressing: swords for sixguns, kimonos for leather.

I would disagree the differences are irrelevant. The review you referenced was a good one. I liked the attention to detail.

However, you've answered my ulterior question, so I appreciate that.

 

[Resha Caner]

The most consistent moral worldviews I see in American cinema are either dualistic or vague Buddhist/Hindu.

I'm curious specifically what dualism you mean. I've found a certain amount of dualism necessary to make sense of the world, but there are so many different kinds it's hard to know which is at play.

With respect to the presence of Eastern mysticism, I would agree. I sometimes get the impression the filmmaker considers it a benign religion that allows him to either heighten the tension through mystery, slip in a deus ex machina, or pacify audiences who hold religious sympathies.

The psychologist in me sees other issues at play, however. So what about you? Do you think mystical themes are without consequence - without impact on the thinking of the audience?