Christians.. desecrating the Sabbath

CaliforniaJosiah · May 22, 2008

Jefell said:
CLEARLY... God wants us to keep the Sabbath holy.. not Sunday which we worship on because of the believed ressurection of Jesus.

I must have missed it. Where are the Scriptures that state we must publically/corporally worship on each Saturday and only on Saturday?

Yeah, I see the thing about keeping the Sabbath and not working on the Sabbath - and I DO try to get Saturdays off. What does that have to do with corporate/public worship? BTW, as the son of a minister, I can ASSURE you, pastors WORK - HARD - every Sunday (good thing it's not the Sabbath or I guess you'd argue they are all sinning).

.

LittleLambofJesus · May 22, 2008

stone said:
Well, just so you know, Jesus was NOT kosher.

Kosher is a word invented by rabbinical jews. What is written in the torah and what is written in the Talmud, are two different things. One is man made, the other is from god.

I once thought about saying to the Jews and Muslims they both need to burn their books, the Koran of the Muslims and the Talmud of the Jews.
But then I would be called "anti-semite", and either "beheaded" by the one or ostracized by the other. I have friends from both religions but we rarely talk about religion too much and just enjoy life and family get togethers.

Better to just argue the Bible with fellow Christians on CF for now.

http://christianforums.com/showthread.php?t=7164949&page=2
DO NOT WEEP!!!!! The Great City

Luke 19:41 And as He nears, beholding the City and He laments/eklausen <2799> (5656) over Her, 42 saying, "That if thou-knew, and thou, even indeed in the day, this, the toward Peace of thee, now yet it was Hid from thy eyes.

Reve 18:9 and shall be lamenting/klausontai <2799> (5695) and shall be wailing over Her the kings of the land, the ones with her fornicating and indulging, whenever they may be observing the smoke of the refining fire/purwsewV <4451> of Her

New_Wineskin · May 23, 2008

quote:
how do we include these verses into our theology..... (if the sabbath is not meant to be observed by christians)....

Why would those *need* to be included in my theology ? If there *was* a *need* , then I certainly would have to observe the Law for obtaining righteousness . Certainly , all those that quote a single sentence or phrase from the Scriptures as being a *must* to be observed *should* also observe *every* command in the Scriptures - all or nothing . Otherwise it is merely picking and choosing .

So , you are correct ... for those that claim that the Scriptures have *any* authority - that means *all* - including the Law - including the passages in the OP which state that those who see another violating the Sabbath are required to make sure that they are put to death . Violating that one command is violating the Sabbath and all of the Scriptures .

calluna · May 23, 2008

CaliforniaJosiah said:
pastors WORK - HARD - every Sunday

And their children joke that they work only one day a week.

And maybe they have a point. For false churches, led by people who are political appointees, exposure to real Christians would very soon show them up as what they are. The historic archetype of the 'priest', still with us, is of one who is essentially mysterious, because he has no children to joke and bring him down to earth. He has no normal clothes, except where he is well away from his 'flock'. And his public face is usually for an hour or so every seven days, 0.6% of his time, maybe 1.2% of the time he could reasonably be available and exposed. He performs on a raised part of a special building, while the common people sit in chairs nailed down so that they have to face him in his special moment. Even then, he hides himself behind a screen, dressed in even more special clothing that those folk do not have any hope of aspiring to. And recites liturgy, formulaic stuff that he did not write!

'Sunday' has pagan origins, and has pagan use, the prop of the pretender.

Celticflower · May 23, 2008

calluna said:
And their children joke that they work only one day a week.

And maybe they have a point. For false churches, led by people who are political appointees, exposure to real Christians would very soon show them up as what they are. The historic archetype of the 'priest', still with us, is of one who is essentially mysterious, because he has no children to joke and bring him down to earth. He has no normal clothes, except where he is well away from his 'flock'. And his public face is usually for an hour or so every seven days, 0.6% of his time, maybe 1.2% of the time he could reasonably be available and exposed. He performs on a raised part of a special building, while the common people sit in chairs nailed down so that they have to face him in his special moment. Even then, he hides himself behind a screen, dressed in even more special clothing that those folk do not have any hope of aspiring to. And recites liturgy, formulaic stuff that he did not write!

'Sunday' has pagan origins, and has pagan use, the prop of the pretender.

I've known a few priests in my time (as well as many ministers) and NONE of them fit the mold you describe. Some Catholic priests have mass every day of the week, not just on Sundays. Then there are the hospital visitations, home visitations, casual time at the local coffee shop, yardwork.... all very public and very visible. Heck, when my Mom was in the hospital once the nurse who came to her room thought Mom had taken a bad turn and no one informed her. She walked in to find two Methodist ministers ( one a former minister from our church, the other the District Super), a Catholic Priest and an Episcopal priest (from the other churches in our town) praying together around her bed. No special robes or liturgy, just 4 men of God praying together over a woman they all knew. And while a catholic priest may have no children of his own to "bring him down to earth" there are plenty of kids within the church who will do just that. My friend's son does with their priest -- constantly.

Maybe you need to get out more and meet some real people from other churches before being so heavy handed in your condemnation of them.

calluna · May 23, 2008

Celticflower said:
I've known a few priests in my time

When does your time begin?

If posters would read to comprehend, the standard of debate could rise considerably.

PROPHECYKID · May 23, 2008

I must have missed it. Where are the Scriptures that state we must publically/corporally worship on each Saturday and only on Saturday?

No scripture says that directly. But John 4:16 says that it was Jesus' custom to find himself in the synagogue every Sabbath and somewhere in acts states that it was Paul's habit to be in the synagogue every Sabbath as well. So we are just following the example and it is a very good example.

to get Saturdays of Yeah, I see the thing about keeping the Sabbath and not working on the Sabbath - and I DO try f. What does that have to do with corporate/public worship? BTW, as the son of a minister, I can ASSURE you, pastors WORK - HARD - every Sunday (good thing it's not the Sabbath or I guess you'd argue they are all sinning).

They are doing good like Jesus did when he healed on the Sabbath so it is not wrong. The corporate public worship again comes from the examples of Jesus and Paul and also God himself says that he will want public/corporate worship.

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

This doesn't mean that God will not want worship on any other day. Of course he will. The question is not whether we should only worship on Saturday or if it is wrong to worship on any other day but it whether the Sabbath is kept holy or not. Many Sabbath keepers make the mistake of saying that Sunday worship is wrong but that is not what they really mean to say. What they mean is observance of Sunday and neglection of the Sabbath is wrong.

.[/quote]

Celticflower · May 23, 2008

calluna said:
When does your time begin?

If posters would read to comprehend, the standard of debate could rise considerably.
[/B]

My time began in 1962 -- how about yours?

calluna · May 23, 2008

PROPHECYKID said:
No scripture says that directly. But John 4:16 says that it was Jesus' custom to find himself in the synagogue every Sabbath and somewhere in acts states that it was Paul's habit to be in the synagogue every Sabbath as well. So we are just following the example and it is a very good example.

Where is Scriptural command for synagogues?

MamaZ · May 23, 2008

Paul exhorts us to not to forget the assembling of ourselves together.. He does not say that we are to keep one day more holy than the next.. For all days are Holy unto the Lord.. For He is the creator of all the days..

calluna · May 23, 2008

Celticflower said:
My time began in 1962

That makes your time 46 years. Count the years from the present to the date you say that your church commenced, divide the number into 46, and multiply by 100. That will give you an approximate percentage estimation of the validity and value of your post. A rather generous one, imv.

Celticflower · May 23, 2008

calluna said:
That makes your time 46 years. Count the years from the present to the date you say that your church commenced, divide the number into 46, and multiply by 100. That will give you an approximate percentage estimation of the validity and value of your post. A rather generous one, imv.

There is no need to be rude --
and I doubt that your postition is of any greater validity or value if you must resort to this type of thing.

calluna · May 23, 2008

Celticflower said:
There is no need to be rude

There is no rudeness, not on my part, anyway. I have not told anyone to 'get out more'.

If you will kindly read my post carefully, you will note that your objection is irrelevant and nugatory.

Celticflower · May 23, 2008

calluna said:
There is no rudeness, not on my part, anyway. I have not told anyone to 'get out more'.

If you will kindly read my post carefully, you will note that your objection is irrelevant and nugatory.[/B]

I bow before your greater age and intellect, oh wise and ancient ego.

I'm done here

ThomasDa · May 23, 2008

It's always baffeling to me to see so many "Christians" willing to remember 9 of the ten commandments, but on the other hand forget the one commandment that God says to remember.
The same comandments that say don't murder and don't commit adultry, also says remember the Sabbath.

MamaZ · May 23, 2008

ThomasDa said:
It's always baffeling to me to see so many "Christians" willing to remember 9 of the ten commandments, but on the other hand forget the one commandment that God says to remember.
The same comandments that say don't murder and don't commit adultry, also says remember the Sabbath.

It always amazing isn't it when one thinks that by saying we have entered into Christ eternal Rest and that everyday is Holy unto us for our God is Holy that we are in some how not living up to what someone else thinks still binds us and that is the Law.. For we are now under the free woman.. Not the slave woman.. It is now Christ in us the Hope of Glory and not by works lets man should boast.. For with Christ living in us we are the temple of the Holy Spirit and therefore we are to honor Christ in all we do. For one can say I honor the Sabbath and one can say I have not murdered and one can say I have not committed adultry. But can one honostly say that they have never been angry at anyone. For Jesus says this is the same as murder.. Or can one honost say they have not looked upon anothers wealth and at one time wish they had it as easy as these that have this wealth seems to have?

calluna · May 23, 2008

ThomasDa said:
It's always baffeling to me to see so many "Christians" willing to remember 9 of the ten commandments, but on the other hand forget the one commandment that God says to remember.
The same comandments that say don't murder and don't commit adultry, also says remember the Sabbath.

That would be a dreadful thing if the 10C's were given to Christians.

mont974x4 · May 23, 2008

Well, seeing as how only 9 of teh 10 are recommanded in the NT, I guess I'll go with what Scripture says and enjoy my daily relationship with Him as opposed to what legalistic religious zealots want me to do.

PROPHECYKID · May 23, 2008

calluna said:
That would be a dreadful thing if the 10C's were given to Christians.

Funny, I thought the saints keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus.

stone · May 23, 2008

Most of today's society does by nature that which is commanded in the Torah. Most sabbath keepers are too puffed up and arrogant to see the truth. I think it's the United States for the most part that set in motion today's modern society work schedule of working Monday through friday, and having friday night off through Sunday. So you see, most americans, whether christian, jew or moslem already do by nature what is commanded in the Torah, and that is to not work on shabbat.

Folks that have to work weekends mostly desire to work their way up the ranks and to gain senority to be able to have saturdays and sundays off.

Christians.. desecrating the Sabbath

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