Christianity at the most basic level

[Nihilist Virus]

Sin....

I own two houses. I let my sister and nephew live in one and I in the other. I am a neat kind of guy and always kept the house clean. I would have young people over for fellowship and as it is on a large 3 acre lot would have camp fires, grilled burgers, and let the young people stay.

My sister and nephew only think of themselves and have never invited anyone over for fellowship. They expect me to keep the property taxes and upkeep on the house and won't do a thing for me. My nephew is too lazy to do anything outside and has never learned the word discipline from my sister. My sister lets her dogs stay in the house and don't mind the fact that they poop all over the house. So my fine house is turned into a stinky disaster area.... Which really tisses me off!

What would you do about that? Their nasty way of living is a sin to me.

Unfortunately, any set of laws will necessarily make allowance for rude behavior. I define "rude" as something that is not illegal, but is disruptive to the overall good of either a society or an individual, usually providing a minor convenience to the perpetrator of the behavior. I think those relatives of yours are being rude, but are neither sinning nor are breaking the law.

O that there were such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children for ever! - Deuteronomy 5:29

God also has rules for this planet earth. If the children of Israel were to have kept those rules it would have went well with them. But because of all the nasty things that went on it became a sin to them. Therefore God cannot have them in their land or his either one. I believe that this is the Laodicean church age in which the Lord says...

So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. - Revelation 3:16

That tells me that when the Lord looks down from heaven and sees all the corruption going on from the family all the way to the top he gets sick to his stomach. Just like it does me when I drive by my once nice house to find a disaster area. This is what becomes sin to man.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. - revelation 3

I still have no idea what you are saying sin actually is.

So God's plan is to rebuke and the chasten his people that we may be pure and free from the evil effects of sin. My plan for sister and nephew is to threaten them with eviction until they start doing better.

That is probably the best course of action for you to take.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Both Jesus dying on the cross and forgiveness of sins is what the Gospel is and contains, so, your right on both counts. The basic theme of Christianity is redemption of mankind back to a holy gracefilled Creator , and, that's the Gospel that saves.

So you are saying sin is not clearly defined? What exactly are Christians supposed to do then?

 

[Nihilist Virus]

I think what can be confusing is conflating Law and Torah as always being the same thing.

The Torah was given exclusively to the Israelites as part of their covenant with God. It was never for anyone other than the Israelite.

But that doesn't mean that there aren't things which God expected out of people generally. For Christians the Torah is not applicable since it was for a specific people within a specific context, the covenant God made with Israel at Mt. Sinai. That doesn't mean there is no Law that Christians aren't expected to recognize.

To put it another way, all Torah is Law, but not all Law is Torah. For example Christ commands, "Love your enemies, bless those who curse you, pray for those who persecute you." That isn't a commandment in the Torah, but that is a commandment from God and is therefore Law.

The "old law" as you put it isn't "done away", it's simply not applicable for those who aren't under the covenant which God made at Sinai; for the ancient Church that covenant--indeed all of the covenants and promises made in the past--have their fullness and fulfillment in Christ, they point to Christ.

For Lutherans we speak of the Three Uses of the Law:

"Since the Law was given to men for three reasons: first, that thereby outward discipline might be maintained against wild, disobedient men [and that wild and intractable men might be restrained, as though by certain bars]; secondly, that men thereby may be led to the knowledge of their sins; thirdly, that after they are regenerate and [much of] the flesh notwithstanding cleaves to them, they might on this account have a fixed rule according to which they are to regulate and direct their whole life," - The Epitome of the Formula of Concord, Article VI

In Lutheran parlance, which I believe is helpful, the reality of human sin and concupiscence is what is called "homo incurvatus in se" or "man curved inward upon himself". Concupiscence is the inward, selfish desire, which leads to acts of sin; in Lutheran teaching this concupiscence is itself sin. Sin is man bent inward, man curved or bent to himself, to seek himself; this is in contradistinction to God's Law which calls and commands man outward, toward the love of God and neighbor (Matthew 22:37-40, Mark 12:29-31); God's Law calls us out to act justly and rightly toward our neighbor, to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, give drink to the thirsty, to care for the widow and the orphan.

We fail to act justly, that is sin. We fail to act lovingly, that is sin.

We do not love the Lord our God.
We do not love our neighbor as ourselves.
So that is sin.

-CryptoLutheran

I'm sorry but nothing here makes it absolutely clear what actions might be sinful.

Taking what you say at face value, everyone on these forums is sinning simply by posting here. For if you own a computer, you are not selling all that you own and giving it to the poor. That is "inward behavior" and "selfish." It would seem that all Christians on earth are living in a perpetual, deliberate state of sin.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I'm sorry but nothing here makes it absolutely clear what actions might be sinful.

Taking what you say at face value, everyone on these forums is sinning simply by posting here. For if you own a computer, you are not selling all that you own and giving it to the poor. That is "inward behavior" and "selfish." It would seem that all Christians on earth are living in a perpetual, deliberate state of sin.

I don't believe there is an exhaustive list of sins.

As for your second paragraph, you're not entirely wrong. All human activity is tainted by sin, even our best works and our best efforts are tarnished by sin. All Christians are sinful, and continually sinful.

In Lutheranism we speak of a distinction between Law and Gospel, and between Coram Deo and Coram hominibus.

The Law is what what we ought to do, but don't do.
The Gospel is what God has done for us.

Coram Deo--before God--it is impossible to be righteous through our own works or efforts, all that we do is broken, fallen, and tainted with sin; the harder we try to be righteous the more unrighteous we are and see ourselves to be. Which is why when it comes to our justification--our being made just or right before God--it has nothing to do with ourselves and our efforts, but entirely to do with the grace and kindness of God in Christ, that is, the Gospel.

Coram hominibus--before our fellow man--we must understand God's command to love our neighbor, to do our best to see that our neighbor is taken care of, has food on the table, a shelter over their head, and to do good to all impartially; as it is written, "Love your neighbor as yourself." and "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

Hence why the forgiveness of sins that comes from God is not merely a judicial pardon, it is the express promise in the crucified and risen Jesus that what He has accomplished is applied to us as grace, and His righteousness imputed to us again as grace, and the life which He has, victoriously over death is granted to us again by grace--to the hope of that future life in the resurrection of the dead and the Age to Come. This is the meaning and purpose of Baptism:

"Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? Therefore we have been buried with him by baptism into death, so that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life.

For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. For whoever has died is freed from sin. But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. The death he died, he died to sin, once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God. So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus." - Romans 6:3-11

Baptism has united the individual sinner to the Crucified and Risen Jesus, to both His death and His resurrection. God graciously makes this happen in Baptism for our sake, taking us and making us His own by joining us to Christ and granting to us both the present and future promise of eternal life.

Graciously God grants to us the reality of Christ's resurrection, to hope and trust in that promise that not only are our sins truly forgiven, but that we shall be raised up on the Last Day to that life which shall never perish.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ToBeLoved]

The Torah is holy, righteous, and good, Jesus kept it perfectly, and we are told to follow his example. Some passages need to be studied in order to understand the Jewish cultural context and can seem strange when they are not understood.

Of course Jesus followed it perfectly.

But upon Jesus death He gave us a NEW AND BETTER COVENANT.

So much for your but Jesus followed it theory.

What did Jesus say to the Jewish Pharisee's?

Matthew 23
23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!

17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.

19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.

21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.

22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,

30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.

31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.


32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!


38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.


I don't think Jesus was very happy with the Jews. The Old Testament is full of the Jewish people disobeying God.

So let's get real. Why would I spend more time learning about a culture that to this day is rebellious against God?

My time is spent much better obeying God, not learning about a culture that does not obey God.

 

[rockytopva]

14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. - Galatians 5

25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
29 But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?
30 And Jesus answering said, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.
31 And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
32 And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side.
33 But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,
34 And went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.
35 And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee.
36 Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?
37 And he said, He that shewed mercy on him. Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise. - Luke 10

1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. - 1 Corinthians 13

 

[ToBeLoved]

I'm sorry but nothing here makes it absolutely clear what actions might be sinful.

Taking what you say at face value, everyone on these forums is sinning simply by posting here. For if you own a computer, you are not selling all that you own and giving it to the poor. That is "inward behavior" and "selfish." It would seem that all Christians on earth are living in a perpetual, deliberate state of sin.

Why do you not go to an online Bible and look up and read the verses that contain the word sin? There is a lot to learn by reading it yourself and finding answers. Especially on this topic.

 

[Soyeong]

Of course Jesus followed it perfectly.

But upon Jesus death He gave us a NEW AND BETTER COVENANT.

So much for your but Jesus followed it theory.

What did Jesus say to the Jewish Pharisee's?

Matthew 23
23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!

17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.

19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.

21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.

22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,

30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.

31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.


32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!


38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.


I don't think Jesus was very happy with the Jews. The Old Testament is full of the Jewish people disobeying God.

So let's get real. Why would I spend more time learning about a culture that to this day is rebellious against God?

My time is spent much better obeying God, not learning about a culture that does not obey God.

Indeed, Jesus was not happy with the Pharisees. They had set aside the commands of God in order to follow their own traditions (Mark 7:6-13). They were not obeying God's law in the way that God wanted it to be obeyed and had perverted it into a heavy legalistic burden that amounted to slavery, which was just as bad as paganism. Jesus criticized them for not obeying God's law and he came to fulfill the law by teaching how it should correctly be obeyed both in word and in action in order to restore them to true Torah observance. Jesus made a New Covenant, but God's character remained the same, the way to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct in accordance with God's character remained the same, and the way to follow Jesus' perfect example remained the same.

If you ever go to a foreign country, then it is easy to misunderstand or something or to not understand a custom or an idiom. For instance, in some cultures motioning with your forefinger means that you want someone to come to you, but in other cultures, it is an insult. Or the majority of the time Jesus spent teaching was in and around the Temple area and he often used Temple imagery to make a point, which everyone in his audience would have connected with, but which someone living in a different culture and separated by 2000 years might miss completely. We should study the Jewish cultural context of the Bible not to learn to do as they did, but to learn how Jesus' audience understood him. Something can mean something very different when it is taken out of context, so understanding the context of the Bible is always important.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Paul laid the foundation for Christianity in 1 Corinthians 15:14 when he said that the Christian faith is worthless if Jesus hadn't risen from the dead. He is essentially saying that the foundational belief of being a Christian is the belief that Jesus rose from the dead.

That is not what he was saying...try quoting in context not just a fragment.
12 Now if Christ is preached that he hath been raised from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?

13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, neither hath Christ been raised: 14 and if Christ hath not been raised, then is our preaching vain, your faith also is vain.

15 Yea, we are found false witnesses of God; because we witnessed of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead are not raised.

16 For if the dead are not raised, neither hath Christ been raised: 17 and if Christ hath not been raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

The bolded is what Paul was talking about, that some among them expressed disbelief of his resurrection.

But I believe the foundation is the forgiveness of sins.

Then you believe wrong. Christ, as the Son of God is the foundation of Christianity. He is the cornerstone...

Eph 2:19 That is why you are no longer strangers and foreigners but fellow citizens with the saints and members of God's household,
Eph 2:20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, the Messiah Jesus himself being the cornerstone.
1Pe 2:6 This is why it says in Scripture: "Look! I am laying a chosen, precious cornerstone in Zion. The one who believes in him will never be ashamed."
Isa 28:16 therefore this is what the LORD God says: "Look! I am laying a foundation stone in Zion, a tested stone, a precious cornerstone for a sure foundation: Whoever believes firmly will not act hastily.

If Christ is not Messiah than his words are worthless; however He is Messiah so his words and promises are true.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

Sorry if this is repetitive:
We live under the guidance of all of Scripture but, these passages serve as an example and explanation:
Romans 6:11-14:
...count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. 13 Do not offer any part of yourself to sin as an instrument of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer every part of yourself to him as an instrument of righteousness. 14 For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.

Romans 8:5-13:
5 Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace. 7 The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God.

9 You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. 10 But if Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death because of sin, the Spirit gives life because of righteousness. 11 And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies because of his Spirit who lives in you.
12 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

Galations 5:19-25:
19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit.

And walk in the way of Love, the attributes are found in I Corinthians 13:1-13:
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.
4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

I don't believe there is an exhaustive list of sins.

So do you believe it is reasonable for us to be sent to hell for all eternity for grievances against a law that is poorly defined?

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Why do you not go to an online Bible and look up and read the verses that contain the word sin? There is a lot to learn by reading it yourself and finding answers. Especially on this topic.

The best form of research is to first exhaust the knowledge of those who have studied a given subject. Are you saying this is less adequate than painstakingly scrutinizing the texts on my own?

 

[Nihilist Virus]

That is not what he was saying...try quoting in context not just a fragment.
12 Now if Christ is preached that he hath been raised from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?

13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, neither hath Christ been raised: 14 and if Christ hath not been raised, then is our preaching vain, your faith also is vain.

15 Yea, we are found false witnesses of God; because we witnessed of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead are not raised.

16 For if the dead are not raised, neither hath Christ been raised: 17 and if Christ hath not been raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

The bolded is what Paul was talking about, that some among them expressed disbelief of his resurrection.

Then you believe wrong. Christ, as the Son of God is the foundation of Christianity. He is the cornerstone...

Eph 2:19 That is why you are no longer strangers and foreigners but fellow citizens with the saints and members of God's household,
Eph 2:20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, the Messiah Jesus himself being the cornerstone.
1Pe 2:6 This is why it says in Scripture: "Look! I am laying a chosen, precious cornerstone in Zion. The one who believes in him will never be ashamed."
Isa 28:16 therefore this is what the LORD God says: "Look! I am laying a foundation stone in Zion, a tested stone, a precious cornerstone for a sure foundation: Whoever believes firmly will not act hastily.

If Christ is not Messiah than his words are worthless; however He is Messiah so his words and promises are true.

And aren't Christ's words quite worthless to us if we have no forgiveness of sins?

 

[graceandpeace]

So the answer is that no, there is no precise definition of sin, despite the fact that God will cite sin as the reason billions of souls will go to hell?

We do know what sin is, but we can not offer an exhaustive or concrete list to cover every possible subject regarding which choices, etc are individual "sins." It's outside of the scope of an Internet forum. As noted, there are many examples given in the Bible regarding choices that are sins, but as also noted earlier sin is more than just certain behaviors or breaking rules.

But, it seems the real issue here is now revealed, which is a perceived objection to hell. I don't know what you think hell is, but Christians don't agree on this topic. Many don't believe in "eternal conscious torment."

 

[ToBeLoved]

The best form of research is to first exhaust the knowledge of those who have studied a given subject. Are you saying this is less adequate than painstakingly scrutinizing the texts on my own?

Not at all.

It's just that you are seeking a very specific type of answer because you have told many of the poster's that it doesn't explain what you are looking for.

It is only because you have not found their answers to be thorough that I suggested this.

I also was not suggesting painstakenly scrutinizing the texts, but just reading them over to get an idea of what God's Word does say, which may help you understand better what others may reply.

Sin is a rather complicated subject because it entails all that is not holy. Just trying to be helpful.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

We do know what sin is, but we can not offer an exhaustive or concrete list to cover every possible subject regarding which choices, etc are individual "sins." It's outside of the scope of an Internet forum. As noted, there are many examples given in the Bible regarding choices that are sins, but as also noted earlier sin is more than just certain behaviors or breaking rules.

But, it seems the real issue here is now revealed, which is a perceived objection to hell. I don't know what you think hell is, but Christians don't agree on this topic. Many don't believe in "eternal conscious torment."

I'm not asking for an exhaustive list of sins. Such a thing would certainly answer my question, but I would be equally satisfied if you provided me a method by which one can examine any action and determine if it is sinful or not. And no, please don't answer me by saying that actions which are "in opposition to God" or etc are sins... that does not explain anything. I have no access to God's nature, so I cannot use it as a barometer to examine anything.

You, like all Christians, claim to know what sin is, but your inability to characterize it calls that into question.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Not at all.

It's just that you are seeking a very specific type of answer because you have told many of the poster's that it doesn't explain what you are looking for.

It is only because you have not found their answers to be thorough that I suggested this.

I also was not suggesting painstakenly scrutinizing the texts, but just reading them over to get an idea of what God's Word does say, which may help you understand better what others may reply.

Sin is a rather complicated subject because it entails all that is not holy. Just trying to be helpful.

Many have disagreed with my proposal that the foundation of Christianity is forgiveness of sins. But it is quite apparent to me that if you all knew you were not going to be forgiven of sins, every single one of you would fall away from Christianity and live your life as you see fit until the day you die. Every single one of you without exception. This to me is the clear indication that the foundation of Christianity is, in fact forgiveness of sins, and that Christianity is utterly pointless without it. It is quite factually more important than fellowship with God or the resurrection of Christ.

This exaltation of forgiveness of sins makes sin itself one of the most important concepts in all of existence, and yet we don't even know what it is.

 

[ToBeLoved]

So do you believe it is reasonable for us to be sent to hell for all eternity for grievances against a law that is poorly defined?

He didn't say that, he said there is not an exhaustive list.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Many have disagreed with my proposal that the foundation of Christianity is forgiveness of sins. But it is quite apparent to me that if you all knew you were not going to be forgiven of sins, every single one of you would fall away from Christianity and live your life as you see fit until the day you die. Every single one of you without exception. This to me is the clear indication that the foundation of Christianity is, in fact forgiveness of sins, and that Christianity is utterly pointless without it. It is quite factually more important than fellowship with God or the resurrection of Christ.

This exaltation of forgiveness of sins makes sin itself one of the most important concepts in all of existence, and yet we don't even know what it is.

Well maybe if you read the Bible you would understand better.

You come and make this thread to be handed the answer on a silver platter so you do not have to find out for yourself and then when no one answers your question the way you like it you start making assumptions about what we believe and who we are.

Now that is messed up.

Oh and by the way, if there was no ressurection there would be no forgiveness of sins so I guess that you should take that out of your little theory.

 

[ViaCrucis]

So do you believe it is reasonable for us to be sent to hell for all eternity for grievances against a law that is poorly defined?

Also I don't believe the Law to be poorly defined, the Law is a matter of justice, sin is a matter of injustice; not having an exhaustive list of specific sins doesn't render the Law poorly defined, it means understanding that the Law isn't about an exhaustive list of specific sins but instead about how we are to be a just image-bearing people of God toward others. The reality of that Law, in the face of our inability to be that just image-bearing people of God, is what reckons us as sinners; those who miss the mark.

The issue and topic of "hell" is a very different and separate conversation. If you want to talk about hell, then it seems to me that this is what should have been mentioned; if this was your main point in bringing up the concept of law in Christianity, then it seems rather deceptive to have gone about it in this way.

If you want a response from me about that cross-section between Law and Hell, then it would be this: I do not believe a person is "sent to hell for all eternity for grievances against a law", and as such would see the interjection of the topic of hell as mostly non sequitur.

To talk about "hell" would first require a definition of what "hell" even is.

-CryptoLutheran