Carrying the Cross

[Aussie Pete]

There is nothing attractive about the cross. It was a punishment reserved for the lowest criminals, rebels and runaway slaves. Roman citizens could be executed but not by crucifixion. It was a shameful, painful public torture intended to deter those who would challenge the might of Rome. Yet Lord Jesus said this:
Luke 14: 26 & 27
"…26“If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be My disciple. 27And whoever does not carry his cross and follow Me cannot be My disciple."

Matthew 16:24 puts it a little differently, saying that we must deny ourselves.

Strong words indeed. What does it mean in practice? In order to understand, we need to go back to the very beginning, before Adam sinned. The Bible tells us that Adam was created a living being or soul. The question is, what kind of life did Adam have? Why did there need to be a tree of life if Adam was already alive?

Adam had natural life. He was a natural man. He was neutral towards God. Adam was not a sinner, but neither was he righteous. What he lacked was spiritual life as found in the tree of life.

We know the sorry story. Adam chose the wrong fruit to eat and so died spiritually. Yet he was still alive physically and he had life in his soul - natural life. That life was no longer neutral. It was now governed by the principle of good and evil, as that was Adam's choice in Eden. We've seen how well that has worked out for humanity.

Everyone is born spiritually dead. Lord Jesus came to restore us to life. This He does when we repent of our sin and receive Him as saviour and Lord. When I was born again, I was serving on a warship. After a few months, the man who led me to Jesus left and I was pretty much on my own. I knew that I was different. I took every opportunity I could to meet with other Christians. I went to every Christian camp that I could and I sought out churches in the countries that I visited. God even led me to a church in Japan, where almost no one spoke English at that time.

My burning question at the time was, "What is God's will for me? How can I know?" God began to reveal the principles of knowing and obeying His will over the next 50 years. I'm still learning. But I do know a little more than I knew back then.

Much of my early Christian experience was a mixture of some victories and much failure. God's way is to show us something by first showing us what it is not. For example, I tried to leave the navy, but I was blocked continually. I resigned myself to God's will. It was not long after that God made a miraculous way for me to leave honourably. For a long time, my only concern was not to sin. But I began to learn about a new aspect of the Christian life. I learned that not sinning was not enough to satisfy God. He wants disciples, people who will positively be disciples. And such people needed to deny themselves, hate their lives and be willing to carry the cross.

The life that Lord Jesus speaks of, that we must deny, is "pseuche" in Greek. It is translated "soul" or "life", depending on context. My old NASB did not attempt to interpret the word. It translated it "soul-life". And I believe this to be the best way of expressing it. The soul is not evil in itself. It is the means of expression. A radio can be tuned to a Christian station or to a station promoting worldly immoral values. The question for the believer is, what are you tuning into? Is it your natural self, with its principle of good and evil to guide you? Or is it your spirit man, which functions according to the principle of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus?

I knew these principles mentally. God had to do a work in my heart in order to make them real in my experience. I found a terrible truth about myself. Secretly, I hoped to save my soul life by making it conform to what I considered to be good and to cut out what I thought to be evil. As Paul said in Romans 7, it's not enough to know what is right and what is wrong. We need the power to live it! I discovered that my best efforts were not enough.

"Would you be free from your burden of sin?" so the hymn goes. "Burdens are lifted at Calvary". Sure. But there is a burden that very few talk about that is much harder to deal with. We know that sin is bad. But we must come to the place where we realise that self is utterly useless in the Christian life. God is so displeased with self that we are commanded to put it to death. Not once, but every day.

Paul had this to say: …11For we who are alive are always consigned to death for Jesus’ sake, so that the life of Jesus may also be revealed in our mortal body. 12So then, death is at work in us, but life is at work in you. (2 Corinthians 4)

If we want to be effective in God's kingdom work, if we want to be disciples and not just be a church attender, we must come to know what Paul discovered. We need to die a good death before we can experience the new life that Jesus came to give us. Those who seek to serve the Lord need to know this truth. Our natural affections, logic, reason, and talents must be nailed to the cross before God will use them.

An example may help. I started playing the guitar as a teenager. It became an obsession. and I could hide behind it, dodging contact with other Christians as I played in the meetings. The Lord told me to quit so I sold the guitar. At the time it was one of the finest made. Some years later, the Lord said that I could play again. It was no longer an obsession. I can pick it up or put it down without a problem. The "self" aspect has been to the cross. It is now safe for me to play, so to speak. And this principle applies to every aspect of life, especially those that really matter to us. Can we put them down if God requires it?

It will be hard at times. Lord Jesus wrestled with the prospect of the cross. I know what it means to sweat drops of blood when I was desperately ill. The rich young ruler was unable to give up his riches. I know of no mature Christian who has not faced their own, personal "Gethsemene". Some us have several times where God's will seemed to ask too much of us. If we will say, "Nevertheless, not my will but yours be done", we will gain a great victory, the hold of self will be weaker and more of Jesus will shine out of us. No price is too high to gain more of Christ. And we will be that much more effective in our Christian life. As has been said, Christian growth is not measured by how much we gain, but by how much we lose.

 

[enoob57]

It will be hard at times. Lord Jesus wrestled with the prospect of the cross. I know what it means to sweat drops of blood when I was desperately ill. The rich young ruler was unable to give up his riches. I know of no mature Christian who has not faced their own, personal "Gethsemene".

I think you need to study Gethsemane more deeply before you bring your personal experiences as something that can be placed with Jesus' Gethsemane! Physically the beating and torture would have been enough to kill the majority of us... but the Spiritual aspect between the Father and Son in that garden 'no man' may approach and understand!

 

[com7fy8]

The "self" aspect has been to the cross.

Do you mean "nailed" to the cross, or something else?

Thank you for sharing what you have discovered.

What does Jesus mean by carrying our cross? I think of Ephesians 5:2 >

"And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

This commands us to love the way Jesus on the cross was loving, I get through this verse. So, if I am correct, the cross of Jesus is not only about pain and sacrifices; but we share with Jesus in us, in how He was loving people and wants forgiveness and reconciliation with God.

Jesus on Calvary died with hope for any and all people > love "hopes all things" > in 1 Corinthians 13:7.

 

[aiki]

The "self" aspect has been to the cross. It is now safe for me to play, so to speak. And this principle applies to every aspect of life, especially those that really matter to us. Can we put them down if God requires it?

This was a very interesting read! Thanks!

One observation: No man can crucify himself - not physically and not spiritually. That's why we need God to do for us what we can't do for ourselves and separate us from the power of Self, of the "old man." And He did exactly this, crucifying us with Christ on his cross 2000-some years ago. What remains for the born-again person is, by faith, to "reckon it so" (Romans 6:11). United with Christ in his death, burial and glorious resurrection (Romans 6:1-6; Galatians 2:20; Galatians 5:24, Colossians 2:10-12, etc.) every born-again believer has been freed from the power of Self and Sin. There is, then, no crucifixion still to be done, only the work of believing it already done and being conformed to this reality by the Spirit in one's practical living as one remains under his control throughout each day.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Do you mean "nailed" to the cross, or something else?

Thank you for sharing what you have discovered.

What does Jesus mean by carrying our cross? I think of Ephesians 5:2 >

"And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

This commands us to love the way Jesus on the cross was loving, I get through this verse. So, if I am correct, the cross of Jesus is not only about pain and sacrifices; but we share with Jesus in us, in how He was loving people and wants forgiveness and reconciliation with God.

Jesus on Calvary died with hope for any and all people > love "hopes all things" > in 1 Corinthians 13:7.

Our sinful nature has been nailed to the cross, along with all our sin. Dealing with self is our job. We cannot change it. We must consign it to the cross. The cross is death. It would be wonderful if this was a once off decision. It's not. It is something that we must do daily. I'm 70, been saved 50 years. Sometimes I think that I've gone through every trial possible. Except I have not. Something will come along to burst that bubble. And each time is a crisis, either die to the aspect of self that the trial exposes or hold onto it. My usual reaction is to hang on for a time and then give over to the cross. Right now I'm facing an impossible situation. It troubled me for weeks. The situation has not changed, but I am now at peace. God is well able to do the impossible. He's done it before for me and He has promised to meet my every need. So I can relax.

It does not mean do nothing. There are steps that I need to take in light of my changed circumstances. But worry is not one of the steps!

 

[Aussie Pete]

This was a very interesting read! Thanks!

One observation: No man can crucify himself - not physically and not spiritually. That's why we need God to do for us what we can't do for ourselves and separate us from the power of Self, of the "old man." And He did exactly this, crucifying us with Christ on his cross 2000-some years ago. What remains for the born-again person is, by faith, to "reckon it so" (Romans 6:11). United with Christ in his death, burial and glorious resurrection (Romans 6:1-6; Galatians 2:20; Galatians 5:24, Colossians 2:10-12, etc.) every born-again believer has been freed from the power of Self and Sin. There is, then, no crucifixion still to be done, only the work of believing it already done and being conformed to this reality by the Spirit in one's practical living as one remains under his control throughout each day.

Yes and no. The cross does the work, for sure. But it is the decision of our will as to whether or not we will permit the cross to do its work. It is not automatic. We die to sin and the old nature immediately when we are born again. However, we must consign self to death daily. That is what Lord Jesus meant when He told us to carry our cross.

I spent quite a long time waiting for God to do his work. Nothing was happening. I was stagnant. It began to dawn on me that there was something wrong. I've learned enough to know that it is never God who is wrong! I realised that I was not actively choosing and not actively denying self. It's a little as if we are put back in the garden of Eden. The believer still has a choice, the Tree of Life or the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We need to eat daily or we will suffer malnutrition. So it is spiritually. We must resist Satan's temptation to live by "good and evil" and rather, choose life.

It's easy to learn a bit, have some wonderful spiritual experiences with God and delude ourselves that we have arrived. Been there, done that, more than once. We are just as dependent on grace now as we were the day we were born again. Spiritual pride is the worst kind. If we keep the cross in mind, realising that God deems self worthy only of death, it helps to keep us grounded. Paul started off as "least of the apostles", graduated to "least of the saints" and gained the final award as "chief of sinners." It's the exact opposite of how the world and some Christians perceive growth to be. When I stand before Lord Jesus in a few years, my boast will be in what He has done, not what I have done. And I know but the smallest fraction of what He has done for me. What I do know is that what He has done is in spite of me, not because of me. I have not always thought this way.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I think you need to study Gethsemane more deeply before you bring your personal experiences as something that can be placed with Jesus' Gethsemane! Physically the beating and torture would have been enough to kill the majority of us... but the Spiritual aspect between the Father and Son in that garden 'no man' may approach and understand!

The principle remains. Every Christian must choose death to self for themselves. And God will put His finger on anything that is more precious to us than His will. I know Christians who have turned away at this point and whose lives are a wreck as a result. Worse, they have become hostile to former friends because we remind them of their bad choice, even if we do not mention it. The conscience is a powerful thing and it is hard to silence it. Our suffering is not comparable, but we are not God in the flesh either. There was never any doubt that the Lord Jesus would suffer, die and rise again. He was the Lamb of God, slain from the foundation of the world. It is very possible for Christians to avoid the cross. Jesus was exalted to the highest place. Those who refuse the cross will be the least in God's kingdom.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

There is nothing attractive about the cross. It was a punishment reserved for the lowest criminals, rebels and runaway slaves. Roman citizens could be executed but not by crucifixion. It was a shameful, painful public torture intended to deter those who would challenge the might of Rome. Yet Lord Jesus said this:
Luke 14: 26 & 27
"…26“If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be My disciple. 27And whoever does not carry his cross and follow Me cannot be My disciple."

Matthew 16:24 puts it a little differently, saying that we must deny ourselves.

Strong words indeed. What does it mean in practice? In order to understand, we need to go back to the very beginning, before Adam sinned. The Bible tells us that Adam was created a living being or soul. The question is, what kind of life did Adam have? Why did there need to be a tree of life if Adam was already alive?

Adam had natural life. He was a natural man. He was neutral towards God. Adam was not a sinner, but neither was he righteous. What he lacked was spiritual life as found in the tree of life.

We know the sorry story. Adam chose the wrong fruit to eat and so died spiritually. Yet he was still alive physically and he had life in his soul - natural life. That life was no longer neutral. It was now governed by the principle of good and evil, as that was Adam's choice in Eden. We've seen how well that has worked out for humanity.

Everyone is born spiritually dead. Lord Jesus came to restore us to life. This He does when we repent of our sin and receive Him as saviour and Lord. When I was born again, I was serving on a warship. After a few months, the man who led me to Jesus left and I was pretty much on my own. I knew that I was different. I took every opportunity I could to meet with other Christians. I went to every Christian camp that I could and I sought out churches in the countries that I visited. God even led me to a church in Japan, where almost no one spoke English at that time.

My burning question at the time was, "What is God's will for me? How can I know?" God began to reveal the principles of knowing and obeying His will over the next 50 years. I'm still learning. But I do know a little more than I knew back then.

Much of my early Christian experience was a mixture of some victories and much failure. God's way is to show us something by first showing us what it is not. For example, I tried to leave the navy, but I was blocked continually. I resigned myself to God's will. It was not long after that God made a miraculous way for me to leave honourably. For a long time, my only concern was not to sin. But I began to learn about a new aspect of the Christian life. I learned that not sinning was not enough to satisfy God. He wants disciples, people who will positively be disciples. And such people needed to deny themselves, hate their lives and be willing to carry the cross.

The life that Lord Jesus speaks of, that we must deny, is "pseuche" in Greek. It is translated "soul" or "life", depending on context. My old NASB did not attempt to interpret the word. It translated it "soul-life". And I believe this to be the best way of expressing it. The soul is not evil in itself. It is the means of expression. A radio can be tuned to a Christian station or to a station promoting worldly immoral values. The question for the believer is, what are you tuning into? Is it your natural self, with its principle of good and evil to guide you? Or is it your spirit man, which functions according to the principle of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus?

I knew these principles mentally. God had to do a work in my heart in order to make them real in my experience. I found a terrible truth about myself. Secretly, I hoped to save my soul life by making it conform to what I considered to be good and to cut out what I thought to be evil. As Paul said in Romans 7, it's not enough to know what is right and what is wrong. We need the power to live it! I discovered that my best efforts were not enough.

"Would you be free from your burden of sin?" so the hymn goes. "Burdens are lifted at Calvary". Sure. But there is a burden that very few talk about that is much harder to deal with. We know that sin is bad. But we must come to the place where we realise that self is utterly useless in the Christian life. God is so displeased with self that we are commanded to put it to death. Not once, but every day.

Paul had this to say: …11For we who are alive are always consigned to death for Jesus’ sake, so that the life of Jesus may also be revealed in our mortal body. 12So then, death is at work in us, but life is at work in you. (2 Corinthians 4)

If we want to be effective in God's kingdom work, if we want to be disciples and not just be a church attender, we must come to know what Paul discovered. We need to die a good death before we can experience the new life that Jesus came to give us. Those who seek to serve the Lord need to know this truth. Our natural affections, logic, reason, and talents must be nailed to the cross before God will use them.

An example may help. I started playing the guitar as a teenager. It became an obsession. and I could hide behind it, dodging contact with other Christians as I played in the meetings. The Lord told me to quit so I sold the guitar. At the time it was one of the finest made. Some years later, the Lord said that I could play again. It was no longer an obsession. I can pick it up or put it down without a problem. The "self" aspect has been to the cross. It is now safe for me to play, so to speak. And this principle applies to every aspect of life, especially those that really matter to us. Can we put them down if God requires it?

It will be hard at times. Lord Jesus wrestled with the prospect of the cross. I know what it means to sweat drops of blood when I was desperately ill. The rich young ruler was unable to give up his riches. I know of no mature Christian who has not faced their own, personal "Gethsemene". Some us have several times where God's will seemed to ask too much of us. If we will say, "Nevertheless, not my will but yours be done", we will gain a great victory, the hold of self will be weaker and more of Jesus will shine out of us. No price is too high to gain more of Christ. And we will be that much more effective in our Christian life. As has been said, Christian growth is not measured by how much we gain, but by how much we lose.

I understand where you are coming from. I have been thinking about the topic, after reading what you said.

For me, the biggest denial of self that I face is based around the fear associated with witnessing. At times grace is there, and I can witness easily, but there are other times I know I must deny my flesh to reach out to a person. The thought I had, is we will each be judged according to our works, there is no reward for just cruising through life, the challenge enables us to receive a reward, to share in Christ's sufferings, to be one with His purpose. No challenge, no reward. Not that it is all about reward, but just a thought.

 

[aiki]

Yes and no. The cross does the work, for sure. But it is the decision of our will as to whether or not we will permit the cross to do its work.

This is entailed, I think, in the business of "walking by faith, not by sight" (2 Corinthians 5:7)? I exert my will in accord with the truth of God's word about my union with Christ, believing (reckoning) it to be so, and as I do, the Holy Spirit acts to conform me in my daily living to that union. (Romans 6:11; 2 Corinthians 3:18; Galatians 5:16-18; Ephesians 2:22; Ephesians 3:16; 2 Timothy 1:13-14, etc.) But you are correct that the believer does not sit passively, expecting to be moved like a puppet by God into His will.

We die to sin and the old nature immediately when we are born again. However, we must consign self to death daily. That is what Lord Jesus meant when He told us to carry our cross.

Interesting. I don't understand the crucified life to work this way. In Christ, as you say, the believer is made "dead to sin and alive unto God," (Romans 6:1-11); this is entirely a work of God, accomplished fully and perfectly through Christ. Whether or not I choose to live in this spiritual reality by faith, it remains, nonetheless, the truth of my spiritual condition. This is what Paul indicated in his rhetorical question at the beginning of Romans 6:

Romans 6:1-2
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, who are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul didn't write that only as the believers at Rome "consigned self to death daily" were they then actually crucified with Christ and "carrying their cross." No, instead, he declared that the believers at Rome were dead to sin already and so why, then, were they living in sin? He asserted that the believers at Rome were acting contrary to the spiritual reality of their union with Christ and the freedom from Self and Sin that this union provided.

Having explained to them the spiritual reality they possessed in their union with Christ, was Paul's recommendation to the believers at Rome to "consign themselves to death daily"? No, instead, he told them to "count on it being so" by faith and to present themselves to God as instruments for His use, submitting themselves to Him as His bondservants, His "slaves of righteousness" (Romans 6:13-22). As they did so, the Holy Spirit would bring the reality of their position in Christ more and more fully into expression in their practical, daily living.

I spent quite a long time waiting for God to do his work. Nothing was happening. I was stagnant. It began to dawn on me that there was something wrong. I've learned enough to know that it is never God who is wrong! I realised that I was not actively choosing and not actively denying self.

I can, of course, in my own natural human power, for periods of time manufacture the life and work of the Spirit, but I don't in-and-of myself possess the supernatural, infinite power of the Spirit and so eventually exhaust my reserves of power and fall once again into sin. And at the end of such an exertion, I find myself only with an enlarged awareness of my own abilities, not God's. Here, then, is how I believe it's possible to distinguish mere human effort from the work of the Spirit in my life: When the Spirit works, there is no exhaustion of spirit, no strain of resolve, of will, but only the flow of infinite power in and through me, filling me and giving me both the desire and ability to do God's will (Philippians 2:13; Ephesians 6:13; Romans 8:13, etc.). And as the Spirit works, I have an increased experience of His power and Person, a growing history of his supernatural transformation of me, rather than merely a record of my own weak efforts.

I have learned that the "active choosing" of which you write is in the "reckoning it so" and in consciously submitting myself to the Spirit's control throughout each day, which is what the Bible repeatedly commands me to do. And as the Spirit goes to work on me, I find it natural and even joyful to deny myself for the sake of following Christ, knowing that in doing so I foster deeper and deeper communion with him, the Lover of my soul, which is the whole point, really, of a holy life. (Hebrews 12:14; Philippians 3:7-10; 1 Corinthians 1:9)

We must resist Satan's temptation to live by "good and evil" and rather, choose life.

And this is done, brother, by walking by faith and by daily submitting to God, not by straining and striving to produce for God a work only He can do - and that, through Christ, He has already done.

James 4:7
7 Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.

Philippians 1:6
6 For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 5:23-24
23 Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 Faithful is He who calls you, and He also will bring it to pass.

1 Corinthians 1:29-31
29 so that no man may boast before God.
30 But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
31 so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

Romans 5:2
2 Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

It's easy to learn a bit, have some wonderful spiritual experiences with God and delude ourselves that we have arrived.

Right. Which is why we must always be setting our "wonderful experiences" against the light and standard of God's word, making sure what we believe is of Him, is actually so. Like I said above, it is possible to manufacture short-lived, superficial human counterfeits of the Spirit's work and call it a "work of God," and on the basis of this actually fleshly work, erect a doctrine of spiritual living that is directly contradicted by Scripture. I observe HUGE crowds of believers doing this constantly these days.

Been there, done that, more than once. We are just as dependent on grace now as we were the day we were born again.

Very true. As Jesus said, "Without me, you can do nothing." (John 15:5)

Paul started off as "least of the apostles", graduated to "least of the saints" and gained the final award as "chief of sinners."

Hmmm... It's certainly important, as you point out, to remember one's inclination toward sin, but Paul was also the one who wrote:

2 Corinthians 5:17
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

2 Corinthians 5:21
21 For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Romans 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ...

Colossians 1:12-13
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who has delivered us from the power of darkness, and has transferred us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

I don't know anyone who became more like Jesus by focusing upon their sin and sinfulness. Do you? It's vital to remember we are weak apart from Christ, yes, but so that we are then always "looking unto Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith." (Hebrews 12:2)

When I stand before Lord Jesus in a few years, my boast will be in what He has done, not what I have done.

Amen. But will it have been truly a work of Christ, of the Spirit of Christ (Romans 8:9), or just your work done in his name? (Matthew 7:21-23) How do you tell the one work from the other?

 

[Aussie Pete]

This is entailed, I think, in the business of "walking by faith, not by sight" (2 Corinthians 5:7)? I exert my will in accord with the truth of God's word about my union with Christ, believing (reckoning) it to be so, and as I do, the Holy Spirit acts to conform me in my daily living to that union. (Romans 6:11; 2 Corinthians 3:18; Galatians 5:16-18; Ephesians 2:22; Ephesians 3:16; 2 Timothy 1:13-14, etc.) But you are correct that the believer does not sit passively, expecting to be moved like a puppet by God into His will.



Interesting. I don't understand the crucified life to work this way. In Christ, as you say, the believer is made "dead to sin and alive unto God," (Romans 6:1-11); this is entirely a work of God, accomplished fully and perfectly through Christ. Whether or not I choose to live in this spiritual reality by faith, it remains, nonetheless, the truth of my spiritual condition. This is what Paul indicated in his rhetorical question at the beginning of Romans 6:

Romans 6:1-2
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, who are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul didn't write that only as the believers at Rome "consigned self to death daily" were they then actually crucified with Christ and "carrying their cross." No, instead, he declared that the believers at Rome were dead to sin already and so why, then, were they living in sin? He asserted that the believers at Rome were acting contrary to the spiritual reality of their union with Christ and the freedom from Self and Sin that this union provided.

Having explained to them the spiritual reality they possessed in their union with Christ, was Paul's recommendation to the believers at Rome to "consign themselves to death daily"? No, instead, he told them to "count on it being so" by faith and to present themselves to God as instruments for His use, submitting themselves to Him as His bondservants, His "slaves of righteousness" (Romans 6:13-22). As they did so, the Holy Spirit would bring the reality of their position in Christ more and more fully into expression in their practical, daily living.



I can, of course, in my own natural human power, for periods of time manufacture the life and work of the Spirit, but I don't in-and-of myself possess the supernatural, infinite power of the Spirit and so eventually exhaust my reserves of power and fall once again into sin. And at the end of such an exertion, I find myself only with an enlarged awareness of my own abilities, not God's. Here, then, is how I believe it's possible to distinguish mere human effort from the work of the Spirit in my life: When the Spirit works, there is no exhaustion of spirit, no strain of resolve, of will, but only the flow of infinite power in and through me, filling me and giving me both the desire and ability to do God's will (Philippians 2:13; Ephesians 6:13; Romans 8:13, etc.). And as the Spirit works, I have an increased experience of His power and Person, a growing history of his supernatural transformation of me, rather than merely a record of my own weak efforts.

I have learned that the "active choosing" of which you write is in the "reckoning it so" and in consciously submitting myself to the Spirit's control throughout each day, which is what the Bible repeatedly commands me to do. And as the Spirit goes to work on me, I find it natural and even joyful to deny myself for the sake of following Christ, knowing that in doing so I foster deeper and deeper communion with him, the Lover of my soul, which is the whole point, really, of a holy life. (Hebrews 12:14; Philippians 3:7-10; 1 Corinthians 1:9)



And this is done, brother, by walking by faith and by daily submitting to God, not by straining and striving to produce for God a work only He can do - and that, through Christ, He has already done.

James 4:7
7 Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.

Philippians 1:6
6 For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 5:23-24
23 Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 Faithful is He who calls you, and He also will bring it to pass.

1 Corinthians 1:29-31
29 so that no man may boast before God.
30 But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
31 so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

Romans 5:2
2 Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.



Right. Which is why we must always be setting our "wonderful experiences" against the light and standard of God's word, making sure what we believe is of Him, is actually so. Like I said above, it is possible to manufacture short-lived, superficial human counterfeits of the Spirit's work and call it a "work of God," and on the basis of this actually fleshly work, erect a doctrine of spiritual living that is directly contradicted by Scripture. I observe HUGE crowds of believers doing this constantly these days.



Very true. As Jesus said, "Without me, you can do nothing." (John 15:5)



Hmmm... It's certainly important, as you point out, to remember one's inclination toward sin, but Paul was also the one who wrote:

2 Corinthians 5:17
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

2 Corinthians 5:21
21 For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Romans 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ...

Colossians 1:12-13
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who has delivered us from the power of darkness, and has transferred us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

I don't know anyone who became more like Jesus by focusing upon their sin and sinfulness. Do you? It's vital to remember we are weak apart from Christ, yes, but so that we are then always "looking unto Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith." (Hebrews 12:2)



Amen. But will it have been truly a work of Christ, of the Spirit of Christ (Romans 8:9), or just your work done in his name? (Matthew 7:21-23) How do you tell the one work from the other?

I'll only respond in brief, but thank you for your detailed reply. Firstly, I am not talking about sin. That is a given for anyone who is born again and seeking to go God's way. The real enemy of the soul is self. The reason is that self can appear to be righteous. Some time ago, I was doing something to help a friend. Other brethren were working in a different area. One of them came to get me and told me they needed me where they were. I was more than happy doing what I was doing. The Lord spoke to me, and said that I was doing something good, but it was not what was right. I was pleasing myself.

As to judging my works as being of God or self, I don't. I start the day committing myself to God's will, asking Jesus to live out His life in me and through me and get on with life. I'm conscious that the work needs to be of him, so I put my life in His hands. Sometimes hindsight shows me to be in tune with the Lord, others I realise that I missed it somehow. And every now and again, the Lord puts a torch to my works. It makes quite a bonfire, but there is also a little gold in amongst the ashes. And God is so gracious that He gives me His beauty in place of my ashes. How good is that!

Ridding us of self is a lifetime work. I don't believe that we can be totally free while we are in the old body. I'll be glad to trade mine in. It's showing signs of wear and tear!

 

[Aussie Pete]

I understand where you are coming from. I have been thinking about the topic, after reading what you said.

For me, the biggest denial of self that I face is based around the fear associated with witnessing. At times grace is there, and I can witness easily, but there are other times I know I must deny my flesh to reach out to a person. The thought I had, is we will each be judged according to our works, there is no reward for just cruising through life, the challenge enables us to receive a reward, to share in Christ's sufferings, to be one with His purpose. No challenge, no reward. Not that it is all about reward, but just a thought.

You are not Robinson Crusoe there! I have a friend, a 69 year old woman who puts me to shame. She'll witness anywhere, anytime, to anyone. I'm inclined to wait for openings. Fears are a blight and God wants to set us free from all of them. That includes fear of failure.

Decades ago, Lord Jesus gave me a word for someone: "No one hands out prizes to spectators". Any time I've a word for someone, it is also for me. God expects us to fail and make mistakes. That's how we learn. The one who does nothing won't make mistakes, but neither are they blessed. That is the point of the parable of the talents. We must not let fear of failure stop us.

 

[Forest_Garden]

I read your article, Yes I do agree that carrying our cross of righteousness in a world that is dimly lit by the little truth that remains in the values of our world today and receding into further darkness is not easy but life in God has shown us that the parables are true even so far that the words of David are true

Psalm 23:4-6
4Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,b

I will fear no evil,

for You are with me;

Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me. 5You prepare a table before me

in the presence of my enemies.

You anoint my head with oil;

my cup overflows.

6Surely goodness and mercy will follow me

all the days of my life,

and I will dwell in the house of the LORD

forever.c

 

[aiki]

I'll only respond in brief, but thank you for your detailed reply. Firstly, I am not talking about sin. That is a given for anyone who is born again and seeking to go God's way. The real enemy of the soul is self.

I agree entirely that the real enemy of the believer isn't sin but Self (called the "old man" in Romans 6:6). Sin is just the product of Self in control.

The reason is that self can appear to be righteous.

This has certainly been my experience. And, you know, when I look at every sin that has plagued my life, at the core of each of them has been selfishness, a love of myself first and foremost, rather than of God and others. This is, I believe, why God never accepts any "righteousness" from His children that doesn't arise from obedience to the First and Great Commandment (Matthew 22:36-38; 1 Corinthians 13:1-3). No matter what I might say, or know, or do, if love for God isn't the ground of it all, it is all for nought.

One of them came to get me and told me they needed me where they were. I was more than happy doing what I was doing. The Lord spoke to me, and said that I was doing something good, but it was not what was right. I was pleasing myself.

I've had similar experiences - as all believers do, sooner or later. I recall times when I was about to get up to preach, feeling terribly anxious, concerned that I would communicate well, that God would use my words to touch and change lives, that people would truly listen to my sermon that I'd worked so carefully to prepare. And then, the thought would cross my mind: Why are you so anxious in serving God? Is your worry from Him? Of course, I knew immediately that it wasn't, that my fear was arising from myself, from my self-interest. On the heels of this understanding the thought pushed forward in my mind: If God did absolutely nothing with my sermon, if it had not the slightest impact upon those who heard it, would I be okay with such an outcome? Part of me instantly rebelled at the thought, having worked as I had on the sermon's preparation and feeling that the effort in doing so ought to be rewarded. But a new thought proceeded into my thinking: Should God bless a sermon that is delivered with a heart focused upon Self, upon satisfying its insecurities and wants? Well, obviously, not. There was some more inner wrestling and then a settling into a place of rest in God's will, content for Him to do something with my sermon or nothing at all, my heart focused on simply pleasing Him in my preaching.

Isn't it rather horrible, though, how Self insinuated itself into something as God-centered - ostensibly - as preaching a sermon? But how gracious and good of God to reveal to me that this was so and to deliver me from the corruption of Self in my service to Him!

As to judging my works as being of God or self, I don't. I start the day committing myself to God's will, asking Jesus to live out His life in me and through me and get on with life. I'm conscious that the work needs to be of him, so I put my life in His hands. Sometimes hindsight shows me to be in tune with the Lord, others I realise that I missed it somehow. And every now and again, the Lord puts a torch to my works. It makes quite a bonfire, but there is also a little gold in amongst the ashes. And God is so gracious that He gives me His beauty in place of my ashes. How good is that!

??? Why do you suppose God's word delineates in such detail the difference between corrupt, selfish, sinful living and holy, God-honoring living, if not, at least in part, to give us the means to distinguish the former from the latter?

Don't you find that throughout each day you drift from a place of submission to God, Self subtly usurping the Holy Spirit's control, requiring a conscious placing of yourself under the Spirit's control once again? I do. And, often, even when it is not obvious that I have strayed from the Spirit's control but the thought enters my mind to submit to Him anew, I do. Why wouldn't I? As Scripture indicates, in those moments during which the Spirit is not in control, I stand before God a rebel, steering my own course, however unwittingly, and opposed by Him until I return to a place of conscious submission to Him. More and more, the thought of such a condition appalls me, even if it was adopted unconsciously.

James 4:6-10
6 But he gives more grace. Therefore it says, “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you.

It really jumps out at me what James wrote about God being opposed to those who, in pride, pursue their own way, drawing near to them only after they have submitted again to Him and drawn near.

Anyway, I get the "I'm not going to fuss about it" attitude; it's very...manly. But, in my life anyway, it has also been a justification for spiritual carelessness and passivity, dumping the responsibility for my choices on God by declaring that "my life is in His hands." Certainly, God must shepherd me constantly, initiating things with me spiritually, convicting me, disciplining me, illuminating my understanding, and so on. But I'm not a puppet. Again and again, I must consciously choose God's will and way and submit myself to His control, by an act of my will responding positively to the promptings and convicting work of the Spirit. And so long as I don't, thinking God will just act on my morning prayer and overrule my selfish choices as I make them throughout the day, I am expecting God to treat me essentially as a puppet, which He will not do. God wants a love-relationship with us, as you know, and this requires that we freely choose God - or not.

Ridding us of self is a lifetime work. I don't believe that we can be totally free while we are in the old body. I'll be glad to trade mine in. It's showing signs of wear and tear!

I think this is very...unfortunate thinking. Was Paul wrong when he wrote what he did in Romans 6?

Romans 6:6-7
6 knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin;
7 for he who has died is freed from sin.

Does your experience - and your thinking that has conformed to it - trump Paul's divinely-inspired words? You may wrestle against the habits of the "Old Man," the deeply-set ruts of thought and behavior formed under the control of Self, but in Christ, you never have to submit to these vestiges of the rule of Self. In the Person of the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, every born-again believer has more than sufficient power always to stand free of the Old Man; no one indwelt by the Spirit ever yields to the "Old Man" because they must. (Philippians 2:13; Philippians 3:16; Philippians 4:13; Romans 8:13-14; 2 Corinthians 3:18, etc.)

I struggled for many years to live, by faith, in the reality of my death to Self, of my freedom from the well-set patterns of living formed under the rule of my Old Man - until I realized that I could not bring myself into a practical experience of this spiritual reality but that the Spirit would as I followed Paul's advice in the last half of Romans 6 and yielded myself - as often as necessary - as a "slave of righteousness" to God. Every time I submit myself again to the Spirit, I invite him to fill me and transform me - an invitation that is necessary to his doing so; for, constrained by love, he will not force me to be transformed. And only as the Spirit is in control of me will he fill me and change me, conforming me to Christ.

Anyway, it's always very interesting to compare notes spiritually and, in the light of Scripture, observe the work of God in the life of a fellow believer. Thanks for sharing! I look forward to future contributions you might make to this forum.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I agree entirely that the real enemy of the believer isn't sin but Self (called the "old man" in Romans 6:6). Sin is just the product of Self in control.



This has certainly been my experience. And, you know, when I look at every sin that has plagued my life, at the core of each of them has been selfishness, a love of myself first and foremost, rather than of God and others. This is, I believe, why God never accepts any "righteousness" from His children that doesn't arise from obedience to the First and Great Commandment (Matthew 22:36-38; 1 Corinthians 13:1-3). No matter what I might say, or know, or do, if love for God isn't the ground of it all, it is all for nought.



I've had similar experiences - as all believers do, sooner or later. I recall times when I was about to get up to preach, feeling terribly anxious, concerned that I would communicate well, that God would use my words to touch and change lives, that people would truly listen to my sermon that I'd worked so carefully to prepare. And then, the thought would cross my mind: Why are you so anxious in serving God? Is your worry from Him? Of course, I knew immediately that it wasn't, that my fear was arising from myself, from my self-interest. On the heels of this understanding the thought pushed forward in my mind: If God did absolutely nothing with my sermon, if it had not the slightest impact upon those who heard it, would I be okay with such an outcome? Part of me instantly rebelled at the thought, having worked as I had on the sermon's preparation and feeling that the effort in doing so ought to be rewarded. But a new thought proceeded into my thinking: Should God bless a sermon that is delivered with a heart focused upon Self, upon satisfying its insecurities and wants? Well, obviously, not. There was some more inner wrestling and then a settling into a place of rest in God's will, content for Him to do something with my sermon or nothing at all, my heart focused on simply pleasing Him in my preaching.

Isn't it rather horrible, though, how Self insinuated itself into something as God-centered - ostensibly - as preaching a sermon? But how gracious and good of God to reveal to me that this was so and to deliver me from the corruption of Self in my service to Him!



??? Why do you suppose God's word delineates in such detail the difference between corrupt, selfish, sinful living and holy, God-honoring living, if not, at least in part, to give us the means to distinguish the former from the latter?

Don't you find that throughout each day you drift from a place of submission to God, Self subtly usurping the Holy Spirit's control, requiring a conscious placing of yourself under the Spirit's control once again? I do. And, often, even when it is not obvious that I have strayed from the Spirit's control but the thought enters my mind to submit to Him anew, I do. Why wouldn't I? As Scripture indicates, in those moments during which the Spirit is not in control, I stand before God a rebel, steering my own course, however unwittingly, and opposed by Him until I return to a place of conscious submission to Him. More and more, the thought of such a condition appalls me, even if it was adopted unconsciously.

James 4:6-10
6 But he gives more grace. Therefore it says, “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you.

It really jumps out at me what James wrote about God being opposed to those who, in pride, pursue their own way, drawing near to them only after they have submitted again to Him and drawn near.

Anyway, I get the "I'm not going to fuss about it" attitude; it's very...manly. But, in my life anyway, it has also been a justification for spiritual carelessness and passivity, dumping the responsibility for my choices on God by declaring that "my life is in His hands." Certainly, God must shepherd me constantly, initiating things with me spiritually, convicting me, disciplining me, illuminating my understanding, and so on. But I'm not a puppet. Again and again, I must consciously choose God's will and way and submit myself to His control, by an act of my will responding positively to the promptings and convicting work of the Spirit. And so long as I don't, thinking God will just act on my morning prayer and overrule my selfish choices as I make them throughout the day, I am expecting God to treat me essentially as a puppet, which He will not do. God wants a love-relationship with us, as you know, and this requires that we freely choose God - or not.



I think this is very...unfortunate thinking. Was Paul wrong when he wrote what he did in Romans 6?

Romans 6:6-7
6 knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin;
7 for he who has died is freed from sin.

Does your experience - and your thinking that has conformed to it - trump Paul's divinely-inspired words? You may wrestle against the habits of the "Old Man," the deeply-set ruts of thought and behavior formed under the control of Self, but in Christ, you never have to submit to these vestiges of the rule of Self. In the Person of the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, every born-again believer has more than sufficient power always to stand free of the Old Man; no one indwelt by the Spirit ever yields to the "Old Man" because they must. (Philippians 2:13; Philippians 3:16; Philippians 4:13; Romans 8:13-14; 2 Corinthians 3:18, etc.)

I struggled for many years to live, by faith, in the reality of my death to Self, of my freedom from the well-set patterns of living formed under the rule of my Old Man - until I realized that I could not bring myself into a practical experience of this spiritual reality but that the Spirit would as I followed Paul's advice in the last half of Romans 6 and yielded myself - as often as necessary - as a "slave of righteousness" to God. Every time I submit myself again to the Spirit, I invite him to fill me and transform me - an invitation that is necessary to his doing so; for, constrained by love, he will not force me to be transformed. And only as the Spirit is in control of me will he fill me and change me, conforming me to Christ.

Anyway, it's always very interesting to compare notes spiritually and, in the light of Scripture, observe the work of God in the life of a fellow believer. Thanks for sharing! I look forward to future contributions you might make to this forum.

I think you are still not quite clear on the difference between the sin nature and the self of the soul. We die to sin immediately. It's a matter of reckoning once we have the revelation of our co-death with Christ. Death to self is an ongoing process, as Paul said, death working in us.

The Amplified puts it like this: "I assure you, believers, by the pride which I have in you in [your union with] Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily [I face death and die to self]. (1 Corinthians 15:31). We are already dead to sin. Problem solved - as long as we choose to live it. Self is far more insidious. Corinthians talks about dead works that are flammable, so to speak. Sin is relatively easy to detect. Self can appear noble and self sacrificing. CT Studd said that only what is done for Christ matters. I disagree. Only what is done in and through Christ, according to God's will, is of any value.

I see it like a circle. When we are new Christians, the circle is huge. God permits us to get away with much. As we grow, the circle gets smaller and God's is less tolerant of our self indulgence. Many years ago, I read what John the Baptist had to say: "I must decrease, He (Jesus) must increase". And that is the principle that God works in the life of those who seek to be disciples, not just churchgoers.

You know these things in your heart. You live them. You are not quite clear on the fine distinctions as yet. It's far better to have the practice than to know all the theory and not live it. Bless you, aiki. You are on the right track.

 

[aiki]

I think you are still not quite clear on the difference between the sin nature and the self of the soul.

Hmmm...And the distinctions between these two in your view are?

We die to sin immediately. It's a matter of reckoning once we have the revelation of our co-death with Christ. Death to self is an ongoing process, as Paul said, death working in us.

The practical outworking of our spiritual union with Christ in his death, burial and resurrection is an "ongoing process," yes. But this is mainly a work of faith in the believer's already-crucified position in Christ (Romans 6:11), freed from the power of the "old man" and sin, and of remaining in submission to God as His "slave of righteousness" (Romans 6:22).

The Amplified puts it like this: "I assure you, believers, by the pride which I have in you in [your union with] Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily [I face death and die to self]. (1 Corinthians 15:31).

I don't think Paul was referring to anything spiritual in the phrase "I die daily" but to the host of physical tribulations - "in danger every hour/fighting with beasts at Ephesus (vs. 30, 32)" - he endured for the sake of the hope of a future resurrection. This constant danger was akin to dying, bringing Paul to the brink of actual death, again and again.

We are already dead to sin. Problem solved - as long as we choose to live it.

Right. But there is no impulse to sin apart from Self, apart from the patterns of sinful thinking and living established under the rule of the "old man." To die to sin is to die to Self, the "old man."

Self is far more insidious. Corinthians talks about dead works that are flammable, so to speak. Sin is relatively easy to detect. Self can appear noble and self sacrificing.

Well, consider what you're actually saying here:

Sin is easy to detect.
Self is difficult to detect.

Isn't Self sinful, though? Isn't this what you're implying in referring to it as "insidious" and only appearing to be noble and self-sacrificing? Why would you need to bother to detect Self at work, if its work was holy and righteous, right? It appears to me that you think that sin and Self are essentially the same, differing only in degree of subtlety. But, then, wouldn't the believer's freedom from sin necessarily include sinful Self? That seems a reasonable conclusion to me.

I don't see Paul delineating two different realms of sin, one of "obvious" sin, and another of more subtle Self-sin, the latter entirely dealt with by the cross, the other an enemy yet to be conquered by the believer. As far as Scripture is concerned, there is only sin, whatever its origin, and from that sin - all of it - the born-again believer has been separated by their co-crucifixion with Christ.

CT Studd said that only what is done for Christ matters. I disagree. Only what is done in and through Christ, according to God's will, is of any value.

But isn't the latter done by means of the former? Isn't what is done truly for Christ, necessarily done in and through him? It seems so to me. Can one do things for Christ in the power of Self? One can appear to, yes (Matthew 7:21-23); but nothing done in the power of Self is really, at bottom, done for anything other than Self (which is why God never accepts such work). I don't think C.T. Studd was meaning fleshly, Self-originating effort when he spoke of "what is done for Christ."

I see it like a circle. When we are new Christians, the circle is huge. God permits us to get away with much. As we grow, the circle gets smaller and God's is less tolerant of our self indulgence.

Do you see anything like this "circle" described in Scripture? How does God's shrinking tolerance dovetail with the increased fellowship with Him that is the chief aim God has in walking with us? How does one enjoy ever-deepening, joyful and loving communion with one who is increasingly intolerant of one's missteps? It sounds like the better one lives, the more constricted one's margins for error. This seems a very...stressful way of walking with God.

You know these things in your heart. You live them. You are not quite clear on the fine distinctions as yet.

Hmm...Seems we both have refinements to make to our understanding of God's truth.

It's far better to have the practice than to know all the theory and not live it.

Very true.

Bless you, aiki. You are on the right track.

And you, as well.

 

[solomonhall201]

Wow! SO grateful for your post my friend, this was such a refreshing personal testimony!

I knew these principles mentally. God had to do a work in my heart in order to make them real in my experience.

- I think we can all relate to this and it totally reminded me of this book that I just read not that long ago!! You're Not Enough and That's Okay THIS is a great book relating to everything you're talking about when it comes to forgetting self and putting our desires and life on the cross before Lord can truly use us as his disciples! I really recommend to anyone that is interested in another perspective of what you went into.
P.S. I listened to the audiobook for free

If we want to be effective in God's kingdom work, if we want to be disciples and not just be a church attender, we must come to know what Paul discovered. We need to die a good death before we can experience the new life that Jesus came to give us. Those who seek to serve the Lord need to know this truth. Our natural affections, logic, reason, and talents must be nailed to the cross before God will use them.

- Literally fell in love with how you said this, and I almost felt like I didn't need to continue reading your post because you nailed it right here with this small paragraph ahaha but of course I continued!!!

Literally JUST joined this site tonight and I'm already digging the community!!

 

[Aussie Pete]

Wow! SO grateful for your post my friend, this was such a refreshing personal testimony!


- I think we can all relate to this and it totally reminded me of this book that I just read not that long ago!! You're Not Enough and That's Okay THIS is a great book relating to everything you're talking about when it comes to forgetting self and putting our desires and life on the cross before Lord can truly use us as his disciples! I really recommend to anyone that is interested in another perspective of what you went into.
P.S. I listened to the audiobook for free


- Literally fell in love with how you said this, and I almost felt like I didn't need to continue reading your post because you nailed it right here with this small paragraph ahaha but of course I continued!!!

Literally JUST joined this site tonight and I'm already digging the community!!

I'm glad that you understand what I've said. Not everyone does. I'm far from perfect. God's not finished with me yet! But I know what the Christian life is and I know what it is not.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Wow! SO grateful for your post my friend, this was such a refreshing personal testimony!


- I think we can all relate to this and it totally reminded me of this book that I just read not that long ago!! You're Not Enough and That's Okay THIS is a great book relating to everything you're talking about when it comes to forgetting self and putting our desires and life on the cross before Lord can truly use us as his disciples! I really recommend to anyone that is interested in another perspective of what you went into.
P.S. I listened to the audiobook for free


- Literally fell in love with how you said this, and I almost felt like I didn't need to continue reading your post because you nailed it right here with this small paragraph ahaha but of course I continued!!!

Literally JUST joined this site tonight and I'm already digging the community!!

I just read an extract from the book, posted on the Amazon web site. I was blessed by that short testimony.

 

[solomonhall201]

I'm glad that you understand what I've said. Not everyone does. I'm far from perfect. God's not finished with me yet! But I know what the Christian life is and I know what it is not.

Amen!