• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

Can Science Clean Up Swine?

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by Tone, Jun 22, 2019.

  1. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    That is pretty much speculation my friend.
    adding your thoughts that are not found in the Holy Writ may satisfy you, but if you were asked to prove your points you would be at a loss. Most of mankind has never heard of clean and unclean. Ever go to a Chinese or Korean market?
     
  2. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

    +1,530
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Celibate

    It's not speculation.

    I tried asking for direct scripture where the Most High God says any of His laws are void on this thread (and forum), and that failed miserably. Everyone thinks Paul is the Most High God, or absolutely ignores the question.

    I just left out the bible verses since it would be a general waste. The people that care will determine how speculative it is on their own.
     
  3. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

    +893
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    I’m wondering if those that think we should live as Noah lived, think that we should go back to procreating with our brothers and sisters?

    I don’t see the issue using their logic.

    But why stop at Noah? Can’t we just go back to living naked like Adam & Chawah?
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  4. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

    +893
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    The only leg these people have to stand on is a misinterpretation of Paul’s letters.

    They have a handful of cherry picked sentences from various letters of Paul, that they twist and distort to fit their doctrines of lawless “love”.
     
  5. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

    +893
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Legalism is a buzzword used to control people.

    If you are seeking to obey God’s commandments, you get labeled as “legalistic” and “forsaking Messiah”.

    It’s all about control, and keeping people away from the truth.
     
  6. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

    +893
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    You make a good point - God didn’t give Adam every single plant, nor tree. He gave him every tree that produces fruit except the tree of the knowledge of good & evil.

    “Every” and “all” needs to be understood in it’s proper context.

    It’s just like Paul saying “every creature of God is good ” in 1 Timothy 4:4, yet this statement is qualified by being sanctified(made set-apart) by the word of God in verse 5.

    The “word of God” in this instance
    Is the Torah, and swine was never sanctified(set-apart) in the Torah. Swine was never sanctified. You can’t pray over unclean animals and make them clean.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  7. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    Let's discuss Jesus ambassador, Paul. I really do not believe that you would want to get into a thorough discussion as to how Paul has taken a group of people who were under the law and brought them out into the wonderful world of Faith and Grace. It was Jesus working through Paul that told the Galatians that they were foolish for allowing the Judaizers to persuade them to observe old covenant law. After dying on the Cross to save mankind from the curse of the law some would think to put mankind under those failed laws that Jesus ended.

    It is no wonder that those who would have us all under the laws of the failed covenant have no use for the writings of Paul. His writings are a thorn in the sides of those people. If you believe we are under the new covenant Paul becomes a true blessing.

    I, for one, would appreciate how you derive your conclusions. I cannot find the passages that would make your statements valid. So far I have no reason to believe what you write. I have to believe that what you write is speculation.

    I care because there are many lurkers reading what we write and if we cannot prove our thoughts then we are giving false information.
     
  8. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    What is legalistic is using now-defunct laws as a means of salvation and telling others they must follow their belief system or be lost. Where do you get that using the word legalism can control anyone? That doesn't make any sense now does it?

    I want to obey God's commandments, just stop putting commandments that were never meant to control anyone except Israel as something we too must do.
     
  9. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

    +1,530
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Celibate
    All you have to do is

    1. Understand Paul is not the Most High God Or the Word of God Himself

    2. Understand anyone of the Most High God will not contradict Him

    3. Realize that the Most High God never reneged, or made null any of His Law

    Now, show me one place where the Word of God Himself, or the Most High God ever said we can make any part of His Law inert, void or inoperable.

    Dont give me Pauline scripture, I do not worship Paul. I worship the Most High God who is greater than Paul. Show me where the Most High God said that we can make any part of His Law null, void or inoperable.

    The danger in those who follow Paul as God is that they forget Paul is not God when they read his words. And, his easily misunderstood letters have spawned generations of people in danger of Judgment because they believe they can operate on faith without obedience. Paul is not saying what people think he is saying, or else he is a liar. Paul shouldn't/wouldn't contradict the Most High God: compare again.

    Show one place where the Most High God Or the Word of God Himself has given any entity the right break any of His Laws previously set up. You kept bringing up Paul; he isn't a factor when talking about the Word of God and the Most High God (because Paul is neither.)
     
  10. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

    +893
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    When/where did I say anything about salvation?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • List
  11. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    Well, Well, Well, now we know why you and probably many others have beliefs that do not take the writings of Paul as canon. Since I do believe Paul was Jesus ambassador to all of God's children and you will deny any scripture I present that is from him let us part as friends seeking to do the will of God.

    One thought, I presume since you deny Paul you will also deny Jn 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. Jesus lived under the Sinai covenant. Those were the commandments He lived by. We, on the other hand, are to observe Jesus commandments by His own words.

    John in 1JN3:19-24 explains what those commands are. Do you also deny John?
     
  12. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

    +1,530
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Celibate
    I believe Paul does not contradict the Most High God, and that he never meant to insinuate we can freely break any of the commandments previously set up by the Most High God. Paul is canon; the idea that he advocates Christians (Hebrew to Christian, or "Gentile" to Christian) break the commandments of the Most High God previously set up by Him is where I see incredible fault.

    Why cant you answer the question? If you are basing doctrine on something as big as following, or not following [certain] laws, show where the Arbiter of the Law (The Most High God, or the Word of God) says that we can make any of His laws inert, void or inoperable.

    Can you answer the question?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • List
  13. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    I cannot quote Paul who Christianity uses for much of our doctrine yet you do believe Paul should be part of canon??? Wow!

    Is Jesus alright to use to answer your question? I feel like I am walking on needles. I am pretty sure you will not agree with Jesus either, but I will try.

    In Matt 5:
    17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

    18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

    Jesus first is telling us that it was not His intention to destroy the law. He didn't have to Kaon, the Israelites had already done that. The reason Jesus had to come to was to save the Jews because they had broken the covenant so many times God finally said it was time for the new and better covenant to take the place of the one Israel desecrated. He sent Jesus to initiate the new covenant and it was ratified, not with the blood of animals, with Jesus own blood at Calvary.

    Then Jesus next words were "I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." The best meaning of the word fulfill is to bring to an end. He came to bring to an end the law that Israel desecrated. The Sinai covenant was an "if" covenant. Ex 19: 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: And since it was an "if" covenant Israelites had to obey the rules of that covenant or the covenant would be broken. That is exactly what happened. Jesus fulfilled the obligation. He did all that Israel failed at doing. The change in covenants happened at Calvary and until that time Israel was still under all of the laws of the covenant. That is the reason Jesus told the Jews that not one jot or one tittle would pass from the law until He fulfilled everything He came to do. Once the new covenant was ratified the old one became history.

    Oh! you say, we are now allowed to do anything we please. We can kill, commit adultery and on and on because we don't have those 10 commandments to live by. Remember John 15:10? I used Jesus words in John to explain that Jesus kept the laws of the Sinai covenant and He asks us to keep the laws that He has given us. In Jn 15: 12 we find the following:
    This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. Jesus brought to an end all of the laws of the old covenant and gave us the Royal Law of Love to live by. If we love one another as Jesus loves us will we sin against our fellow man in any way? You will not find one ritual (ceremonial) law with the exception of what is now communion and possibly marriage in the New Testament. Laws dealing with morality are forever. They are entwined with the Royal Law of Love. When we steal we have broken the law of love.

    There is your answer to your false statement
    "show me one place where the Word of God Himself, or the Most High God ever said we can make any part of His Law inert, void or inoperable.
    that there is no place in scripture"

    What will you do with what I have found not using any of Paul's writings? Will you pick it apart because it doesn't fit your preconceived ideas? Will you try to make the word fulfill fit some other scenario? Everything Paul wrote about the laws of the Sinai covenant coming to an end fit perfectly with what I have presented. I don't have to make excuses for 2Cor3:7-11 where Paul tells us the 10 commandments are done away or in Eph 2:15 where Paul writes that Jesus ended the law or Col 2:
    16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
    17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

    I pray this helps.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
  14. Shimshon

    Shimshon Well-Known Member

    +769
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    Along with Israel and the law, right? Even though the verbiage of the new covenant shows a continuity of both.

    Who are 'us'? Christians as opposed to Jews? Believers as opposed to the circumcised? I wonder if you understand how the theology you describe here fits the definition of replacement.

    You seem to find an inextricable link between the passing of the old covenant with the replacement of Israel by believing christianity. It permeates your doctrine here.
    It may prove useful for you battle against the SDA. But it completely fails in regards to Messianic Judaism, and the promises made to and through Abraham.

    Your description and definition of the new covenant seems to void out Israel and the law of God given Israel. You have replace Israel and our Torah with christians and a new Royal law. This is replacement theology.

    Not only have you distorted the new covenant but you focus on the word fulfilled having misunderstood this is well.

    I've presented this to you before, and you convinently dropped the conversation immediately. Why?

    Luke 21:24
    Jerusalem will be trampled by the Gentiles untilthe times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

    27 And then they (Israel) will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 Now when these things begin to happen, stand straight and lift up your heads, because your salvation is near!”

    He speaks this to Israel. It regards Israel first and foremost. Israel and all attached to her through faith in Yeshua.

    There is an end to the exiled, a return of God's promises to the people of Israel.

    When God is done working with Israel who he scattered into the nations he will return to gather us back home. When the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled will your kingdoms come to a complete end, or do the Gentile nations exist in heaven? Revelation 21:24

    You are completely missing the Spirit of God's promises and the message of Messiah's new covenant, made with and through Israel.

    Can you apply both verses equally? Mathew 5:18 & Luke 21:24

    Can you consider the possibility and ramifications of both verses?
     
  15. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

    +1,530
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Celibate
    @Bob S, @Shimshon provided a succinct answer that directly answers your questions as well.

    You @Bob S may have a real problem with understanding the purpose of the Law, and why the Word of God Himself cannot and will not contradict anything His Father has said. That means Christ didn't come and remove any Law; He fulfilled it because He was literally the only One who could - am the prophets of the OT, the laws and the statutes all point to The Redeemer. This is why Christians with fails if you throw out the old testament.

    What preachers, ministers and instructor are telling people they can disobey the Most High God's Law? These people need to be rooted out and removed from their place if they continue to ignore the rank of The Most High God concerning His Law, and obedience. I don't think you, and people that call others who advocate obedience "legalists" are doing this out of malice, I think someone has greatly mislead through doctrine and culture of men.

    I used to be part of the same

    "Christ fulfilled the Law, now we can eat shrimp and bacon burgers while at the same time condemning homosexuals and ignoring adulterers (and other OT Laws) because Christ fulfilled the Law - and that means erased the Law - for us! I walk by faith only in Christ"
    group. It nearly destroyed my relationship with my Father because I ignored much of who He is - His Law. You should be very careful telling people they can break any of the Most High God's laws because another human (Paul, a minister, peer) has told you so - and especially if you interpret it that way. Immediately, a trigger should go off saying, "the Most High God doesn't renege on His word."

    I want you to really think about what you presented: you gave me evidence that the Law has been null and void based on the words of Christ. So, on one hand His Father says His commandments and Law so be in perpetuity, and on the other hand His Son who He gave everything to contradict His Father and said we can break the laws previously set up? This is not to mention the Word of God called by some "Jesus" is the literal Living Word(s) of the Most High God Himself. Saying Christ changed the Law and demand for obedience is saying He reneged on what He told Moses.

    Really think about what you are saying. Say outloud, "Even though the Most High God has given us the Law and demanded obedience to Him, Christ (His most pleasing son) says that we can break His Laws, and only have to follow two laws distinct from the other 1000 laws the Most High God has set up."

    You please the Most High God through faith and obedience. If you have faith that He is a rewarded of those who diligently seek Him, then why is obedience to Him a problem. The name of this entire game is obedience - whether you are talking about, the Most High God demons and devils, your boss, your parents, or even you. Why would you think obedience to the Most High God isn't important, or can be amended by human doctrine?

    This has to stop or a lot of people will be spiritually vulnerable. Your breast plate in the armour of the Most High God is righteousess. Righteousness is obedience - how else can one be righteous without the Law.

    Please stop this toxic theology of Christianity having nothing to do with the OT, or any obligation to the Law. It is destroying people spiritually. It almost destroyed me when it was time for me to be tested. The enemy will know who forsake the holy covenant; don't "unseal" yourself because of someone else's words - including mine. Find out for yourself so you won't have to rely on anyone but the Most High God.

     
  16. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

    +928
    Christian
    Married
    Do you have a chip on your shoulder? I have not indicated Jews should lose their identity just because God gave you a new and better covenant that, praise the Lord, includes Gentiles. If you would read in Eph 2 it was Jesus who 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
    No, I don't know the meaning of replacement. Where is that found in scripture? Jesus was speaking to Jews for most of His time He was teaching and healing. Instead of criticizing my use of the word us why not look at the whole picture of what I wrote and critique that. As of yet, your chip is showing.

    Did you mean not to use a capital when you wrote Christianity? Both Jews and Gentiles that follow Jesus are called Christians. How about trying that thought again without using "seem". Either I did or didn't.

    The Israelites got their nation just as God promised. Had they kept their part of the covenant there would not have been any need for a new one.

    Now allow me to summerize what you "seem" to believe. You seem to have one foot in the Christian belief and the other in Judaism.

    Okay, since you answered the fact that I didn't understand replacement theology, I am one who believes that the laws of the Sinai covenant have been replaced with the laws of the new covenant. So what does that make me? Have I lost my eternal reward? If the keeping of the old covenant could have saved even one soul it would not have had to be replaced. The covenant was not about salvation. It was instruction on how God wanted Israelites to live first in the desert and later in the land of Canaan. His promises were based on "IF" they kept the covenant requirements.
    Moses explained how God saved Abraham, so the Israelites knew the plan of Salvation. We all are still saved by that plan.

    I need some proof that I distorted anything. Saying I did won't buy anything.

    Sorry, I didn't mean to drop anything. I must have overlooked your explanation.

    Funny you should use a passage with the word fulfill. You say I have a distorted the word fulfill in the case of Matt 5 and then when reading Luke 21 He is using the same meaning as Jesus did. 24 They will be killed by the sword or sent away as captives to all the nations of the world. And Jerusalem will be trampled down by the Gentiles until the period of the Gentiles comes to an end.

    I guess Jesus didn't make us one as in Eph 2:14 For Christ himself has brought peace to us. He united Jews and Gentiles into one people when, in his own body on the cross, he broke down the wall of hostility that separated us. 15 He did this by ending the system of law with its commandments and regulations. He made peace between Jews and Gentiles by creating in himself one new people from the two groups. 16 Together as one body, Christ reconciled both groups to God by means of his death on the cross, and our hostility toward each other was put to death.
    Jesus did this by replacing the old covenant with the promised new covenant. Jesus has become the World's High Priest. When the priesthood changed so did the law Heb7:
    So if the priesthood of Levi, on which the law was based, could have achieved the perfection God intended, why did God need to establish a different priesthood, with a priest in the order of Melchizedek instead of the order of Levi and Aaron?
    And if the priesthood is changed, the law must also be changed to permit it.


    I am? Where have I missed the point of anything? Either Jesus did what He came to do or Jews are still under the 613 laws and await the Messiah's coming. The new covenant was made for Israel period. Israel is defunct as the nation it was and was to be. Israel lost its chance to be the nation God wanted them to be. Jesus made the new covenant available to Jew and Gentile alike. We are both grafted into the trunk of the tree of life which is Jesus. The disciples were instructed by Jesus to go int all nations with the good news. They and all Christians are to be part of bringing all nations to Jesus.

    Equally to what? Gentiles meaning who? Certainly not Christians who are both Jew and Gentile. Would it mean Muslims? Seems to fit and I pray that God will bring their wrath to an end. As far as Matt5 I have already given you what I believe it means. The Law had to come to an end because the covenant specifically noted that it would continue "IF" and they didn't.

    Certainly, but I don't see the parallel. One brought on the new and better covenant that includes all mankind and the other relates to the time when Jerusalem will be at peace. One has been accomplished and the other is to come.
     
  17. Semper-Fi

    Semper-Fi Active Member

    277
    +117
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    "But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:"

    If Paul taught against the law (which is not true) then he certainly wouldn't have worshiped by believing those things written therein. Paul was not a deceiver by opposing his own beliefs that he taught to others.

    after Acts 13, Acts 26:7 (KJV)
    Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

    -here Paul says that his hope to come, is in the promises given to the twelve tribes.

    Romans 9:4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

    the promises and the covenants of God,
    all the sonship and the glory, belong to Israel


    1. Paul was a Pharisee. A teacher of God's law. He continued to call himself a Pharisee even after joining the church.

    (Acts 23:6) Then Paul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees, called out in the Sanhedrin, "My brothers, I am a Pharisee, descended from Pharisees. I stand on trial because of the hope of the resurrection of the dead."

    2. Paul loved God's law. It was a delight to him. (Romans 7:22) For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being,

    3. Paul called God's law holy. (Romans 7:12)
    So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.

    4. Paul knew that breaking God's law is the very definition of sin.
    (1 John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

    5. Paul said that we don't nullify the law of God by our faith in Jesus Christ.

    (Romans 3:31) Do we nullify the law by this faith? By no means! Rather we uphold the law.

    6. Paul often read from the scriptures on the sabbath (which is kept by the apostles 84 times in the book of Acts). And the only scriptures at that time was the old testament.

    (Acts 17:2) As was his custom, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures.

    7. Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses when he first joined the church. (And ironically, he's still being accused today.)

    (Act 21:21) They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.

    8. These accusations were shown to be false.

    (Acts 21:24) Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know there is no truth in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.

    9. When Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses, he always denied this, and said he does live according to the law.

    (Acts 24:14) But this I confess to you, that according to the Way, which they call a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the Law and written in the Prophets,

    10. Paul said that those who refuse to submit to the law are "carnal minded" and hostile to God.

    (Romans 8:7-8) The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

    11. Paul continued to travel to Jerusalem to celebrate God's feast days after joining the church.

    (Acts 18:21) But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.

    12. Paul often quoted from Moses's writings, and cited it as authority.

    (1 Corinthians 9:9-10) Do I say this merely on human authority? Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? For it is written in the Law of Moses:“Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God is concerned? Surely he says this for us, doesn’t he? Yes, this was written for us, because whoever plows and threshes should be able to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest.

    13. Paul claimed that ALL scripture is good for instruction in righteousness, and given through inspiration of God. He never singled out Moses' writings.

    (2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

    14. Paul mentions that the levitical priests are still offering sacrifices to God even after Christ's death on the cross.

    (Hebrews 8:3-4) Every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices, and so it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer.

    If he were on earth, he would not be a priest, for there are already priests who offer the gifts prescribed by the law.

    15. The most well known teaching in Paul's letters is the one where he says
    "you are not under law but under grace".

    Millions of people quote this scripture, they almost always leave out the scripture that immediately follows it. Watch what happens when you add the context....

    (Romans 6:14-16) For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? By no means! Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

    16. Paul told the Colossians not to let anyone judge them because they were observing God's sabbaths and feasts because these appointed times are "a shadow of things to come".

    Meaning they reveal future events, just like the passover foreshadowed Christ's sacrifice on the cross.(Colossians 2:16-17)

    17. Paul never repremanded anyone for obeying God's law. Instead, he repremanded new gentile converts, the Galatians, who were trying to be justified by the law, instead of faith in Jesus Christ.

    (Galatians 2:16) Know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.

    18. The Galatians, who Paul was repremanding for trying to be justified by the law, were going back to serving other gods after they were circumcised. This is why Paul had to explain that the works of the law can't earn your salvation.

    (Galatians 4: 8-11) Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those who by nature are not gods. But now that you know God—or rather are known by God—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable forces? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months and seasons and years! I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.

    - those weak and miserable forces where not Gods Holy convocations.

    19. Paul understood that obedience to God's law is a natural result of salvation. Once you become a true christian, God writes His law on your heart and mind, and causes you to walk in them.(Hebrews 10:16)

    (Hebrews 10:16) "This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds."

    20. Paul's letters come with a warning label attached to them.

    (2 Peter 3:16-17) He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters.His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.

    Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position.
     
  18. Semper-Fi

    Semper-Fi Active Member

    277
    +117
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Should we Do what Paul did?

    Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.

    Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

    -- here was A perfect chance to tell gentials not to follow the commandments, but here he was teaching new gentials on the sabbath, who never before keep it.

    Act 13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.

    Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

    -why not preach the next day, why wait a whole week before speaking.

    Act 16:12 And from thence to Philippi, which is the chief city of that part of Macedonia, and a colony: and we were in that city abiding certain days.

    Act 16:13 And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.

    -
    Act 17:1 Now when they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, where was a synagogue of the Jews:

    Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
    -

    Act 18:1 After these things Paul departed from Athens, and came to Corinth;
    Act 18:2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy, with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart from Rome and came unto them.
    Act 18:3 And because he was of the same craft, he abode with them, and wrought: for by their occupation they were tentmakers.

    Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

    Paul was preaching to Gentiles in Gentile cities on the Sabbath. Recorded at least 84 times Paul preached to gentials on the sabbath day.
     
  19. bbbbbbb

    bbbbbbb Well-Known Member

    +9,575
    Non-Denom
    Well, duh, what is the point in preaching to people when they are busy at their jobs during the rest of the week? Where are you going to find these people, unless you go from house to house as the early Christians did? Did they wait for the Sabbath to roll around so they could do public preaching as
    Paul did?
     
  20. safswan

    safswan Member

    204
    +90
    Christian
    The statement does not need an interpretation only for one to read with understanding.There is no need for the Lord to say:

    Genesis 9:
    3Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.

    It could easily have been:

    "Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you."

    The additional phrase is for a reason.It places a limitation on the first phrase.This shows that just as they could not eat every single herb God created(Genesis 1:29) so it is they could not eat every single animal but only those designated by God for that purpose.The fact that Noah knew the difference between the clean and unclean supports this understanding.

    If one should fail to understand this and claim the differentiation was for sacrificial reasons only(as you did),then the thought that God would reject the unclean as sacrifice but then give it to man to eat should rectify this misunderstanding.If it is abominable for God it is abominable for man.It is as simple as that.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2019
Loading...