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Featured Calvinism and Abortion

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by Zachm531, Nov 17, 2020.

  1. Zachm531

    Zachm531 Member

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    *Edit*: This post is not meant to accuse or insult calvinists, this is just a question I had. I am also not saying all calvinists are west-borrow. I attend a reformed church myself! Please stop being so sensitive!

    As I was thinking on total depravity and the west-borrow baptist church(calvinist extremists), I had this thought about calvinism taken to its logical end. What are your thoughts on this?

    A calvinist would say that God hates sin and the sinner(hence Limited Atonement):

    “The LORD tests the righteous, But the wicked and the one who loves violence His soul hates.”
    ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭11:5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

    And we glorify God in His holiness and judgement of sin. So lets take this to its logical extreme:

    “Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.”
    ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭51:5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬


    So how does a calvinist take issue with abortion? If an infant has sinful nature at conception, and dies in the womb, shouldnt the calvinist glorify God for punishing the sinner? Shouldnt calvinists glorify abortion because God is judging sinners?

    ""We may rest assured that God would never have suffered any infants to be slain except those who were already damned and predestined for eternal death." - John Calvin, Harmony of the Law, Vol 2, "Judicial Supplements", Comments on Deut ch 13.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2020
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  2. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I'm a Calvinist in the first 3 points of Dort. All including infants were judged guilty of sin in Adam. But the longer we live the more wrath we store up. So and early death is better than death in old age where we accumulate more sin to pay for.

    But elect infants were justified by Christ's death and go to heaven which is as good as it gets. And miss the perils of life on earth. The same is true if they remain until old age.
     
  3. Ezana

    Ezana Ιησούς Χριστός Νικά

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    Are you saying that abortion only ever happens because God actively wills it as a condemnation of infantile sinfulness?

    I'm not a Calvinist, but I'm curious to hear responses to my question from both the OP and any Calvinist who'd care to weigh in.
     
  4. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Part of God's judgement is worse than that. People under judgement ate their young in the siege of Jerusalem and in some Old Testament situations.
     
  5. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Perhaps such a person should think it wise to abort EVERYBODY?
     
  6. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    We are not to kill. Wicked people kill their young as part of the judgement in scripture.
     
  7. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    So, maybe I'm not hearing you right but would it really be best to abort everybody then? My earlier post was a bit facetious but you got me wondering.
     
  8. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It is murder. So no.
     
  9. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There are sufficient wicked people to do it so neither you nor I would have to do it or approve of it. But then what is the penalty for doing it or approving of it?
     
  10. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    What does the bible say about unrepentant murder? Any examples? How about repentant murder?
     
  11. Isilwen

    Isilwen Well-Known Member

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    So glad that I don't believe in Calvinism after reading this thread!
     
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  12. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If they were not saved then it's just more sins piled on top. If they were saved, it's OK.
     
  13. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    How do you deal with these issues?
     
  14. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain

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    Using the same logic, would you also say that Calvinists should be in favor of murder and genocide?
     
  15. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    David killed Uriah and received forgiveness. But endured extreme repercussions in his family because of it.
     
  16. Isilwen

    Isilwen Well-Known Member

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    I believe in choice when it comes to abortions. Abortion is a no no for me and whomever I am with, but I allow for choice. But, the thing where the longer you live the more wrath you store up stuff, yeah, no!

    That makes repentance of no effect and therefore Jesus died for nothing!
     
  17. Ezana

    Ezana Ιησούς Χριστός Νικά

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    Misses the point of my question. Is every single abortion a specific act of the will of God to condemn each baby to death for their sinfulness?
     
  18. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    God would not be good if he did not punish all with death. Early death is better than dying in old age. But the upside is, Christ died in the place of those God chose to save, including infants.
     
  19. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Capone and Dillinger had aproval too.
     
  20. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain

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    To answer the OP, here is how a Calvinist would take issue with abortion. I am a Calvinist, by the way. And I do take issue with abortion.

    1. The Bible teaches that murder is wrong.
    2. Abortion is murder.
    3. Therefore abortion is wrong.

    It's very simple. We take issue with it in the same way that all other Christians would take issue with it.
     
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