Calvin quote

[Hammster]

The first thing the apostles told people they were trying to convert was repent and believe. They don’t receive the indwelling Holy Spirit until after repentance.

I’ve not argued otherwise.

 

[BNR32FAN]

What does that have to do with my post?

It has everything to do with your post. Where in the scriptures does it say a person must be born again to please God?

 

[Hammster]

It has everything to do with your post. Where in the scriptures does it say a person must be born again to please God?

Those exact words? Nowhere.

 

[renniks]

How does my theology make it logically impossible?

Could man go against God's decree about the fall? Could he choose another path? If not, then not sinning was logically impossible.

 

[renniks]

You can’t repent until you are born again. Remember, you can’t please God in the flesh. I think we can agree that repentance is pleasing to God.

This is so twisted. I can quote a multitude of verses saying that belief and repentance comes first, then the new birth.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Those exact words? Nowhere.

I know, your getting that idea from Romans 8 which says


“For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot please God. However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:5-11‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Repent (Metanoia)
1) to change one's mind, i.e. to repent
2) to change one's mind for better, heartily to amend with abhorrence of one's past sins"Repentance (metanoia, 'change of mind') involves a turning with contrition from sin to God; the repentant sinner is in the proper condition to accept the divine forgiveness.

When a person changes from setting his mind from the flesh to setting his mind on the Spirit he has just repented.

 

[Hammster]

Could man go against God's decree about the fall? Could he choose another path? If not, then not sinning was logically impossible.

Since God has a purpose for sin, sin was going to happen. But that doesn’t mean God makes anyone sin. That would go against His nature.

 

[Hammster]

This is so twisted. I can quote a multitude of verses saying that belief and repentance comes first, then the new birth.

Go ahead.

 

[Hammster]

I know, your getting that idea from Romans 8 which says


“For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot please God. However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:5-11‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Repent (Metanoia)
1) to change one's mind, i.e. to repent
2) to change one's mind for better, heartily to amend with abhorrence of one's past sins"Repentance (metanoia, 'change of mind') involves a turning with contrition from sin to God; the repentant sinner is in the proper condition to accept the divine forgiveness.

When a person changes from setting his mind from the flesh to setting his mind on the Spirit he has just repented.

That’s not what repentance means.

 

[renniks]

Since God has a purpose for sin, sin was going to happen. But that doesn’t mean God makes anyone sin. That would go against His nature.

Lol, as if there's any practical difference, between making something happen that causes sin and causing sin himself." It wasn't me officer, it was the gun! I was holding it, and when I squeezed the trigger the gun killed that guy."

 

[renniks]

Go ahead.

They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household.”
Acts 16:31
Acts 2:21
John 3:18
John 20:31
Romans 10:10
Mark 16:16

 

[Hammster]

Lol, as if there's any practical difference, between making something happen that causes sin and causing sin himself." It wasn't me officer, it was the gun! I was holding it, and when I squeezed the trigger the gun killed that guy."

Let’s look at what your theology must believe. God didn’t want sin to happen, but was powerless to stop it.

Is that better?

 

[Hammster]

They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household.”
Acts 16:31
Acts 2:21
John 3:18
John 20:31
Romans 10:10
Mark 16:16

Which one says that belief comes before regeneration? I’m not seeing it anywhere in those.

Please be specific.

 

[renniks]

Which one says that belief comes before regeneration? I’m not seeing it anywhere in those.

Please be specific.

All of them. To see it the other way, you have to read them back wards. Paul should have told the jailer: " you don't have to do anything, God will irresistibly cause you to believe when he's ready to."

 

[renniks]

Let’s look at what your theology must believe. God didn’t want sin to happen, but was powerless to stop it.

Is that better?

That's not my theology. God allowed sin, but did not decree or desire it. It was one possibility of many. He did not stop it from happening because he desired relationship more than slaves.

 

[Hammster]

All of them. To see it the other way, you have to read them back wards. Paul should have told the jailer: " you don't have to do anything, God will irresistibly cause you to believe when he's ready to."

Let’s look at that one.


and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”
— Acts 16:30-31

Where does it say that if he believes that he will be born again?

 

[Hammster]

That's not my theology. God allowed sin, but did not decree or desire it. It was one possibility of many. He did not stop it from happening because he desired relationship more than slaves.

How would stopping sin affect a relationship? And where can I find that notion in scripture?

 

[bling]

“he arranges all things by his sovereign counsel, in such a way that individuals are born, who are doomed from the womb to certain death, and are to glorify him by their destruction.”

Calvin’s Institutes, Book 3 Chapter 23 paragraph 6.

Assuming that the doctrine of Open Theism is false (which we must do in this forum), is this a true or false statement, and why?

No it is false.

 

[Hammster]

No it is false.

Why?

 

[BNR32FAN]

That’s not what repentance means.

Yes it is what it means, which is why you still decline to provide a definition. I straight copied & pasted the definition of metanoia from Strong’s concordance.