Book Bannings

[DragonFox91]

By the time kids reach eleven years of age they're already sexually aware and I'm guessing that some have already experimented with sexual activity. Should they be left to find out about sex on the internet, in chat rooms, from their friends? I have no idea where you get the idea that "it's another thing to teach them they can change their bodies the way they want to when they want to, or that 'you were born into the wrong body.' " Where is that being taught and by whom? It seems to me to be reductio ad absurdem.

Are you still living in the 60s? Sex ed is already taught, dude! Learned about inapprorpriate touching in 1st grade. Discussed briefly in 4th, learned it in 5th grade, was fleshed out in 6th & 7th. I think it was handled in the way it should be. That was 20 years ago. Do you support teaching it even younger?

I have no idea where you get the idea that "it's another thing to teach them they can change their bodies the way they want to when they want to, or that 'you were born into the wrong body.' " Where is that being taught and by whom? It seems to me to be reductio ad absurdem.

That's exactly what transgenderism books for kids are! Are you being serious right now? Get your head out of the sand.

 

[Archivist]

The Rosa Parks book was put on a vetted list. They need to go thru race books to make sure there's no CRT nonsense in them. If it does have that, then I'm all for banning it for little kids, no I'm not sorry.

& I first learned about racism, MLK JR, slavery, etc. in 1st grade 25 years at a school 99% white (it's then taught every year after that for months at a time). Only in liberals minds is racism is bad not taught. No problem w/ teaching that stuff to kids. CRT is what conservatives are against.

Except putting a book on a shelf and teaching CRT are two very different things.

LGBTQIA+ books need to be examined as well. Teaching kids boys can date boys & girls can date girls is one thing, anything that gets sexual or transsexual is quite another.

So how is putting “Heather has Two Mommies,” a book that has been banned, sexual or transsexual?

 

[pescador]

Everything else is allowed in public schools. What makes religion so different?
Sounds like the Left already has a burning/banned book list to me. & No, these sexuality books aren't just 'About Transgenderism'

a) "Everything else" is not allowed in public schools." There are limitations about what can be taught.
b) "Sounds like the Left already has a burning/banned book list to me". To you perhaps, but that is not the case. It is "the Right" that is trying to stifle knowledge.
c) "these sexuality books aren't just 'About Transgenderism' " Which sexuality books?

 

[pescador]

Sex ed is already taught. Learned about inapprorpriate touching in 1st grade. Discussed briefly in 4th, learned it in 5th grade, was fleshed out in 6th & 7th. I think it was handled in the way it should be. Do you support teaching it even younger?


That's exactly what transgenderism books for kids are! Are you being serious right now? Get your head out of the sand.

a) No, I don't think sex ed should be taught younger than 4th and 5th grade.
b) Do you think that insulting me shows anything but your intolerance?

 

[Archivist]

Because the Nazis weren't the first to do that (Ecc. 1:9, James 3:13-18):

I never said the Nazis were the first to ban books.

Some knowledge and culture is better lost forever (1 Cor. 10, Deut. 12:3, Ex. 23:13, 23:24, Luke 21:33, Mark 13:31, Matt. 24:35). Would this make the Apostle Paul a Nazi, destroying occultic literature which the Bible forbids (Deut. 18:9-15)? If not, then what about other topics the Bible forbids promoting (Col. 3:11, Gal. 3:28, Lev. 18, Num. 12)? Why?

My library once received a donated copy of the Quran which we processed and put on the shelves. We later had a patron who demanded that we burn it. Needless to say, that did not happen. For the record, our collection included several copies of the Bible.

Aren't we all fallible human beings predisposed towards selfishness (Jer. 17:9, Rom. 3:23, Prov. 16:16-25)? Is all knowledge equal and worth preserving, let alone easily accessible? Why

So who decides what does and does not get preserved?

 

[Archivist]

Everything else is allowed in public schools. What makes religion so different?
Sounds like the Left already has a burning/banned book list to me. & No, these sexuality books aren't just 'About Transgenderism'

Can you post a link to this left burning/banned book list?

 

[Rene Loup]

I never said the Nazis were the first to ban books.

Godwin's Law being invoked would leave that impression to a number of users:

While I don't see it as a fallacy, this argument in light of Biblical record fell short for me.

My library once received a donated copy of the Quran which we processed and put on the shelves. We later had a patron who demanded that we burn it. Needless to say, that did not happen. For the record, our collection included several copies of the Bible.

It's the library's property, so it's the owner's decision (Josh. 24:15, Luke 16:1-15, 19:11-27, Matt. 25:14-30). If s/he bought it off of you to later burn as his/her own legal property, that would be different. There are people who do that while shopping at thrift stores. The money often goes to good causes, and these books/DVD's/whatever becomes their own legal property, so no laws are broken (Luke 20:20-26, Matt. 10:16, 22:15-22, Mark 12:13-17, 1 Pet. 2:11-25, Rom. 13:1-10).

So who decides what does and does not get preserved?

The Holy Bible.

Is it not God's infallible Word to you, as a fellow believer in Christ (Josh 24:15, 2 Tim. 3:16-17)? Why?

On April 5, 2022, at roughly 6:40 PM Eastern Time, I've added more info in paragraph #3. My apologies, I'm a fallible human being who's predisposed towards selfishness.

 

[Rene Loup]

Were my peers asleep in school? We literally learned about slavery, racism, MLK Jr, Rosa Parks, the South being evil, etc. every year again & again since 1st grade. Are they completely dumb it wasn't taught? My school was 99% white in a city 99% white . & that was 25 years ago!

This nonsense that white conservatives suppress knowledge about the country's history of slavery, racism, civil rights, etc. NEEDS to end now!

I STILL read opinion pieces that NONE of this is taught & it drives me bonkers.

This topic certainly needs to be discussed in an impartial, Christ-like manner with no scapegoats. Within my own lifetime, I saw the USA go from 'America can do no wrong' to 'America can do no right.' Both are toxic ways of looking at one's own country. Seek solutions, not scapegoats. Eventually, we'll run out of people to blame. God bless!

 

[Archivist]

Here are a few challenged and banned books and the reasons why they were challenged or banned:

The entire Harry Potter series—witchcraft

The Lorax—against the timber industry

The entire Twilight series—sexually explicit and religious views

James and the Giant Peach—the spider licking her lips could be sexual

Where’s Waldo—exposed cartoon boob in a beach scene in the original edition (removed in later editions)

The Diary of Anne Frank—sexual content, plus book was said to be “a real downer”

Adventures of Huckleberry Finn—racially offensive language

Heather has Two Mommies—homosexuality

The Dictionary—contains dirty words

Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland—Anthropomorphic animals

Brown Bear, Brown Bear, What do You See—author has the same name as a socialist author

Harriet the Spy—main character spies on and talks back to adults

And Tango Makes Three—Homosexuality

I am Jazz—Transgender child

Looking for Alaska—Sexually explicit scene

A Wrinkle in Time—sends a mixed signal to children about good and evil

The Bible—the claim is that separation of church and state means it cannot be in public schools (that is incorrect)

Nasreen’s Secret School:A True Story from Afghanistan—child protagonist offers a prayer to Allah

 

[Archivist]

Godwin's Law being invoked would leave that impression to a number of users:

Except I didn’t invoke Godwin’s Law, I stated a simple fact.

It's the library's property, so it's the owner's decision (Josh. 24:15, Luke 16:1-15, 19:11-27, Matt. 25:14-30). If s/he bought it off of you to later burn as his/her own legal property, that would be different.

The library would not sell a book that is part of the collection.

The Holy Bible.

But we a talking about public schools.

Is it not God's infallible Word to you, as a fellow believer in Christ (Josh 24:15, 2 Tim. 3:16-17)? Why?

Again, we are talking about public schools.

 

[Rene Loup]

Except I didn’t invoke Godwin’s Law, I stated a simple fact.

Then we'll agree to disagree, agreeably.

The library would not sell a book that is part of the collection.

Some libraries give away unwanted books at the cost of voluntary donations. I also updated my previous post with more info, if you're interested.

But we a talking about public schools.

...

Again, we are talking about public schools.

Again, their decision. Render what is Caesar's unto Caesar and what is God's unto God (Luke 20:20-26, Matt. 22:15-22, Mark 12:13-17, 1 Pet. 2:11-25, Rom. 13:1-10).

 

[Archivist]

Then we'll agree to disagree, agreeably.

Ok

Some libraries give away unwanted books at the cost of voluntary donations. I also updated my previous post with more info, if you're interested.

But this wasn’t an unwanted book. It filled in a gap in our collection. As an academic law library we often had people writing on Middle Eastern affairs who could make use of such a book.

Again, their decision. Render what is Caesar's unto Caesar and what is God's unto God (Luke 20:20-26, Matt. 22:15-22, Mark 12:13-17, 1 Pet. 2:11-25, Rom. 13:1-10).

Again, we are talking about public school libraries.

 

[Rene Loup]

Ok



But this wasn’t an unwanted book. It filled in a gap in our collection. As an academic law library we often had people writing on Middle Eastern affairs who could make use of such a book.



Again, we are talking about public school libraries.

At this point, I think we're having two different conversations. I'm going to take a break from this topic. God bless!

 

[SamanthaAnastasia]

Everything else is allowed in public schools. What makes religion so different?
Sounds like the Left already has a burning/banned book list to me. & No, these sexuality books aren't just 'About Transgenderism'

Separation between church & state.
Public schools are part of the state.
End of story.

 

[DragonFox91]

Separation between church & state.
Public schools are part of the state.
End of story.

You support book bans. Congratulations.

& not what separation of church & state means.

 

[SamanthaAnastasia]

You support book bans. Congratulations.

& not what separation of church & state means.

No I don’t.
Here you go:
Religion in American Libraries Q&A
Learn to read.

 

[SilverBear]

That’s because there are no faith books unless it is academic in school libraries.
Ie “About Islam”, “About Buddhism”, “About Judaism” and “About Christianity”, etc.
No religion in public schools.
You want religion, take your kids to private school.

i just looked at my son's online school library catalog and found the Bible, the Quran, the Vedas, the Bhagavad Gita, and the I Ching. I'm sure there are other religious books on the shelves as well.

 

[SilverBear]

Separation between church & state.
Public schools are part of the state.
End of story.

Separation of church and stae doesn't have any impact on what books are in a library. Separation of church and state means that the state cannot endorse a particular religion.

 

[Archivist]

i just looked at my son's online school library catalog and found the Bible, the Quran, the Vedas, the Bhagavad Gita, and the I Ching. I'm sure there are other religious books on the shelves as well.

Correct. That why I said on my list of banned books that it was incorrect that the Bible was not allowed in public schools. It is, as are the books of other faiths. I’ve heard people incorrectly say that Christian children may not bring Bibles to school. That is wrong. They can do so and may read them during lunch, class breaks or study halls.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Christians, Communists, Nazis, Liberals, Jews, Fascists, Muslims, the Chinese and a whole lot of groups have banned books in the past to greater or lesser extents.

The principle of absolute free inquiry has never been practiced anywhere and in any institution there is always a limit on the material they want to see distributed or read.

To automatically compare banning or limiting books to the Nazis is bad framing. It's a human thing that communities all around the world, regardless of creed do.