Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit

[SoldierOfSoul]

I am actually in the same camp as you more or less, I lean heavily toward arminianism, but I like you, see support for both in scripture. And believe it or not I think that you could follow both doctrines and still be following scripture, because as I see it, the bible teaches both.

I think though that the doctrine of the elect is something that we cannot quite comprehend in our human intellect. Actually I do not think we are to comprehend it, at least not in this lifetime, but what we are to comprehend at least in the limited capacity of our minds is the love of God.

God clearly and purposely displays this love as it truly is, for all of humanity. He pleas many times in scripture for the sinner to return to Him and turn from His sin. Even in the story (which I believe reveals the true heart of our God) of "The Prodigal Son" the will is seen as being the turning point for the lost soul: "He came to his senses".

This is though a very deep discussion, much more then I can put into this post, but I can show you a couple of things that have helped me, one is this thread I started a few months ago that features Dr. Michael Brown a teacher, who discusses both views solely from scripture (no philosophy). It was a great help to me, here's the link: http://www.christianforums.com/t7541061/

Another thing that helped me come to lean more to Armenian teachings were these verses in Jeremiah:

"5Then the word of the Lord came to me, saying:
6“O house of Israel, can I not do with you as this potter?” says the Lord. “Look, as the clay is in the potter’s hand, so are you in My hand, O house of Israel!
7The instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy it,
8if that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it.
9And the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it,
10if it does evil in My sight so that it does not obey My voice, then I will relent concerning the good with which I said I would benefit it." (18:5-10)

If you contrast these verses to the verse that Calvinists use more then any other to prove their predestination stance and the unchanging will of God:

"Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" (Romans 9:21))


When the verses are looked at together it looks as if God gives more freedom to man then the Calvinist allow. I think the striking thing is, is how Paul and Jeremiah both use the metaphor of the Potter, but as we can see in Jeremiah although we are still clay in the Masters hand, we are free in the sovereignty of God to chose how we will respond to Him and this in affect means how He will respond to us. The same goes for the gospel of Jesus Christ, how we respond to it means if we will be saved or not. Of course we cannot be saved without the Holy Spirit drawing us but the fact is the bible teaches all who believe can be saved. So in my opinion the gospel is available to all, the Spirit is poured out on all flesh, so that all have the opportunity to be saved if they hear the gospel and respond. I could be wrong but this is how I see it, I hope I didn't ramble to much, God bless bro.

 

[briareos]

I agree with some others that blasphemy of the holyspirit is not a sin of action or word, it's not anything you actually do or say. Without going into great detail and explanation, like Lee52 said, it is the refusal to be forgiven that makes you unforgivable. The refusal to ever allow the holyspirit into your life, I am also not sure whether this is a line like (the last time) but I am sure that it is denying the God the ability to save you, that keeps you from being saveable.

 

[papaJP]

To deny the Holy Spirit is God and is in control of all things and that we must allow Him to guide us and work through us for the Glory of God.

 

[tsuanthony]

To deny the Holy Spirit is God and is in control of all things and that we must allow Him to guide us and work through us for the Glory of God.

that's what blasphemy against God is corrrect?
i've been a bit confused as well :\

does this sin only apply if you are declaring it to people?
what if it is in your mind? and it happens in your mind because your mind plays around with the words/idea?
I know my mind sometimes wanders into very un desirable thoughts; what would happen if this thought croseed my mind? ((((((((((((((((((

 

[RobertZ]

I know my mind sometimes wanders into very un desirable thoughts; what would happen if this thought croseed my mind? ((((((((((((((((((

Join the club, my mind has been that way since I was a child. Eventually you learn that the thoughts are from the enemy, we know that because we do not like nor do we desire these unwanted thoughts to occur in our minds.

The difference is when you purposefully set out to sin against God with all your heart and mind that you place yourself in a dangerous posistion. Obviously this isnt you or you wouldnt be worried about it.

Never ever could anyone accidentally commit the blasphemy of the Holy Ghost, it is a very calculated and determined sin against God that lies deep within the heart.

 

[briareos]

The bible makes it very clear that there is no single sin that is without forgiveness or that wasn't covered in the death of Jesus Christ, there is no one thing you can ever do that will make you unforgivable. That means there is nothing you can think or say or do that God can't forgive.
When the blasphemy of the holyspirit was spoken of the context was the pharisees refusing Jesus to all ends inspite of all Jesus did... it is the refusal to ever allow God to save you.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

The makes it very clear that there is no single sin that is without forgiveness or that wasn't covered in the death of Jesus Christ, there is no one thing you can ever do that will make you unforgivable. That means there is nothing you can think or say or do that God can't forgive.
When the blasphemy of the holyspirit was spoken of the context was the pharisees refusing Jesus to all ends inspite of all Jesus did... it is the refusal to ever allow God to save you.

I agree with this briareos, and I would also say that those who Jesus said were close to committing this sin felt no remorse or even recognized that they were in danger of committing this sin. Jesus told them this warning and they probably laughed at Him for it. They were not convicted by His words, they were, I'm afraid, past conviction and past salvation or at least very close to that place. But the point I want to make is that if you feel you may have committed this sin, or are worried that you may have committed this sin, that fact alone shows and proves that you have not. Because if you had committed it, you would not care, nor would you know that you had.

 

[tsuanthony]

Join the club, my mind has been that way since I was a child. Eventually you learn that the thoughts are from the enemy, we know that because we do not like nor do we desire these unwanted thoughts to occur in our minds.

The difference is when you purposefully set out to sin against God with all your heart and mind that you place yourself in a dangerous posistion. Obviously this isnt you or you wouldnt be worried about it.

Never ever could anyone accidentally commit the blasphemy of the Holy Ghost, it is a very calculated and determined sin against God that lies deep within the heart.

great to hear! because I was seriously really really worried :\

 

[briareos]

Soldierofsoul,

I think so too

 

[briareos]

This touches the same thing as Hebrews 6.4-6 it talks about people who cannot be returned to repentance.

For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

It describes several diffrent instances of experience with God (the underlined words) to say these people know, they've heard, they've seen, you can't get these people to repent becuase God has nothing left to show them that will make them choose to repent becuase they hold God in such contempt. Like the Pharisees they refused God inspite of everything he did. So these people can't be saved becuase they will not allow it, the emphasis on these peoples repentance, they won't.

The only unforgivable thing is the absolute refusal to ever allow God to forgive and save you. Blaspemey of the holyspirit is not a thought or a phrase or any single act, it is the forever refusing to be saved.

 

[PintoBean]

You haven't blasphemed. If you did, you wouldn't be worried because the Holy Spirit that's STILL in you is now convicting you. What you did is commit a temper tantrum lol. I've done that myself.

 

[briareos]

"Your status "Alwayshopeful" blessed me, thanks! Reminds me 1 Cor 13, that's a beautiful mindset and message.

 

[RobertZ]

What if though you go beyond your last call and then a few years later you decide you want to be saved?

 

[briareos]

I don't believe in such a last call, the bible says all who call upon the Lord shall be saved and that the mercy of the Lord knows no end. I can't remember the verse but the bible talks about the sorrow of the Holyspirit over those in hell, I personally don't think a last call exists. I could be wrong.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

What if though you go beyond your last call and then a few years later you decide you want to be saved?

The Lord said that He would call us and we would come, how could we come to Him without Him calling us? it is impossible! The call comes first, then we are allowed to come to Him.