Biblical Stories that Support Evolutionary Science

[Jerry Smith]

Eph - it appears you have been badly misled on a number of issues. You might want to first study how melanism is inherited. You can't run skin color through a prism the way you might a beam of white light in order to get a spectrum.

You might then want to examine your source about the state of the theory of evolution in scientific circles. Far from being abandoned, it is increasingly the bedrock - indeed one of the three pillars of - modern biology. If you find what seems to be a quote from a scientist "distancing themselves" from it, just scratch the surface and you will find:

1) a creationist masquerading as a scientist
2) a misquote, or
3) a quote from a century or more ago.

Take some time to read the various threads here. Better yet, spend a week browsing
http://www.talkorigins.org

Get informed - it will help you discover the facts about science, and possibly more importantly, help you discover that your sources are making their money by decieving those who aren't strongly educated in the sciences.

 

[MSBS]

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777
Why..? Evolution is based on what's known as "circular reasoning"...It isn't scientific..it was and IS still a theory...That with the increased knowledge of Genetics..and DNA...is a proven fallicy...!

Monkey's for example can have 98 persent of our DNA match...but unless it's 100% it's a total wash out..!

Evolution is just a bad mistake.....it's not even a lie anymore...! It's only taught today by those who would be best compared to people 1000 yrs ago teaching the world was flat....Old outdated once believed to be true data...still pushed by the "hard flat earthers" of Evolution...!

The best Scientists are NOW distancing themselves from it because of breakthroughs in DNA and Genitic's...Your more apt to be struck by lightning 1 million times in a row AND then turn into a monkey..than you are to evolve into one...from anything else...!

Sorry to burst your bubble...!

This is, without a doubt, the funniest most uniformed rant I have seen yet. I particularly enjoyed your misunderstanding of "Genetic's". Keep 'em coming.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by LadyShea
He's asking for the Biblical answers or explanations of what we see today...I am going to guess someone brings up the Tower of Babel and says it separated the races as well as the languages.

At the Tower of Babel, the bible only states men were seperated by different languages...nothing is mentioned about the creation of different races.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by seebs
I think Smilin's point is that "these people changed over time in order to adapt to the environments they live in" is a *perfect* example of evolution, and we have no other explanation.

Exactly the point I'm driving at Seebs.  Different races have developed over time due to continental seperation.  Only evolution can explain the diversity of races from one original male and female.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by JesusServant
I can only explain this Biblically, and I don't think that's what you're looking for. As a matter of fact, I'm never sure what you're looking for Smilin

Actually, that's exactly what I'm asking for.  Explain the diverse cultures from one pair of common ancestors, biblically.  The only explanation I see is that humans evolved into the different races, much the same way that new breeds of horses, cats, dogs have been developed.  That is to say, selective breeding, or in the case of the human race, continental isolation over the centuries.

How else can you explain it?

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by lucaspa
The caution to do your own research applies here as well.  Creationists did account for races before Darwin published Origin and since.  You might not agree with the accounts (I don't), but they do exist. In brief, the races are different "kinds" and were created as different "kinds". 
 

Thanks for the further info on the publications.  I take your position and totally disagree as well, (based upon a minimal scan of the publications you referenced.)  I'd classify them as pure speculation, with no biblical basis.  I view their 'theories' with the same skepticism as I view recent publications that claim God created the Great Pyramid, and the 'Mathematical Proof Of God's Existance'.

My firm stance is that the diversification among humans is evidence of evolution if we are to accept that all mankind descended from Adam and Eve, or either Noah and his family.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777

Eph writes..

How do you explain LIGHT being divided by a PRISM and showing the different colors it's really made up of...?? People as the intermarriages took place...'divided " into different colors...just as LIGHT when it is divided or broken down...from it's original perfect state...!

As people began to "divide" the gene pool again and agin..."different colors were produced..!

sorry Eph, but the properties of light and genetics are two totally different fields.  You're comparing apples to oranges.  Also, by your own statements as people began to 'divide' the gene pool, or more appropriately 'genetic selection and adaptation', different colors or races were produced.  Guess what?  You just agreed with what evolutionary science states.  This is exactly how new breeds of animals are produced in our current world.  (selective reproduction)

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777
Eph replies...

RE read GEN 6...Clearer would be Noah..and his wife ( race unknown )...and Noah's 3 sons..( half Noah half..who knows )...and the 3 wives of Noah's sons...that could have been of different race...So we have on the ark..5 possible races..Noah..His wife...and 3 other wives..= 5...PLUS 3 sons of Noah that could have been of MIXED race...AND as Gen 6:19 says at least 2 of ALL flesh went into the ark..Gen 6:4 says "giants" lived back then AND afterwards...So we're up to a bunch of people and giants on that ark...(( remember David slew Goliath wayyy after the ark landed )...

Again, you agree (assuming all mankind descended from Noah and his family, and a few giants thrown in now) that all races evolved from one common ancestory.  But I'm curious now...which son would be responsible for the Asian descendants, which son would be responsible for the African descendants, and which son would be responsible for the European descendants?

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777
Eph writes...

I agree with it..all pure HUMANS are from Noah..( not along with or including the wives or sons that were on the ark )...thru Adam...to be more precise..!

Again I'm curious, what would fall under the classification of 'impure' humans... and any scientific publications you can reference to support that?

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777
Why..? Evolution is based on what's known as "circular reasoning"...It isn't scientific..it was and IS still a theory...That with the increased knowledge of Genetics..and DNA...is a proven fallicy...!

Sorry again eph, but you're wrong.  If Evolutionary Science is a proven fallicy, then you have to explain the 77,000 + species of plants that have evolved thru hybridization.  (Hybridization is part of Evolutionary Science)

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777

Monkey's for example can have 98 persent of our DNA match...but unless it's 100% it's a total wash out..!

So? Mice and humans share 99% the same genetics, reference: http://www.cnn.com/2002/TECH/science/12/04/coolsc.coolsc.mousegenome/index.html


This only demonstrates the vast changes that just a couple hundred of genetic differences make.

Originally posted by EPHRIAM777

The best Scientists are NOW distancing themselves from it because of breakthroughs in DNA and Genitic's...Your more apt to be struck by lightning 1 million times in a row AND then turn into a monkey..than you are to evolve into one...from anything else...!

Sorry to burst your bubble...!

1. Which scientists? names and references please....

2.  Evolutionary Science has never claimed we can (or will) evolve into a monkey.

3.  My bubble hasn't been burst... you've basically agreed with my original premise

 

[Athlon4all]

Please explain how so many races exist today... (without using evolution)

The Tower of Babel. The LORD confused their languages, and groups of people with a common language migrated to seperate areas and they would not have contact for a long time with other men (ie like to Africa, North America, Europe, Australia, etc). Adam and Eve had the highest amount of genetic information, but as these groups of people migrated and mated with each other and similar descendants repeatedly (like family members mating). Genetic info is lost, and they develop "race traits"

 

[LadyShea]

See I told you someone would bring up the Tower of Babel...pay up on my bet Smilin

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by Athlon4all
The Tower of Babel. The LORD confused their languages, and groups of people with a common language migrated to seperate areas and they would not have contact for a long time with other men (ie like to Africa, North America, Europe, Australia, etc). Adam and Eve had the highest amount of genetic information, but as these groups of people migrated and mated with each other and similar descendants repeatedly (like family members mating). Genetic info is lost, and they develop "race traits"

My friend, your explanation is simply Evolutionary Science. 

So we're in agreement.  Evolution can only explain the different races from a single pair ancester parent.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by LadyShea
See I told you someone would bring up the Tower of Babel...pay up on my bet Smilin

  yes, fortunately, he was correct in his statement that the biblical account ONLY accounts for the diverse languages and scattering of the people.  It doesn't account for the genetic differences between the races.  Amazingly, he agreed with my hypothesis that only Evolutionary Science can explain the many races descending from one common set of parents.   

 

[EPHRIAM777]

quote:
Originally posted by EPHRIAM777

Originally posted by Smilin
How do you explain LIGHT being divided by a PRISM and showing the different colors it's really made up of...?? People as the intermarriages took place...'divided " into different colors...just as LIGHT when it is divided or broken down...from it's original perfect state...!

As people began to "divide" the gene pool again and agin..."different colors were produced..!

Does anyone know if genetically this is even possible? I was always under the impression that it wasn't.

Eph writes...

Well lets look at it another way then..Are people all of one KIND..even though they are of different colors..I say yes...People are people...You can have different colored hair..eyes...skin..But we're still the same KIND...so genetically it MUST be possible..or some other biological way we don't know of or understand fully yet...!

All humans are of the same KIND..we can all inter-marry with each other and produce "human offspring" of various colors and sizes...thus we are of the same KIND... ( I have to be careful how I write this because I'm close to being banned by the monitors )...

EVOLUTION teaching says basically... You can take a rock..and a fish...and mix them together and produce a bird the first time and a horse the next..."Creationists" say no ya can't...fish produce fish..birds produce birds ect ect..every thing after it's KIND.....there can be variations such as size and color..!


Why..? Evolution is based on what's known as "circular reasoning"...


How so?

Eph replies..

Well how do scientists date the various strata layers..?

ANSWER: By the fossils found in them...and How then do they date the fossils..??

ANSWER: By the depth their found at in the various strata layers..!

That means they use the Fossils to date the Strata...and the Strata to date the Fossils....Thats Circular reasoning...using one to date the other and vice versa...In each instance of so called "Scientific Dating"..the same type of method is used...! ...I can list them if you like...?

quote:

it was and IS still a theory...


And always will be. Scientific theories always remain theories. It's the nature of a scientific theory.

Eph writes...

Yes but it's being delivered as "factual"..not theory...and thats where all the controversy was..( not any more really with real scientists... but TV shows and "flat earthers" type disciples..)

Evolution at it's base is death..the entire "theory" rests on things dying and getting better because of it...!

Romans 1:22:24...is the best description God ever gave about Evolutionists...!

I find them....comical nowadays...like a person who might come today with a book from the year 925..and using it to teach US that the world is flat and you can fall off the edge...They truely have gone the way they claim the Dino's to have gone...!....Which is kinda ironic...!

OH BTW you may not be up to speed on the newest "theory" nowadays backed by some Scientists...They now claim that the Earth was "seeded" by another race of beings...It's their vain attempt to save face on the mistake they backed for so long with their own reputations...!

This new CLONAID group we hear of on TV....is a follower of this new "thinking"...Again Romans 1:22 comes to mind..!

For them.... anything but the truth will do...!

 

[Smilin]

Next Biblical Story that only evolution can support.

Given the diverse number of species on the planet today, (I'll look later for a figure, I have to leave soon..lol)
There is no way two of every kind could have POSSIBLY fit into the ark, according to the dimensions given by the bible. (will update tomorrow when I can locate my model)

So,,,

Only Evolutionary Science can account for such a diverse animal kingdom given the limited space of the ark.

My main point: The ark had to have contained only parent species. Not all species we observed today were on the ark.

 

[lithium.]

OH BTW you may not be up to speed on the newest "theory" nowadays backed by some Scientists...They now claim that the Earth was "seeded" by another race of beings...It's their vain attempt to save face on the mistake they backed for so long with their own reputations...

This new CLONAID group we hear of on TV....is a follower of this new "thinking"...Again Romans 1:22 comes to mind..!

IMO the people at Cloneaid are crackpots. Until they show evidence they have nothing. I think you need to stop watching tv and starting reading real scientific news. Because the tv channels never report all the news.

Evolution theory is supports based on the evidence that has been gathered in the last couple houndered years. If you don't agree with the evidence fine, but that doesn't make evolution false or wrong.

I will let Smilin continue he is on a roll.

P.S. Sorry for the typo's I fixed them.

 

[EPHRIAM777]

Eph writes..

How do you explain LIGHT being divided by a PRISM and showing the different colors it's really made up of...?? People as the intermarriages took place...'divided " into different colors...just as LIGHT when it is divided or broken down...from it's original perfect state...!

As people began to "divide" the gene pool again and agin..."different colors were produced..!

Thats one question down..


Biblical references please

Eph writes...

No LS..that wasn't a Bible quote..!

It's whats known as "speculation"...It was intended to answer the question being asked..with a viable "possiblity"...Thats why I used LIGHT as an example...Light when it is broken down with a PRISM refracts into various colors...red orange yellow green blue indigo and violet ( ROY G BIV as an easy way to remember )...But in it's original perfect state that it starts out as LIGHT..( bright white would best describe it )...light is light when all are put together...MY use of it was only to point out that MAYBE..If it's possible for light to divide into other colors..It might be possible for people to do the same once they begin to "divide" the gene pool by reproduction..!

LS...the rest of your post is basically along the same lines..

RE Read Gen..Adam was made by God from the dust of the earth...Eve was made FROM Adam by God...right there both those "beings" had different beginings...

They were of the same flesh..but didn't come about the same way...So the question would be..Was Eve the same color or race as Adam was...?

You give your Biblical scripture that says they were...Because I don't have one that says they were..So thats why we don't know what the races were Adam and Eve could have been White and Black..or Yellow and Brown..or Red and who knows..?? We can only guess at it..!

LS asks...

What's a pure human? Where are the non-pure humans? Biblical references please

Eph wonders..

LS have you ever read GEN 6..?? Please do if you haven't ...and I'll check back to see your response...! It is quite difficult to engage in a conversation about this subject IF you haven't ...

 

[LadyShea]

Hiya Eph, the OP did not ask for speculations, it asked for Biblical references or stories which explained the diversity found amongst humans.

If we wanted to play the speculation game we would never get anywhere!! I could speculate that someone showed a pregnant woman a dark object and her baby was born with dark skin (isn't this how someone in the Old Testament got striped and spotted goats...by showing the ewes striped sticks and spotted stones or some such?)

 

[LadyShea]

Yes, I have read it, I know all about the Giants created when Angels had sex with human women (does this not sound like myth or legend to believers? These kinds of stories were among my first doubts in regards to Biblical accuracy.). Where are they now is what I was asking

 

[Underdog]

"Why..? Evolution is based on what's known as "circular reasoning"...It isn't scientific..it was and IS still a theory...That with the increased knowledge of Genetics..and DNA...is a proven fallicy...!"

Tell that to the scientific community. They will laugh in your face.

"Monkey's for example can have 98 persent of our DNA match...but unless it's 100% it's a total wash out..!"

Wash out of what? And, other living things have a high percentage of simmilar DNA. This ought to say something of some commonality. Wouldn't ya think?

"Evolution is just a bad mistake.....it's not even a lie anymore...! It's only taught today by those who would be best compared to people 1000 yrs ago teaching the world was flat....Old outdated once believed to be true data...still pushed by the "hard flat earthers" of Evolution...!"

Nice switch.

It took the Christian community a long time to finally accept scientific findings that the earth is not flat. The Christians argued from a literal interpretation of the Bible that the earth is flat. It also took the Christian community a long time to finally accept the scientific findings that the earth does not stand still with the sun, planets and universe revolving around it. As a matter of fact, many were ostracized and threatened by the religious community for giving any credence to Galileo or Copernicus.

"The best Scientists are NOW distancing themselves from it because of breakthroughs in DNA and Genitic's...Your more apt to be struck by lightning 1 million times in a row AND then turn into a monkey..than you are to evolve into one...from anything else...!

Sorry to burst your bubble...!"

You show complete ignorance and contempt for this subject. It is only in your imagination that the scientific community is distancing themselves from evolution. Your comments are wishfull thinking at best.

I hope I have bursted YOUR bubble.

 

[EPHRIAM777]

Originally posted by LadyShea

Hiya Eph, the OP did not ask for speculations, it asked for Biblical references or stories which explained the diversity found amongst humans.

If we wanted to play the speculation game we would never get anywhere!! I could speculate that someone showed a pregnant woman a dark object and her baby was born with dark skin (isn't this how someone in the Old Testament got striped and spotted goats...by showing the ewes striped sticks and spotted stones or some such?)

Eph writes...

L S lets review the "OP" ( Original Post )...shall we..LOL


""""Smilin wrote..
We'll begin with the question: "How do you explain all the different races of humans without accepting evolution?"

By the Christian argument, if you assume the biblical flood destroyed all mankind, then everyone descended from Noah and his family...

If you assume some did survive the biblical flood, then all human races descended from Adam and Eve.

For those of you who constantly pop in and claim 'Evolution is a lie, conceived by Satan, a religion to undermine Christianity...etc...etc...

Please explain how so many races exist today""""""



Eph continues...
LS...??? Do you see ANY reference here in the text of the "OP"...that asks anyone to give.."chapter and verse please"...from the Bible"..??

...LOL

I see Smilin asking in the very first sentence "how do YOU explain"...NOT how does the BIBLE explain...

So I as a Christian...made possible speculations on the matter...!

See it yet..??

 

[LadyShea]

Okay, you are correct. I still think Smilin implied he was looking for Biblical references, but did not explicitly state it.

 

Now, you still have not provided any references for your outrageous claims against science and scientists, so let's not get into a nitpicking contest.