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I posted this in another thread called 'debate is dead' and somebody argued that it was just 'arbitrary rules' I was trying to impose...
This is exactly the result of mixing religion [which is a faith based spiritual guide] with science!Faith Guardian, you might want to take a look around you -- at some of the other posters here like Split Rock, Thaumaturgy, Nathan Poe, and California [something].
These guys, at one time, were where you are now -- i.e. Church-going believers who read their Bibles.
But at some point in their life, their allegiance to science led them to having questions that their undershepherds couldn't answer, and the cognitive dissonance was so great, they are now no longer believers -- (guys, please correct me, if I'm wrong).
I get the impression you're on that path as well, but [Ar Cosc take note of these next 4 words:] I could be wrong.
If you don't fall completely away, it's probably because you are a nanotech, and don't see nature as they do, from their respective fields.
In short, these guys love science and nature just as you do, but apparently you see something (or Something) in nature that they once saw, but no longer do; and I'm afraid for you, lest you too err from grace.
Yes, I do, Tiberius -- until you show me this evidence that disagrees with how the Bible says the universe came into existence, there's really nothing to discuss.You think that with your complete LACK of knowledge about science and how it works, as well as your steadfast refusal to listen to any evidence that disagrees however slightly with your preconceived conclusions about the Bible, you can add something of merit to this discussion?
I've seen this flowchart before, and it applies to you as well.Have a look at this, AV...
And that leaves me out, doesn't it?If anyone is to blame then most of it must go to the die hard creationists who insisted that creationism must be taught in schools as science.
Because it is not history either. It is one interpretation of one of several creation parables which do not agree with one another. It is contradicted by everything around us. Calling it history is just the same as calling Peer Gynt history. It isn't. Peer Gynt is an excellent piece of social criticism and cultural analysis, but it's not history. In the same way the creation parable is a good way of dumbing down a much much more complex truth to the basal components which are important across cultural and intellectual divides. It shows us that we're sinful and that God made the world. That we fall short and need to strive for a better relationship with God.And that leaves me out, doesn't it?
I've said for years that creationism is not ... repeat: is not ... science.
It is history -- yet still I'm ridiculed.
Because it's a silly claim. History is well documented and usually when it's something this big leaves a trail to follow. But the ONLY thing supporting you is you. Not the bible. Not creation. Not logic. Only you. So why believe you?This tells me that whether we claim creationism is science, or whether we claim creationism is history -- it doesn't matter with you guys.
So don't expect me to believe that we are the ones to blame.
I'm not buying that one bit.
I understand what you're saying, but I get ridiculed when I claim it is not science.Because it is not history either.
I understand what you're saying, but I get ridiculed when I claim it is not science.
You guys ridicule us for one reason, and one reason only: we believe in it, and you don't.
That's your problem -- not mine.I don't see that.
I don't present any data when asked, because no data was generated -- as my Apple Challenge demonstrates.I see your position being pointed out as nonsensical because it is, and because you consistently fail to defend it, or present any data when asked.
Yeah. You do not have any problems, do you AV?That's your problem -- not mine.
I don't present any data when asked, because no data was generated -- as my Apple Challenge demonstrates.
You will call it something that is subjugated by their belief, or you will be ridiculed.This tells me that whether we claim creationism is science, or whether we claim creationism is history -- it doesn't matter with you guys.
When it comes to creationism, which is my major forte, no I don't.Yeah. You do not have any problems, do you AV?
You show me data from Day One of the Creation event that contradicts how God did it, and I'll consider what you have to say.Oh, but why does ALL relevant data contradict you then?
You will call it something that is subjugated by their belief, or you will be ridiculed.
Call it "rubbish" or "fiction", sayi ts "unrelated to reality". You'll gain their undying lovelol
That's so true, Greg.Call it "rubbish" or "fiction", sayi ts "unrelated to reality". You'll gain their undying love
My pastor is not very well liked in our ministerial association here in town, and he couldn't care less.
The only one? no, but can you think of a better one?Is persecution the only sign that you're doing something right?
That's so true, Greg.
This is why people like Faith Guardian and Lucaspa aren't ridiculed like you and I are (although, I have to admit, Hespera did have enough backbone to take Lucaspa on).
Remember what happened during Jesus' six [illegal] trials, just before He was crucified?
Luke 23:12 And the same day Pilate and Herod were made friends together: for before they were at enmity between themselves.
My pastor is not very well liked in our ministerial association here in town, and he couldn't care less.
The only one? no, but can you think of a better one?
The only one? no, but can you think of a better one?
But AV, your position doesn't even have proper biblical support. It's rejected by most of Christianity, and rightly so. It has no supporting evidence, not even in the bible. It ridicules Christ and takes attention from loving our neighbor and even our enemies. It also pushes people away from Christianity rather efficiently.
That sounds like an old-old joke.That's your problem -- not mine.
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