Article: The Spiritual Danger of Donald Trump

[Caliban]

I am happy to use the classification which Pew Forum uses.

Link?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

But, its is about politics and not the gospel in this case. Is it really your view that Christians have no input into political matters? Maybe I misunderstand your point.

Our nation is a Democracy not a Theocracy. We are dangerously getting into this realm through Dominionism, a theology in great error.

 

[Halbhh]

This article describes a new book that includes articles by 30 Evangelicals warning of the spiritual dangers of electing Donald Trump for a second term. What do you think about this premise?

These are only the tip of the iceberg.

For example, 500 mostly conservative Christian writers, pastors and such opposed Trump's un-Christian policy to block Christian refugees in 2017
Why Tim Keller, Max Lucado, and Hundreds of Evangelical Leaders Oppose Trump’s Refugee Ban

Of course, in this they represent the views tens of millions of Christians, if not over 100 million (probably over 100 million).

We are aware that we are to welcome the stranger, in His Name.

 

[Bobber]

What is the right political decision if two people pray sincerely and come to different electoral choices?

Let me put it this way. If I were a Pastor of a church while making the right choice (political even) is important to me and should be to the individual within the body or gathering or believers it must remain a very personal thing. If you don't it's like welcoming through the door a devilish spirit of division or creating schisms within the group. So what happens if two prayed and they felt they got different answers? Well one of them would probably be wrong in that they weren't hearing from God right BUT even still....I'd tell them vote for what you have in your heart.

 

[Caliban]

Our nation is a Democracy not a Theocracy. We are dangerously getting into this realm through Dominionism, a theology in great error.

I agree with that--I am a strong advocate of the separation of church and state.

 

[Caliban]

Let me put it this way. If I were a Pastor of a church while making the right choice (political even) is important to me and should be to the individual within the body or gathering or believers it must remain a very personal thing. If you don't it's like welcoming through the door a devilish spirit of division or creating schisms within the group. So what happens if two prayed and they felt they got different answers? Well one of them would probably be wrong in that they weren't hearing from God right BUT even still....I'd tell them vote for what you have in your heart.

What is in a persons heart (or mind) is often irrational and highly subjective. It sounds like you are saying the either choice is valid.

 

[Bobber]

What is in a persons heart (or mind) is often irrational and highly subjective. It sounds like you are saying the either choice is valid.

Nope. I'm saying the dangers of allowing of how strife and division can tear apart a local body (a church) far outweighs the insistence on who is right or wrong in the earthly affairs of politics.

 

[Caliban]

Nope. I'm saying the dangers of allowing of how strife and division can tear apart a local body (a church) far outweighs the insistence on who is right or wrong in the earthly affairs of politics.

Are you saying that argumentation and schism in a church is worse than the politics relating to the justice and injustice individuals experience outside the church?

 

[disciple Clint]

This article describes a new book that includes articles by 30 Evangelicals warning of the spiritual dangers of electing Donald Trump for a second term. What do you think about this premise?

30 Evangelicals ?? Wow that is just about all the Evangelicals in the whole United States isn't it, lol

 

[Caliban]

30 Evangelicals ?? Wow that is just about all the Evangelicals in the whole United States isn't it, lol

No, Evangelicals are the largest voting block in the Republican Party and total an estimated 94 million people across the American political spectrum.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

No, Evangelicals are the largest voting block in the Republican Party and total an estimated 94 million people across the American political spectrum.

To add, not all Evangelicals are alike.

 

[Caliban]

To add, not all Evangelicals are alike.

That's right, but there is a reason we use categorical naming; we recognize social binders, ideological connection, and self identification. Evangelicals identify as Evangelicals; it is not an unwanted label. The fact that these 30 Evangelicals have contributed to this book demonstrates they think differently from the vast number of Evangelicals who voted for trump in the last election. Trumps base is comprised of Evangelical voters; he cannot afford to lose them--hence the photo op with the Bible and similar nods to Religious liberty issues.

 

[Albion]

That's right, but there is a reason we use categorical naming; we recognize social binders, ideological connection, and self identification. Evangelicals identify as Evangelicals; it is not an unwanted label.

The fact that these 30 Evangelicals have contributed to this book demonstrates they think differently from the vast number of Evangelicals who voted for trump in the last election. Trumps base is comprised of Evangelical voters; he cannot afford to lose them--hence the photo op with the Bible and similar nods to Religious liberty issues.

I'm picking up different themes in this post. So what's the "bottom line" with this news flash?

It appears to be that 30 Christians who are identified as "Evangelicals" don't like Trump, and that's an impressive 30 people out of tens of millions of Evangelicals in the USA.

 

[eleos1954]

This article describes a new book that includes articles by 30 Evangelicals warning of the spiritual dangers of electing Donald Trump for a second term. What do you think about this premise?

I think they need to re-study scripture. People vote ... but ultimately it's in the hands of the Lord.

Romans 13:1 States That God Establishes All Governments

The key statement that we want to examine in Romans 13:1 is “no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.” There are two words of interest. The first is the word “authority” which in the Greek is exousia and it refers to anyone who has power or can exercise authority. In the context of Romans 13:1-7, it refers to governmental authority. The Greek word that is translated as “established” is tasso. This word appears eight times in the New Testament (Matthew 28:16; Luke 7:8; Acts 13:48; 15:2; 22:10; 28:23; Romans 13:1; 1 Corinthians 16:15). The word means “to appoint, to order, or to arrange”. That is, every governmental leader has been appointed, arranged or established by God .... even undesirable ones.

 

[Caliban]

I'm picking up different themes in this post. So what's the "bottom line" with this news flash?

It appears to be that 30 Christians who are identified as "Evangelicals" don't like Trump, and that's an impressive 30 people out of tens of millions of Evangelicals in the USA.

Yes, they are making claims that it is spiritually wrong to vote for Trump. I have not read the book, I just heard about it, but I am interested in what others might think about the basic premise of the book. The bottom line is that it is interesting news and a point of conversation.

 

[Caliban]

I think they need to re-study scripture. People vote ... but ultimately it's in the hands of the Lord.

Romans 13:1 States That God Establishes All Governments

The key statement that we want to examine in Romans 13:1 is “no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.” There are two words of interest. The first is the word “authority” which in the Greek is exousia and it refers to anyone who has power or can exercise authority. In the context of Romans 13:1-7, it refers to governmental authority. The Greek word that is translated as “established” is tasso. This word appears eight times in the New Testament (Matthew 28:16; Luke 7:8; Acts 13:48; 15:2; 22:10; 28:23; Romans 13:1; 1 Corinthians 16:15). The word means “to appoint, to order, or to arrange”. That is, every governmental leader has been appointed, arranged or established by God .... even undesirable ones.

You may not like this point, but under that logic, any world leader should be respected and followed. That includes the worst you can think of.

 

[Albion]

The bottom line is that it is interesting news and a point of conversation.

You might say that IF the publication didn't talk as though these 30 partisans mean much of anything simply because they are classified as "Evangelicals."

You yourself wrote that Trump was elected with the support of a "vast number" of Evangelicals, and every survey conducted since has shown that they still support him.

 

[eleos1954]

You may not like this point, but under that logic, any world leader should be respected and followed. That includes the worst you can think of.

Romans 13:1-7

Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience. ...

You may not like this biblical point

 

[Caliban]

You might say that IF the publication didn't talk as though these 30 partisans mean much of anything simply because they are classified as "Evangelicals."

You yourself wrote that Trump was elected with the support of a "vast number" of Evangelicals, and every survey conducted since has shown that they still support him.

I'm not sure I understand the point you are trying to make. Can you clarify?

 

[Caliban]

Romans 13:1-7

Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience. ...

You may not like this biblical point

Correct, I don't like it. Using this logic, one would be morally compelled to support, or at least not stand in the way of the third Reich.