faroukfarouk
Fading curmudgeon
And another thing is, How would great painters such as Rembrandt and Rubens have learned to paint so well if they had not practised drawing real people?
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And another thing is, How would great painters such as Rembrandt and Rubens have learned to paint so well if they had not practised drawing real people?I am not speaking about myself and my friends, the fact that women are less visual than men is scientifically proven. Of course there are exceptions.
In any case, often the model has a drape across his or her midsection; so there are levels of nudity also. Context and purpose are important also.One of my MD friends told me that when she was in medical school the med students served as patients to be examined by their fellow students. Her male counterparts saw her nude. She saw them nude. They also had outside people come on for examinations during which those people were naked. Doctors see people nude; it is part of their training as med students.
Artists have to have an understanding of the human body in order to properly paint the body. Painting nudes is part of their training. There is nothing wrong with being an artist and painting a nude, not is there anything wrong with posing as a nude model.
You are right.... except a man become as a little child, he can in no wise enter the kingdom.Raymond, there is no way to get back to those times.
What you are longing for, is the innocence of babyhood. Before you knew right from wrong.
That was the state of the naked Adam and Eve in the garden, before they ate the fruit.
But since humans fell, we know instinctively there is a difference between right and wrong.
And we will always know that difference. Even in heaven.
Satan tempted Eve by trying to get her to doubt the wisdom of God's instructions to her.
He is tempting you to think the same way about God.
When Adam and Eve felt guilty, they made fig leaf aprons for themselves.
As soon as they knew good from evil, they knew clothes were a good idea.
When God showed up on the scene, did he tell them they were mistaken about needing clothes? No.
Instead, He told them those fig leaf aprons were NOT ENOUGH!
And this issue of NOT ENOUGH CLOTHES was so big to God, that He shed the first blood ever shed on the earth, to make coats of animal skins, to cover those first humans.
That's how important it was to God, that the first humans got the message about what constituted proper clothing.
Not just their private parts. And not just females.
BOTH man and woman. And more than fig leaves sewed together, to make little aprons.
And it still matters that much to God, how much we cover our bodies.
You and I are not given the option by God to make up our own rules about whether fig leaf equivalents are okay. God said once they aren't. And when God says something, once is enough.
When we get to heaven, we won't go around naked. We will be wearing robes.
Sorry if that offends you, but it's the Bible.
Hi everyone,
I have a question. I am a married artist and am wondering what your thoughts are on a christian modeling in the nude for a figure drawing class? Is this completely unacceptable? Would this be forbidden in a marriage even though it is not sexual? I am just curious to see how it would be perceived within a CHristian Community.
Look forward to some insight as I have been asked to do this but not sure as a Christian if this is "sin" if there are no alterior motives other than helping artists improve their drawing skills.
You don’t have to be a social psychologist or sexual addiction expert to understand that people (especially men) lust after others rather easily. Just look at the exponential proliferation of pornography and sexual addictions. Modesty (here we are talking about sexuality) has always been a Christian virtue. Not today in western cultures. No artist should be engaged in such things and no model should expose themselves. Immodesty and lust are so prevalent in the west that we have become desensitized to it.
“Things are getting worse very quickly now. The list of what we are required to approve is growing ever longer. Consider just the domain of sexual practice. First we were to approve sex before marriage, then without marriage, now against marriage. First with one, then with a series, now with a crowd. First with the other sex, then with the same. First between adults, then between children, then between adults and children. The last item has not been added yet, but will be soon: you can tell from the change in language, just as you can tell the approach of winter from the change in the color of leaves.
As any sin passes through its stages from temptation, to toleration, to approval, its name is first euphemized, then avoided, then forgotten. A colleague tells me that some of his fellow legal scholars call child molestation "intergenerational intimacy": that’s euphemism. A good-hearted editor tried to talk me out of using the term "sodomy": that’s avoidance. My students don’t know the word "fornication" at all: that’s forgetfulness.” (From J. Budziszewski, “The Revenge of Conscience,” First Things, June/July, 1998, pp. 21-27)
[The Revenge of Conscience | J. Budziszewski]
Has your conscience been compromised by the norms accepted by your culture? Of course it has, whether you are aware of it or not. The morally 'disordering' influence of the media is more subtle and insidious than direct incitement. What happens to all of us, unless our powers of moral judgment are perfectly acute and alert, is that our understanding of what is 'normal' begins to be modified. Under the impression that 'everybody does it', and that nobody nowadays believes much in absolutes of truth and goodness, our defenses are lowered and our values are imperceptibly altered.
How is art modeling in any way equated to sex? If someone lusts in an art class after a model isn't that their own sin? And aren't they just as capable to lust after someone that is clothed?
I am adamantly against the sins you mentioned but that does not equate to art modeling as being a sin... How is it compromising your faith and values if it is not CLEARLY spoken against in the Bible? Fornication, and other sins you mention are CLEARLY spoken of as sin and there is no room for compromise. Tell me where it says in the Bible that nudity in itself is sinful and then answer my question about Isaiah. I am only asking this question because it is unclear and nobody on this board has provided anything close to a clear answer or reason that this would be sinful to do. Some people saying that I should know this is sinful but not giving me any biblical/foundational reason for why I should know this is wrong.
Nobody seems capable of answering the specific questions I asked and showing CLEARLY that are modeling in a professional setting is sinful according to the Bible.
The Bible is not a book whereby it teaches that you can get away with things that you question morally on a forum. If your conscience was not 100% clear about this, you wouldn't be asking on a forum and or still talking about it. There are many things that are wrong that are not described in the Bible. Bread crumbs in Scripture give us the clue that being a nude model does not exactly line up with loving God and loving your neighbor (Which is of the two greatest commandments). For God covered man with clothes for a reason after the fall. Also, potentially making somebody to stumble by your nakedness (even in a professional setting) is not loving towards your neighbor. Sure, it may be rare. But it can happen. See, the difference between a person lusting after another with clothes on versus (vs.) lusting after them without clothes on, is that being nude is a means to excite people. It's why men go to strip clubs. It's why men like to see their wife without clothes on when they make love. It's why women go to strip clubs. Yes, they do exist. Nakedness is tied to sexuality. You cannot pick up a magazine of naked people like Playboy and not think about the wrong thing. People that care about other people more than their own needs will decide to play it safe so as to not to hurt them. There is a verse that says I can do all things thru Christ which strengthens me. Can you honestly say that this something that Christ would want to work thru you? I sincerely don't think so.
...
The more answers I seem to be getting the more it clearly demonstrates to me that this is in no way sinful according to the bible and only viewed as sin by self righteousness.
Modern western cultures have not taken a biblical view of public nudity, that's for sure. I suppose this is to be expected in cultures saturated by porn and promiscuity as so many are today. And Christians arguing for such stuff is a testament to just how far from biblical Christianity believers have drifted, carried along by the ever-darkening currents of secular society.
Drawing nudes smacks of the evil of Romans 1:25 in a way drawing a horse, or a boat, or a landscape never could. The fundamental cause of human sin is a disposition toward Self-centeredness, toward pride and rebellion against God manifested in a preoccupation with the human rather than the divine. This rebellious preoccupation seems particularly evident to me in the drawing of the nude human form. No where in Scripture is there even a hint that looking on the nude form of another person who is not one's spouse is an appropriate (and definitely not recommended) act. We are urged in the Bible to look away from earthly, carnal things, and look instead upon Christ and consider things eternal and spiritual (He. 12:1, 2; Col. 3:1-3) Yes, yes, I know we may have to get naked for a doctor, but apart from doing so out of medical necessity there is no morally-acceptable reason offered in Scripture to be publicly nude outside of your own home.
What's more, at least for men, the nude female form is sexually arousing, even if the arousal is mild and easily stifled. Certainly, having to stare very carefully at another person's body and take in every curve, and crease, and shade is not conducive to pure thinking.
I am a pretty skilled artist (nwaikikai.deviantart.com) and know very well what is involved in creating detailed, true-to-life art. I have considered working from nudes in order to better render the human form but as a Christian I just cannot see that doing so would be honoring to my Heavenly Father and helpful in becoming more like Christ - both of which things are far, far, far more important than being able to draw a naked person.
Selah.
It seems to me my questions have been ignored time and time again. Why was Isaiah commanded to preach naked for three years? God would lot command someone to sin. Answer this...It seems pretty evident to me that you're simply seeing what you want to see in the responses you're getting.
Selah.
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