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Arizona Senate Intends to Hand-Count 2.1M Maricopa County 2020 Ballots; Not Clear How

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by essentialsaltes, Mar 19, 2021.

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  1. Pommer

    Pommer Autodidact polymath

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    So...tell us, what happened when the Republican observers weren’t in the room?
     
  2. NxNW

    NxNW Well-Known Member

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    Trump remained in the lead the entire time, that's what!
     
  3. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, and why such effort to stop them from observing? It would be nice to get a copy of that pamphlet that was seen in Michigan about how to keep GOP observers away. The policy of observers in Michigan not signing out this election was something that at first went right by me. The audits might give us some answers.
     
  4. Pommer

    Pommer Autodidact polymath

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    So...nothing that we know of, more speculation.
    It’s nice that you have this hobby.
     
  5. lasthero

    lasthero Newbie

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    Don't you find it a little bit odd that, for all the talk about this pamphlet, no such pamphlet has ever been produced? That, despite all the talk about observers being assaulted, there are no actual recording or records to support that happening, even though many of the polling places actually have surveillance? That there are no court cases, no police reports, nothing to say such things actually happened, despite them allegedly happening all over the country?

    Doesn't that seem just a little weird to you?
     
  6. NxNW

    NxNW Well-Known Member

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    What efforts?
     
  7. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    Election night I was following the swing states and later focused on Michigan and also on Georgia. There was no reason to interfere with observers anywhere where there was no doubt as to who would win. There were court cases filed but no evidentiary hearings were allowed in regard to the treatment of observers. In Michigan what should have happened is that the court would allow video and hopefully audio to be brought in that would either support or refute the sworn affidavits. If I were a Democrat election official and any false accusations were made I would certainly push for the release of such videos to the press. Transparency is the key to determining the truth. Even where they were told not to sign out for this election a video would tell whether there were really Republican observers present at all times. I support jail time for anyone who filed a false affidavit. Since no such Michigan videos have been produced after all of these months a proper investigation/audit is warranted. This is why I am pleased that the Arizona audit has cameras going in real time so anyone with access to the Internet can observe.
     
  8. SimplyMe

    SimplyMe Senior Veteran

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    Of course not, because this alleged "mistreatment" had nothing to do with if the election was fair or not. There were always plenty of Republican observers in the room (the one possible exception being in Atlanta, Georgia) and even if they were "mistreated" it is not evidence that the election was not fair.

    If these observers felt they were mistreated then they should have filed suit against the worker they felt mistreated them, even filing a police report against that worker. For some reason, none of these observers who claimed to be mistreated ever filed complaints against the worker; instead they merely complained about some worker, from what I saw, never saying who the worker was, in an affidavit claiming it proved some type of "election fraud" -- which you have also agreed is not evidence that any fraud occurred.

    You have this backwards. The videos were livestreamed, they are already public, so there is nothing to "release." To substantiate their claims, they should be posting the video of what happened.

    Again, the Michigan counting was livestreamed, the video is out there and available. This excuse of "transparency" is just that, an excuse that has no basis in fact. Yes, in the livestream you could not see the individual ballots, but you could see the large number of observers in the room and how they were treated.
     
  9. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    You're simply repeating propaganda, you don't know there were always Republican observers present except for Atlanta. If you have access to video from Cobo in Detroit and you can identify observers and prove Republican observers were always present and always able to observe each counter from within ten feet that would be a game changer. We can get some lip readers too. If witnesses testified falsely they should go to jail. Democrats and Republicans should be able to get together on this. Let's all work together and end all controversy.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2021
  10. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    .
     
  11. SimplyMe

    SimplyMe Senior Veteran

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    So saying you can check the video is propaganda, but not the "evidence" you claim that, despite your propaganda, was actually examined in many courts and found it wasn't even strong enough to get to the evidentiary phase of trial. It was then appealed, and the appeals courts, including judges nominated by Pres. Trump, agreed with the lower court judges ruling (that the complaint did not offer enough probable cause to warrant a trial).

    Again, if they were assaulted, why did they not fill out police reports? You ignore that there were maybe 1,000 Republicans trying to be observers in Michigan, which makes it obvious why so many were denied entry and many did not understand about sign in sheets (or where to find it), after the Republican Party realized they didn't have enough observers there and posted on social media for Republicans to come to work as observers (Republicans that had no training at all, which led to large numbers of affidavits that alleged that the procedure proscribed by law was "fraudulent").

    I'm sorry, you post nothing but propaganda here, most of which we've refuted multiple times.
     
  12. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    Ah shucks. I was anticipating that visit to exercise my 2nd Amendment rights to defend my vote :)
     
  13. whatbogsends

    whatbogsends Senior Veteran

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    You don't understand. They kept changing their story. First, it was everything was wet. Then, it was water had caused the damage. Then, it was H20. I even heard from another news source that it was agua. They couldn't keep their stories straight.
     
  14. NxNW

    NxNW Well-Known Member

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    Then they revealed it was really Dihydrogen Monoxide, a substance found in cancerous tumors and polluted rivers! So clearly there was an effort made to poison the Republican observers.
     
  15. FreeinChrist

    FreeinChrist CF Advisory team Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    It is time to stop the Big Lie.

    PolitiFact - Trump’s wrong claim that election observers were barred in Pennsylvania, Michigan

    President Donald Trump wrongly claimed that Republican election observers have been barred from watching ballot counts in Pennsylvania and Michigan, repeating a falsehood that has been contradicted by his own campaign lawyers in court hearings and lawsuits.....

    Some confusion over the access afforded to election observers in Detroit can be traced to a chaotic event on Nov. 4., when the convention hall used for canvassing reached the state’s legal limit for election observers and officials had to stop additional observers from entering.

    Michigan allows election observers called challengers appointed by political parties and interest groups, as well as poll watchers, to observe the election process.

    Over 100 Republican challengers remained inside throughout the counting, PolitiFact reported.

    And there was already a careful handcount of the ballots

    Michigan election audit: Hand recount matches machine recount within 1%

    A statewide election audit confirmed that Michigan’s vote-counting machines are accurate, according to Michigan Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson.

    That confirms that President Joe Biden won the state’s Nov. 3, 2020 presidential election.

    Hundreds of Republican, Democratic and nonpartisan municipal and county clerks from more than 1,300 local jurisdictions participated in the audit. They hand counted more than 18,000 ballots that were randomly selected throughout the state.

    And Republican observers got to monitor the absentee ballot counting:

    Republican challengers weren't unfairly barred from Detroit vote count

    The claim: Republican election challengers were unfairly barred from observing absentee ballot processing and counting in Detroit
    On Nov. 4, chaos erupted at Detroit’s TCF Center, the convention hall where election workers processed and counted the city’s absentee ballots, as dozens of partisan poll monitors clamored to get into the counting area. They banged on the doors and windows, demanding that election workers stop the count until they could enter.

    Some Facebook posts aired claims that Republican challengers were improperly barred from observing the process. One post claimed, “The Democrats are locking us out and not letting us in to supervise the ballot counting at the TCF Center in downtown Detroit!”....


    More than 100 Republican challengers remained inside the room where absentee ballots were being counted.
    The problem was that many would be observers crowded into the counting room and caused chaos.

    In a statement shared Wednesday, Lawrence Garcia, Detroit’s lead attorney, explained what happened next. “We were well over the 134 maximum. In the haste of doing business, nobody noticed that until it was over 200 for each party, and at that point, we said, we better stop admitting people until some people leave, and we’re under the 134 number.”
    The extra Republican observers who had to leave whined about being mistreated while the Democratic observers did not. I wonder if the extra Republican observers got belligerent?
     
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  16. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    The truth is that an experienced Republican observer stated that they told her that there was no sign out sheet for this election, as there had been in previous elections.
    I never said video was propaganda, to the contrary, I have promoted video recording of the election process.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2021
  17. FreeinChrist

    FreeinChrist CF Advisory team Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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  18. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    And you believe her because...?
     
  19. Belk

    Belk Senior Member Supporter

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  20. Goonie

    Goonie Not so Mystic Mog. Supporter

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    Greetings Mr Poe
     
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