PassthePeace1
CARO CARDO SALUTIS
So would you pass out JW bibles, so that the lost might be saved?
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There is no reason to Keep Gods word from any eyes. For it is in the scripture that truth is revealed. Many have become saved by just reading Scripture.. To deny anyone Gods written word is indeed denying them access to God. For it is in Scripture that men and women can come to know the Living one and only True God.
I have NO clue what any of those are..don't care to know. All I DO know is MOST of the stuff in Revelation hasn't happened yet...some has started...and I HOPE to God when it really does start to happen..I am out of here.Actually that is not completely true. I suppose it would depend on whether you were an amillenialist, premillenialist, or postmillenialist.
Has nothing to do with what I posted.[/b][/i]
Really, would you hand out JW and Mormon bibles?
It makes no difference.Latin was not a "dead language" at that time, and would have certianly been understandable, for few people that were literate.
Great idea.But anywho...this is really getting off topic, open a thread in GT, if you want to discuss it in more detail.
Peace be with you....Pam
Has nothing to do with what I posted.
That ban was for OT and NT, not translations
specifically.
It makes no difference.
There is no valid reason ever to ban the
reading of the Word of God.
Great idea.
This is one subject that will bring out
some passion in me, and I don't
want it directed at you Pam.
Blessings
sunlover
Thank you.in that I have heard God & obeyed.
I am talking more on the cc not allowing the scriptures to be read by thier own people in thier own language..condemning those who had one and calling the heretics because the truth revealed in the scriptures did line up with what the RCC wanted them to say. Bringing many to question what they were being taught..So would you pass out JW bibles, so that the lost might be saved?
Pass The Peace, you're "Would you pass out JW translations" is wildly amiss.
Instead of outlawing ownership, or passing out Albigensian translations(a more apt comparison), the council could have passed out copies of their OWN translations.
Had their intent been purely to prevent heresy & promote truth, that option would've been obvious.
Instead, they chose to suppress ALL of it & reinforce their monopoly.
Mary didn't have a copy of the New Testament, either. Could we say we're more blessed than her in that respect?
Ahh, but she had The WORD!By that standard, she's more blessed than us in that respect!
for posting this:
Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; unless anyone from motive of devotion should wish to have the Psalter or the Breviary for divine offices or the hours of the blessed Virgin; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.
I had never actualy seen it. It is a good example of good intentions being misused.
Pass The Peace, you're "Would you pass out JW translations" is wildly amiss.
Instead of outlawing ownership, or passing out Albigensian translations(a more apt comparison), the council could have passed out copies of their OWN translations.
Had their intent been purely to prevent heresy & promote truth, that option would've been obvious.
Instead, they chose to suppress ALL of it & reinforce their monopoly.
I am talking more on the cc not allowing the scriptures to be read by thier own people in thier own language..condemning those who had one and calling the heretics because the truth revealed in the scriptures did line up with what the RCC wanted them to say. Bringing many to question what they were being taught..
"Not Convenient"?
Would've been great fun, and a marvelous tradition for pios priests, monks & nuns to teach the local peasant children to read & write using scripture?
Each student, child & adult alike, could write 2 or three words themselves, every Sunday, and eventualy have their VERY OWN COPY in their own hand. Think how far & fast the Gospel would've spread. Think of all the sin & pain that could've been avoided by better knowlege of scripture... ah, now I'm tempted to wax grandiose, LOL.
Mary didn't have a copy of the New Testament, either. Could we say we're more blessed than her in that respect?
Many of the reformers that you call them as they printed and read the bible for themselves and in thier own language is when all of this all started.. They started to see Gods truth revealed to them.. They went to the Church. The asked questions.. They got rebuffed.. Many of them raised with the teachings of the church.. Look at the crusades and what happened to some of those that went out from the CC.. Wycliff,being just one.. I have read the History just lately with some of this.. Christ did not go out and hunt heretics. Christ did not burn people at the stake for preaching in opposition of Him.. But yet the cc and the Pope declared war on these people.. They burned bibles and people.. Now from what I understand the Pope is to be the vicar of Christ. Now why on earth would this person that is to be a representative of Christ do such things.. Jesus tells us that we will know His true followers by their fruit.. Jesus never once even reviled back when He was beaten and scourged.. This is one of my main concerns.. THE FRUIT.. Look at the fruit..You act as though that day and age was the same as this one. The education of the people was on a completely different level, to the point where the vast majority of the population couldn't have read the Scriptures anyway.
So you want to go embrace heresy? Oh wait no, your saying that it may not even have been heresy at all, that it just didn't line up with what the Catholic Church taught. It is because of things like this ban that you even have a chance to sit and try to bash the Catholic Church. People love to sit and talk about the Holy Spirit is who preserved the faith, and they are right. The Holy Spirit preserved the faith through the Apostolic Catholic Church. To try and say that the Roman Catholic Church suddenly was thrown by God out to the wolves at the time of the "Reformation", is just silly. That would be like Jesus casting out the 12 when they got something wrong. It's all built on the back of humanity, which has its weaknesses. Don't demean God to try and back up your "ideas".
are those darned Albegensians & Catharists!
Despite the low-tech, high labor, low literacy environment, how did THEY do it enough for Rome to notice? And without the wealth and power to command of all the Papal States we now know as Italy?
Should we stop production of books until everyone knows how to read?
How they gonna start without somethin' good in their hands?
That is a pretty tight circle of reasoning, unless you mean things like the ban are indeed invitations for rebuke.
To suggest a ban on the proliferation of scripture copies including the Vulgate has bestowed the freedom of speech we enjoy in criticising it, is as illogical as I've seen in awhile.
Pope Innocent III stated in 1199:In 1229, they did not have the modern technology, we have today...life was short and hard. Most parents would have considered the time learning how to read, a waste of time....considering there where more important things to be doing...like growing enough to eat, plus save for the winter.
My grandfather's family were sharecroppers, and both he and his younger brother had to drop out of school, at the 6th grade...because they were of age to work in the fields. He could barely read and write....education wasn't a top priorty in 1020s rural Texas.
Which begs the question, could she have read it if she had one?
Pope Innocent III stated in 1199:... to be reproved are those who translate into French the Gospels, the letters of Paul, the psalter, etc. They are moved by a certain love of Scripture in order to explain them clandestinely and to preach them to one another. The mysteries of the faith are not to explained rashly to anyone. Usually in fact, they cannot be understood by everyone but only by those who are qualified to understand them with informed intelligence. The depth of the divine Scriptures is such that not only the illiterate and uninitiated have difficulty understanding them, but also the educated and the gifted (Denzinger-Schönmetzer, Enchiridion Symbolorum 770-771) He is saying here even the educated and the gifted cannot understand
Many of the reformers that you call them as they printed and read the bible for themselves and in thier own language is when all of this all started.. They started to see Gods truth revealed to them.. They went to the Church. The asked questions.. They got rebuffed.. Many of them raised with the teachings of the church..
Look at the crusades and what happened to some of those that went out from the CC.. Wycliff,being just one.. I have read the History just lately with some of this.. Christ did not go out and hunt heretics. Christ did not burn people at the stake for preaching in opposition of Him.. But yet the cc and the Pope declared war on these people.. They burned bibles and people.. Now from what I understand the Pope is to be the vicar of Christ. Now why on earth would this person that is to be a representative of Christ do such things.. Jesus tells us that we will know His true followers by their fruit.. Jesus never once even reviled back when He was beaten and scourged.. This is one of my main concerns.. THE FRUIT.. Look at the fruit..
http://forum.cygnus-study.com/archive/index.php/t-6773.htmlDo you have a link, to where you got this...so the document can be viewed in it's full context.
If I remember correctly, Pope Innocent was dealing with the Albigensus and their heresies, so the quote from which this document was taken, might be dealing with the issues with the Albigensus.
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