Are You as Blessed as Mary?

[PassthePeace1]

LOL, no they aren't allowed...read other thread....

By your post, are you meaning to imply...that Catholics aren't allowed to read the bible? If so, that is simply not true, we are encourged to read the bible, and the scriptures are proclaim daily, in Mass and the Divine Office.

Peace be with you...Pam

 

[HisBelovedMelody]

By your post, are you meaning to imply...that Catholics aren't allowed to read the bible? If so, that is simply not true, we are encourged to read the bible, and the scriptures are proclaim daily, in Mass and the Divine Office.

Peace be with you...Pam

from what I have read, only ones in the parish...not your own...that is SO ridiculous. I am sorry, but I don't get that...that is so archaic..

 

[PassthePeace1]

from what I have read, only ones in the parish...not your own...that is SO ridiculous. I am sorry, but I don't get that...that is so archaic..

When we come into(convert) the Church, we are presented the bible...which we kiss, as a sign of reverance.

The Divine Office , which we are encourge to participate in at home, is mostly scripture.

Many of the anicent devotions of the Church, such as Lectio Divina, are based on meditating on scripture.

Lectio Divina - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Back before the masses, could read...the Church, illustrated, scripture thru different medias...art, stain glass windows, music, and statues.

Probably what you are referring to, is during a transitory time in Church history, as a result from a backlash, from the Protestant Reformation, and the confusion, that followed....people were discouraged, which differs from forbidden to read scripture. However, taking the Church's 2000 year history, this is but a fleeting moment, in time.

 

[Rick Otto]

in that I have heard God & obeyed.

 

[HisBelovedMelody]

When we come into(convert) the Church, we are presented the bible...which we kiss, as a sign of reverance.

The Divine Office , which we are encourge to participate in at home, is mostly scripture.

Many of the anicent devotions of the Church, such as Lectio Divina, are based on meditating on scripture.

Lectio Divina - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Back before the masses, could read...the Church, illustrated, scripture thru different medias...art, stain glass windows, music, and statues.

Probably what you are referring to, is during a transitory time in Church history, as a result from a backlash, from the Protestant Reformation, and the confusion, that followed....people were discouraged, which differs from forbidden to read scripture. However, taking the Church's 2000 year history, this is but a fleeting moment, in time.

so, you are saying..trying to clarify this in my head...You don't have a copy of your own Bible that you can pick up and read anytime you want??

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

A couple of us were discussing this,
thought I would ask.

Not even close.

How many combat kills are associated with Mary? None I think.

Forgive me...

 

[PassthePeace1]

so, you are saying..trying to clarify this in my head...You don't have a copy of your own Bible that you can pick up and read anytime you want??

No, that is not what I am trying to say at all...lol...just the opposite, and that scripture is very important, in the daily devotions of a Catholic.

I was giving a copy of the bible, when I came into the Church, plus I have several copies of different translations.

 

[PassthePeace1]

from what I have read, only ones in the parish...not your own...that is SO ridiculous. I am sorry, but I don't get that...that is so archaic..

131 "And such is the force and power of the Word of God that it can serve the Church as her support and vigour, and the children of the Church as strength for their faith, food for the soul, and a pure and lasting fount of spiritual life."[109] Hence "access to Sacred Scripture ought to be open wide to the Christian faithful."[110]

133 The Church "forcefully and specifically exhorts all the Christian faithful... to learn the surpassing knowledge of Jesus Christ, by frequent reading of the divine Scriptures. Ignorance of the Scriptures is ignorance of Christ.[112]

CATECHISM OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH

Click on the link, on what the Church teaches about scripture.

 

[StTherese]

so, you are saying..trying to clarify this in my head...You don't have a copy of your own Bible that you can pick up and read anytime you want??

Yes we can read the Bible anytime we want. I am not sure why you would think we would be forbidden from reading the Bible...maybe because personal interpretation is discouraged???

 

[StTherese]

HOW do you figure that is Mary? Revelation hasn't happened yet...it is IN the future....I don't get that one.

Actually that is not completely true. I suppose it would depend on whether you were an amillenialist, premillenialist, or postmillenialist.

 

[sunlover1]

Yes we can read the Bible anytime we want. I am not sure why you would think we would be forbidden from reading the Bible...maybe because personal interpretation is discouraged???

I think she was referring to this:

COUNCIL OF TOULOUSE - 1229 A.D.
The Council of Toulouse, which met in November of 1229, about the time of the crusade against the Albigensians, set up a special ecclesiastical tribunal, or court, known as the Inquisition (Lat. inquisitio, an inquiry), to search out and try heretics. Twenty of the forty-five articles decreed by the Council dealt with heretics and heresy. It ruled in part:

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; unless anyone from motive of devotion should wish to have the Psalter or the Breviary for divine offices or the hours of the blessed Virgin; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.​

 

[PassthePeace1]

SACRED SCRIPTURE IN THE LIFE OF THE CHURCH
21. The Church has always venerated the divine Scriptures just as she venerates the body of the Lord, since, especially in the sacred liturgy, she unceasingly receives and offers to the faithful the bread of life from the table both of God's word and of Christ's body. She has always maintained them, and continues to do so, together with sacred tradition, as the supreme rule of faith, since, as inspired by God and committed once and for all to writing, they impart the word of God Himself without change, and make the voice of the Holy Spirit resound in the words of the prophets and Apostles. Therefore, like the Christian religion itself, all the preaching of the Church must be nourished and regulated by Sacred Scripture. For in the sacred books, the Father who is in heaven meets His children with great love and speaks with them; and the force and power in the word of God is so great that it stands as the support and energy of the Church, the strength of faith for her sons, the food of the soul, the pure and everlasting source of spiritual life. Consequently these words are perfectly applicable to Sacred Scripture: "For the word of God is living and active" (Heb. 4:12) and "it has power to build you up and give you your heritage among all those who are sanctified" (Acts 20:32; see 1 Thess. 2:13).


22. Easy access to Sacred Scripture should be provided for all the Christian faithful. That is why the Church from the very beginning accepted as her own that very ancient Greek translation; of the Old Testament which is called the septuagint; and she has always given a place of honor to other Eastern translations and Latin ones especially the Latin translation known as the vulgate. But since the word of God should be accessible at all times, the Church by her authority and with maternal concern sees to it that suitable and correct translations are made into different languages, especially from the original texts of the sacred books. And should the opportunity arise and the Church authorities approve, if these translations are produced in cooperation with the separated brethren as well, all Christians will be able to use them.


23. The bride of the incarnate Word, the Church taught by the Holy Spirit, is concerned to move ahead toward a deeper understanding of the Sacred Scriptures so that she may increasingly feed her sons with the divine words. Therefore, she also encourages the study of the holy Fathers of both East and West and of sacred liturgies. Catholic exegetes then and other students of sacred theology, working diligently together and using appropriate means, should devote their energies, under the watchful care of the sacred teaching office of the Church, to an exploration and exposition of the divine writings. This should be so done that as many ministers of the divine word as possible will be able effectively to provide the nourishment of the Scriptures for the people of God, to enlighten their minds, strengthen their wills, and set men's hearts on fire with the love of God. (1) The sacred synod encourages the sons of the Church and Biblical scholars to continue energetically, following the mind of the Church, with the work they have so well begun, with a constant renewal of vigor. (2)

DOGMATIC CONSTITUTION ON DIVINE REVELATION "DEI VERBUM"

 

[UberLutheran]

In one sense, yes -- because God has an interesting habit of taking the most ordinary and unremarkable people (such as Mary) and doing the most extraordinary things through them;

and in another sense, no -- of all the people who knew Jesus, she was the only one who was there -- and stood by Him -- during His birth, His ministry, His death, and His resurrection. (Remember: it was Mary, the mother of Jesus, and Mary Magdalene who were first at the empty tomb.) Most of us are not capable of that kind of devotion.

 

[StTherese]

I think she was referring to this:

COUNCIL OF TOULOUSE - 1229 A.D.
The Council of Toulouse, which met in November of 1229, about the time of the crusade against the Albigensians, set up a special ecclesiastical tribunal, or court, known as the Inquisition (Lat. inquisitio, an inquiry), to search out and try heretics. Twenty of the forty-five articles decreed by the Council dealt with heretics and heresy. It ruled in part:

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; unless anyone from motive of devotion should wish to have the Psalter or the Breviary for divine offices or the hours of the blessed Virgin; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.​

....Toulouse, France, where a council was held in 1229. And, yes, that council dealt with the Bible. It was organized in reaction to the Albigensian or Catharist heresy, which held that there are two gods and that marriage is evil because all matter (and thus physical flesh) is evil. From this the heretics concluded that fornication could be no sin, and they even encouraged suicide among their members. In order to promulgate their sect, the Albigensians published an inaccurate translation of the Bible in the vernacular language (rather like the Jehovah’s Witnesses of today publishing their severely flawed New World Translation of the Bible, which has been deliberately mistranslated to support the sect’s claims). Had it been an accurate translation, the Church would not have been concerned. Vernacular versions had been appearing for centuries. But what came from the hands of the Albigensians was an adulterated Bible. The bishops at Toulouse forbade the reading of it because it was inaccurate. In this they were caring for their flocks, just as a Protestant minister of today might tell his flock not to read the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ New World Translation.

http://www.catholic.com/library/Catholic_Inventions.asp

 

[sunlover1]

22. Easy access to Sacred Scripture should be provided for all the Christian faithful.

Amen

 

[PassthePeace1]

I think she was referring to this:

COUNCIL OF TOULOUSE - 1229 A.D.
The Council of Toulouse, which met in November of 1229, about the time of the crusade against the Albigensians, set up a special ecclesiastical tribunal, or court, known as the Inquisition (Lat. inquisitio, an inquiry), to search out and try heretics. Twenty of the forty-five articles decreed by the Council dealt with heretics and heresy. It ruled in part:

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; unless anyone from motive of devotion should wish to have the Psalter or the Breviary for divine offices or the hours of the blessed Virgin; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.​

The Council of Toulouse was a local council, that dealt with an horrible heresy that had taken root in that region, and had no Church wide authority.

 

[sunlover1]

The Council of Toulouse was a local council, that dealt with an horrible heresy that had taken root in that region, and had no Church wide authority.

There is no valid reason for trying to stop
the Word of God reaching mens eyes or ears.

Ever!

Psalm 138:2
for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

Historically, this has been a problem, and
of course it was due to heresy.

Like that arrogant heretic Wycliff who wanted
to translate God's Word from one
language to another that all could read
it.
How rude.

*walks away scratching her head

 

[StTherese]

There is no valid reason for trying to stop
the Word of God reaching mens eyes or ears.

Ever!

Psalm 138:2
for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

Historically, this has been a problem, and
of course it was due to heresy.

Like that arrogant heretic Wycliff who wanted
to translate God's Word from one
language to another that all could read
it.
How rude.

*walks away scratching her head

There is when people mistranslate the word of God and teach false doctrines as a result!!! That Council was held as a result of an innaccurate translation being taught to others. Why would you not be prohibited from learning or teaching false beliefs????

 

[IamAdopted]

There is when people mistranslate the word of God and teach false doctrines as a result!!! That Council was held as a result of an innaccurate translation being taught to others. Why would you not be prohibited from learning or teaching false beliefs????

There is no reason to Keep Gods word from any eyes. For it is in the scripture that truth is revealed. Many have become saved by just reading Scripture.. To deny anyone Gods written word is indeed denying them access to God. For it is in Scripture that men and women can come to know the Living one and only True God.

 

[PassthePeace1]

There is no valid reason for trying to stop
the Word of God reaching mens eyes or ears.

Agree, and that is not what the Council of Toulouse, was trying to do...it was trying to stop, heresies in that Province, and the use of faulty translations, that was full of errors. The ban lasted only during the time of the heresies.

Ever!

Really, would you hand out JW and Mormon bibles?

Psalm 138:2
for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

Historically, this has been a problem, and
of course it was due to heresy.

Like that arrogant heretic Wycliff who wanted
to translate God's Word from one
language to another that all could read
it.
How rude.

*walks away scratching her head

His unauthorized translation of the bible, was not the only problem....what he was teaching was also in question.

Latin was not a "dead language" at that time, and would have certianly been understandable, for few people that were literate.


But anywho...this is really getting off topic, open a thread in GT, if you want to discuss it in more detail.

Peace be with you....Pam