Are we the product of poor design?

[Archivist]

True. They look like little old men, and then look like it again when they get old (sometimes they also wear diapers again).

A young mother once told Winston Churchill that her baby looked like him. Churchill replied “madam, all babies look like me.”

 

[SigurdReginson]

Hmmm... What's the point of having an appendix? What about having a non-useable third eyelid? The Palmaris Longus muscle that 1/8th of people don't even have anymore. Darwin's tubercle (mine's actually quite pronounced). The tail bone. Goosebumps and the palmer grasp reflex in babies don't make any sense in the modern human context, but as vestigial evolutionary remnants, they make a lot more sense it seems (considering other animals have much more developed versions of these features).

How are these things that seem like left over evolutionary traits just the way god made us? What's the point? God just added these things for no reason? Some of them can even be fatal (such as apendicitis), and would be better if they had never even been included in the first place.

It just don't make sense to me.

 

[Hans Blaster]

The design of our teeth (and entire digestive system) reveals that we should chew our food thoroughly before swallowing. Problem solved. God's design allows for some misuse, usually in the youthful. Most of our problems stem from breaking obvious rules. Thoroughly chewing our food is arguably the most important thing we can do on a daily basis.

Frankly the state of our teeth and digestive system indicate that we have been eating cooked foods for hundreds of thousands of years. Our cutting teeth aren't particularly good at tearing and our grinding teeth aren't particularly good at grinding. Our digestive systems are smaller than those of similarly sized animals, including other giant apes. We are the ape that cooks.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Frankly the state of our teeth and digestive system indicate that we have been eating cooked foods for hundreds of thousands of years. Our cutting teeth aren't particularly good at tearing and our grinding teeth aren't particularly good at grinding. Our digestive systems are smaller than those of similarly sized animals, including other giant apes. We are the ape that cooks.

Our teeth are perfectly suited for their intended purpose.
Cooking foods is basic to our health and social well being (smell that roast beef?).

 

[Hans Blaster]

Our teeth are perfectly suited for their intended purpose.
Cooking foods is basic to our health and social well being (smell that roast beef?).

Yes, because our ancestors have been eating cooked foods for half a million years.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I don't think we've been around that long.

But if evolution were true, we were around for much longer than that. It would explain why we are so reliant on cooked foods with it having such a pronounced usage in our distant history.

Control of fire by early humans - Wikipedia

This is geology and archeology, btw. Not biology. They all interconnect, though, and they all confirm each other through their evidence. They all tell a corroborating story. If it's all bunk, how does it fit together so perfectly?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

But if evolution were true, we were around for much longer than that. It would explain why we are so reliant on cooked foods with it having such a pronounced usage in our distant history.

Control of fire by early humans - Wikipedia

This is geology and archeology, btw. Not biology. They all interconnect, though, and they all confirm each other through their evidence. They all tell a corroborating story. If it's all bunk, how does it fit together so perfectly?

I took that comment down. I believe there were 'humanlike' creatures around that may indeed have used fire to cook. I wouldn't call them homo sapiens however.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I took that comment down. I believe there were 'humanlike' creatures around that may indeed have used fire to cook. I wouldn't call them homo sapiens however.

Hmmm... What are these creatures? Why do you believe they existed, as opposed to humans and their ancestors? Are they spoken of in the bible?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Hmmm... What are these creatures? Why do you believe they existed, as opposed to humans and their ancestors? Are they spoken of in the bible?

If their remains exist they must have existed. The bible is mostly silent on history prior to Genesis 1, although there are clues.

 

[NBB]

For 1 'defect' evolutionist find there are 1000 design 'virtues' things that are made just fine and well.
Weird way to think saying we are badly designed.

Also some of them maybe are not defects in design at all and there could be a reason.

 

[pitabread]

Also some of them maybe are not defects in design at all and there could be a reason.

Explain the design of the male testes then.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Explain the design of the male testes then.

It was a conspiracy with the athletic supporter and cup manufacturing industry.

 

[SigurdReginson]

For 1 'defect' evolutionist find there are 1000 design 'virtues' things that are made just fine and well.
Weird way to think saying we are badly designed.

Also some of them maybe are not defects in design at all and there could be a reason.

Explain the design of the male testes then.

Yes, and can you tell us the reason behind a defunct third eyelid?

 

[NBB]

Frankly the state of our teeth and digestive system indicate that we have been eating cooked foods for hundreds of thousands of years. Our cutting teeth aren't particularly good at tearing and our grinding teeth aren't particularly good at grinding. Our digestive systems are smaller than those of similarly sized animals, including other giant apes. We are the ape that cooks.

Your comment is based on the lie, that 'needing something' is going to produce a design becaue of adaptation, i agree there is some adaptation what i don't believe, lizards falliing of trees or something like they say it happened 'produced' wings, biggest lie ever.

 

[NBB]

Yes, and can you tell us the reason behind a defunct third eyelid?

And you don't see the other design 'virtues' all over the place? you know what bad design is? the body works well and is a marvel.

 

[SigurdReginson]

And you don't see the other design 'virtues' all over the place? you know what bad design is? the body works well and is a marvel.

Imagine for me that there is a mountain. It is an absolutely majestic, and awe inspiring mountain, like something you would see in Zion Canyon.

Now, imagine that I were to tell you that this mountain isn't natural, but is instead made by aliens.

Well, we don't really have anything made by aliens we can compare it to, but we have many natural mountains we can look at and see how it stacks up.

Well, it has plenty of signs of water and wind erosion. It's shape also looks very consistent when compared to other mountains next to it. It also is made of the same geographically consistent rock that surrounding mountains are made of. Now, I tell you that the aliens made this mountain this way to look like it's natural, but it's really artificial.

Does that mountain seem to you like it's made by aliens, or a product of nature?

See, when we look at aspects of the human form that aren't efficient or even all that useful, the point isn't in to say it's bad. The point is the find out why. Is it because we were just created that way, or is it because at one point in our past, we needed them, and they were useful then? That is the core of evolution, and how creatures change over time according to the way they have to interract with their environment.

Sure, being able to rotate our ears via darwin's tubercle would be cool! A lot of primates can do that, but we can't, even though we have that same structure on our body. Why should we have that same structure if we can't use it? What's the purpose?

Is it because we were made that way, or is it because at one time in our distant past, we could use it?

 

[Hans Blaster]

Your comment is based on the lie, that 'needing something' is going to produce a design becaue of adaptation, i agree there is some adaptation what i don't believe, lizards falliing of trees or something like they say it happened 'produced' wings, biggest lie ever.

1. Your non-sequiter about lizard wings is irrelevant.

2. My comment is not based on "a lie" or on "needing something".

3. If you understood evolution better, your comments wouldn't be so wrong.

4. I was writing about variations of early modern humans from prior hominids, that we have a less energetically expensive digestive system (with less bowels) and that our teeth aren't particularly adapted to chewing uncooked food. This is clearly a byproduct of a half million years of cooking fires and cooked food. We use external energy (cooking fires or replacements) to do some of the work of digestion and chewing for us. This made it advantageous for those of our ancestors that had digestive systems that were "weaker" and used less energy over those who had more "strong" digestive systems that took more food energy to operate. Ergo, a shift in the digestive systems of our ancestors compared to other great apes.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

To an earlier point, if we don't use our present brain capacity how can one say it isn't perfect considering what it is intended for?

You're not alluding to that urban legend belief that "humans only use 10% of their brains" are you? That is a blatant misunderstanding of things. We use as much of a our brain as it can handle, we would be having seizures if we tried to use more of our brain at any given time.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

You're not alluding to that urban legend belief that "humans only use 10% of their brains" are you? That is a blatant misunderstanding of things. We use as much of a our brain as it can handle, we would be having seizures if we tried to use more of our brain at any given time.

I guess my point was really about how effectively we use our brains. Our brains can also store much more knowledge than they do.