Are there limits to what healing we can receive?

[mourningdove~]

But not trusting God to keep His word is, by definition, not trusting God.

It is very apparent, from your comment, that you don't understand what I've shared with ByTheSpirit.
But since I shared it with ByTheSpirit, it is not important that you do.

This is not your thread or mine, you are taking it off topic (again),
and I don't choose to do that. Not fair to the OP. So, have a nice nite!

 

[Guojing]

Trying to find a topic that we can amicably disagree on, hopefully this is it. Scripture seems to support and promote that God heals us from all sickness and conditions.

Psalm 103:3 He who forgives all your iniquities and heals all your diseases,

Matthew 4:23 Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

But most all of us have experienced times when we ask for and seek healing and it does not come. Now, a caveat to this discussion is I'm asking you not to use "It's God's Will" as a response to this. Is there scriptural support for the idea that we cannot be healed of some conditions?

Like, are there limits to what we can and cannot be healed of?

What is our response to people who genuinely ask for healing but do not receive it?

Psalms 103 is a prophecy of life for Israel under their promised kingdom on Earth, during the millennial reign of Christ.

Salvation for them is tied to the promised kingdom of God on Earth, is something they expect in the future (Hebrews 8:8-12, Acts 3:19-21, 1 Peter 1:9).

So Psalms 103, especially the lovely verses from 1-5, specifically tells you what they expect to receive when that kingdom begins (vs 19), which in vs 3, includes both forgiveness of their sins, and physical healing from their diseases.

It is inline with Isaiah 33:24 said as a cross reference of life under that kingdom

And the inhabitant shall not say, I am sick: the people that dwell therein shall be forgiven their iniquity.

As for Matthew 4:23,

Jesus was sent to save Israel in his first coming (Romans 15:8, Matthew 1:21, Matthew 15:24, Luke 1:68-75)

Like how Moses was recognized by Israel thru signs (Exodus 4:29-31), Israel will likewise recognize Jesus by the signs that he will perform. (Deuteronomy 18:15, Luke 7:20-22, Acts 3:22-23, John 11:45-48).

Israel's correct response to those signs is to believe that he is THAT promised Messiah (Deuteronomy 34:10-12, John 6:28-29, John 20:30-31, John 10:37-38).

So us gentiles in the Body of Christ should not directly look at Jesus first coming to claim those same healings that is a central feature of the gospel of the kingdom (Matthew 10:5-8).

But we can certainly commit to Christ all our requests, including healing from our physical diseases, since Paul our apostle instructed us to (Philippians 4:6).

God can certainly heal today still, and he has.

The main difference is that Paul did not teach us that healing is promised to us in the Body of Christ. the only promise is that God will send to us his peace, that passes all understanding (Philippians 4:7).

Interestingly, the last verse was emphasized by Bill Johnson in the sermon he preached immediately after his wife's passing from cancer. That is a good answer and example to your last question.

 

[jiminpa]

Psalms 103 is a prophecy of life for Israel under their promised kingdom on Earth, during the millennial reign of Christ.

Salvation for them is tied to the promised kingdom of God on Earth, is something they expect in the future (Hebrews 8:8-12, Acts 3:19-21, 1 Peter 1:9).

So Psalms 103, especially the lovely verses from 1-5, specifically tells you what they expect to receive when that kingdom begins (vs 19), which in vs 3, includes both forgiveness of their sins, and physical healing from their diseases.

It is inline with Isaiah 33:24 said as a cross reference of life under that kingdom

And the inhabitant shall not say, I am sick: the people that dwell therein shall be forgiven their iniquity.

As for Matthew 4:23,

Jesus was sent to save Israel in his first coming (Romans 15:8, Matthew 1:21, Matthew 15:24, Luke 1:68-75)

Like how Moses was recognized by Israel thru signs (Exodus 4:29-31), Israel will likewise recognize Jesus by the signs that he will perform. (Deuteronomy 18:15, Luke 7:20-22, Acts 3:22-23, John 11:45-48).

Israel's correct response to those signs is to believe that he is THAT promised Messiah (Deuteronomy 34:10-12, John 6:28-29, John 20:30-31, John 10:37-38).

So us gentiles in the Body of Christ should not directly look at Jesus first coming to claim those same healings that is a central feature of the gospel of the kingdom (Matthew 10:5-8).

But we can certainly commit to Christ all our requests, including healing from our physical diseases, since Paul our apostle instructed us to (Philippians 4:6).

God can certainly heal today still, and he has.

The main difference is that Paul did not teach us that healing is promised to us in the Body of Christ. the only promise is that God will send to us his peace, that passes all understanding (Philippians 4:7).

Interestingly, the last verse was emphasized by Bill Johnson in the sermon he preached immediately after his wife's passing from cancer. That is a good answer and example to your last question.

What in the Bible specifically says that we can't trust God for Israel's promises? If we can dismiss one verse because you are not Jews, then very few verses apply to anyone who is not a Jew. Sorry about your luck, I guess. What about believers being grafted in? What about Peter also equating healing with Jesus's being wounded?

 

[Guojing]

What in the Bible specifically says that we can't trust God for Israel's promises? If we can dismiss one verse because you are not Jews, then very few verses apply to anyone who is not a Jew. Sorry about your luck, I guess. What about believers being grafted in? What about Peter also equating healing with Jesus's being wounded?

Did you read my last 4 paragraphs, regarding healing today for us in the Body of Christ?

 

[jiminpa]

Did you read my last 4 paragraphs, regarding healing today for us in the Body of Christ?

Yes. It seemed like mostly opinion, but maybe I just missed something. So Paul didn't mention healing in his letters, Peter did, Jesus did, James did, Isaiah did. I'm forgetting a lot of others, I'm sure.

 

[jiminpa]

Ezekiel 37:1-10

 

[Guojing]

Yes. It seemed like mostly opinion, but maybe I just missed something. So Paul didn't mention healing in his letters, Peter did, Jesus did, James did, Isaiah did. I'm forgetting a lot of others, I'm sure.

Who among them specifically tells you he is your apostle, like what Paul did in Romans 11:13?

 

[jiminpa]

Who among them specifically tells you he is your apostle, like what Paul did in Romans 11:13?

One has to state the title apostle to be one? Only one who specifically claims to be an apostle gets to establish God's promises? Scripture is only valid if written by one claiming the title apostle? What if one claiming the title apostle says that all scripture is profitable, does that negate what the apostle says, and is that just about all scripture or is everything he says now invalid?

 

[Guojing]

So many things wrong with that statement. One has to state the title apostle to be one? Only one who specifically claims to be an apostle gets to establish God's promises? Scripture is only valid if written by one claiming the title apostle? What if one claiming the title apostle says that all scripture is profitable, does that negate what the apostle says, and is that just about all scripture or is everything he says now invalid?

I can understand your desire to claim those healing promises to Israel, they are certainly very attractive when you are down with Covid-19 for example.

They are truth written in scripture to them at a different time period.

For me, I listen to my apostle and rightly divide the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15).

 

[jiminpa]

I can understand your desire to claim those healing promises to Israel, they are certainly very attractive when you are down with Covid-19 for example.

They are truth written in scripture to them at a different time period.

For me, I listen to my apostle and rightly divide the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15).

You quoted me, but didn't address my questions. You sound like you only value the words of Paul, can you clarify?

 

[Guojing]

You quoted me, but didn't address my questions. You sound like you only value the words of Paul, can you clarify?

I did, I stated "They are truth written in scripture to them at a different time period."

All scripture written is truth and is profitable, but we are instructed to rightly divide the word of truth.

If you want to take all scripture as truth for you to claim, I understand the appeal, but I don't do that.

 

[jiminpa]

I did, I stated "They are truth written in scripture to them at a different time period."

All scripture written is truth and is profitable, but we are instructed to rightly divide the word of truth.

If you want to take all scripture as truth for you to claim, I understand the appeal, but I don't do that.

It seems like you are evading. Do you consider only Paul's words to be valid for doctrine?

 

[Guojing]

It seems like you are evading. Do you consider only Paul's words to be valid for doctrine?

Seems you don't understand what 2 Timothy 2:15 means for us.

If you are referring to doctrine to the Body of Christ now, it is most certainly yes.

 

[jiminpa]

Seems you don't understand what 2 Timothy 2:15 means for us.

If you are referring to doctrine to the Body of Christ now, it is most certainly yes.

I can understand why you won't answer my questions.

Well, I don't want to derail the thread any longer.

 

[Guojing]

I can understand why you won't answer my questions.

Well, I don't want to derail the thread any longer.

I answered a yes to your question.

 

[mourningdove~]

God can certainly heal today still, and he has.

The main difference is that Paul did not teach us that healing is promised to us in the Body of Christ. the only promise is that God will send to us his peace, that passes all understanding (Philippians 4:7).

I like this!

And what greater healing is there, than peace of mind and contentment of soul?

Jesus is our Peace in the storm.
He is our Peace in our sickness, also ...

 

[disciple Clint]

Trying to find a topic that we can amicably disagree on, hopefully this is it. Scripture seems to support and promote that God heals us from all sickness and conditions.

Psalm 103:3 He who forgives all your iniquities and heals all your diseases,

Matthew 4:23 Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

But most all of us have experienced times when we ask for and seek healing and it does not come. Now, a caveat to this discussion is I'm asking you not to use "It's God's Will" as a response to this. Is there scriptural support for the idea that we cannot be healed of some conditions?

Like, are there limits to what we can and cannot be healed of?

What is our response to people who genuinely ask for healing but do not receive it?

The thought that comes to my mind on this subject is how terrible it is when someone is not healed and then they are told that they were not healed because of their lack of faith. That has to be about as foolish and unchristian as anyone can be, it makes me so upset when I hear someone make that comment it is just pain cruel to do that to someone who is already suffering. God has a good reason for what He does or fails to do.

 

[Guojing]

I like this!

And what greater healing is there, than peace of mind and contentment of soul?

Jesus is our Peace in the storm.
He is our Peace in our sickness, also ...

Amen, I like what Paul teaches us the correct perspective towards all sufferings, which includes physical diseases, in Romans 8:18-25.

I especially like the final 3 verses

23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

 

[Tigger45]

I haven’t seen this verse posted yet.

Mark 9:23 “If You can?” echoed Jesus. “All things are possible to him who believes!”

 

[Strong in Him]

Trying to find a topic that we can amicably disagree on, hopefully this is it. Scripture seems to support and promote that God heals us from all sickness and conditions.

Psalm 103:3 He who forgives all your iniquities and heals all your diseases,

Matthew 4:23 Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.

But most all of us have experienced times when we ask for and seek healing and it does not come. Now, a caveat to this discussion is I'm asking you not to use "It's God's Will" as a response to this. Is there scriptural support for the idea that we cannot be healed of some conditions?

God heals.
He can heal physical, mental and spiritual wounds.
He can heal immediately and supernaturally, or gradually, and through doctors.
Because he is all powerful I don't believe there are things that he cannot do.

What is our response to people who genuinely ask for healing but do not receive it?

Well I know what some people's response to Christians not receiving healing is because I've experienced it - on these forums too.
And that was, basically, "God heals everyone who asks in faith. If you haven't been healed, you haven't got enough faith". Or, possibly, "you have sinned/are holding onto sins/have ancestors who have sinned."
It can't possibly be God's "fault" or responsibility that healing doesn't happen - so it must be that of the sick person.

My own experience contradicts that.
In the days before WOF was a separate forum, we had no end of debates on here about healing. I was told, directly, that I wasn't healed because I didn't have faith.
I did. I just didn't agree with WOF folk who urged me to believe I had been healed and to claim it.
While not believing that, and actually speaking against it, I was healed of M.E - overnight.
That was 13 years ago and I still don't believe what they said I had to believe.

Let God be God.
He didn't give me M.E or send it as a perfect gift from above, James 1:17. But he did work through it and taught me loads.
Years later, he healed me from it.
If he hadn't and it had remained, he would still be God, the healer, all powerful.