Another look at the moon landing.

[Strong in Him]

If one truly believes in God's word, which I know you do, you would know that it impossible for them get through the firmament

Why?
Where does it say in the Bible that the firmament is solid?
The NIV says "vault" rather than firmament - it also says that God called the vault, "sky", Genesis 1:8.

& that there is no space above,

If you are taking Genesis literally, which you clearly are, Genesis 1:14 says that the sun and moon were placed IN the vault of the sky, not above it.
So there is no need for anyone to go through the vault, sky or firmament to reach the moon.

& then Heaven.

Heaven is not a place "up there" in the sky; turn right at the third cloud and it's second on the left."
Heaven is being with God and any place where God is served and honoured as king.

This is the main reason why I don't believe that they have ever been to the moon.

None of those verses, or in fact anywhere else in the Bible, says that it is impossible, or forbidden, for people to travel to the moon.
You are basing your whole belief on a misinterpretation of Scripture - and, probably, on whatever Dean Odel says.

Besides, you used to believe the moon landings.

 

[Apple Sky]

If it were, how would asteroids and meteorites land on the earth

They don't God does not chuck stones at the earth.

And anyway, I didn't think you believed that the sun, moon and stars were beyond the firmament,

When ever did I claim this ? God tells us that he set the sun, moon & all the stars in the firmament,

And nobody who has been up in a rocket has crashed into a solid barrier.

That's because the rockets don't go straight up, they arch over as thus;

They are programmed to dump themselves in the Pacific Ocean.

Many of us, like Strong in Him, do fully believe God's word, but we do not see it as teaching things like the shape of the earth, the veracity or otherwise of the moon landings, or your supposed wall of ice surrounding the South Pole.

The scriptures teach us many things about the heavens & the earth you only have to read them to know the truth & one being about the firmament.

 

[Apple Sky]

None of those verses, or in fact anywhere else in the Bible, says that it is impossible, or forbidden, for people to travel to the moon.

God doesn't have to because God knows how it is impossible to get through the splendor of his handiwork which is that crystal solid ceiling which protects earth.

 

[David Lamb]

They don't God does not chuck stones at the earth.

Why make it sound as if I were even suggesting that asteroids and meteorites are "God chucking stones at the earth?" It seems as though you have found some more people to brand as liars - the people who have seen asteroids and meteorites.

When ever did I claim this ? God tells us that he set the sun, moon & all the stars in the firmament,

So if they are in the firmament, why would rockets have to go through the firmament to reach the moon?

That's because the rockets don't go straight up, they arch over as thus;

View attachment 365544

Yes, as I understand it, they orbit the earth to start with in order to accelerate to the necessary speed to overcome the pull of earth's gravity.

They are programmed to dump themselves in the Pacific Ocean.

Are they? How do you know that?

The scriptures teach us many things about the heavens & the earth you only have to read them to know the truth & one being about the firmament.

That's true, but as I have said, there are many things the Scriptures don't tell us, including any notion of the firmament being impassable.

 

[Strong in Him]

God doesn't have to because God knows how it is impossible to get through the splendor of his handiwork which is that crystal solid ceiling which protects earth.

And how are WE supposed to know, when we read this book that supposedly tells us all about the earth?
Are you saying that God knows something about his creation that we don't, he's not going to tell us about it but he will punish, or prevent, anyone who tries to get through this "solid firmament"?? One question; if no one can get through this unbiblical solid ceiling, why didn't all the rockets crash, break up or bounce off it?

Scripture does not say, anywhere, that the firmament is a literal, solid ceiling that protects the earth. And you, who supposedly believe the whole Bible literally, should know that.

 

[Apple Sky]

Are you saying that God knows something about his creation that we don't, he's not going to tell us about it but he will punish, or prevent, anyone who tries to get through this "solid firmament"??

That's not what God is saying, I would imagine God is laughing.

One question; if no one can get through this unbiblical solid ceiling, why didn't all the rockets crash, break up or bounce off it?

I've explained all this to David.

Scripture does not say, anywhere, that the firmament is a literal, solid ceiling that protects the earth. And you, who supposedly believe the whole Bible literally, should know that.

So what supports the waters above and where would you find the flood gates or the windows of heaven ? I suppose the great deluge didn't happen either ?

 

[Strong in Him]

That's not what God is saying,

It's rather depressing that this has been explained to you before, and you either don't understand, won't understand or refuse to believe it.
i) The Bible is not a science textbook. It reveals GOD - his nature, his will, his love, his desire to have a relationship with humans who he made in his image, his plan of salvation, his Son and so on. I once wrote a post in which I explained History = His Story - how mankind sinned against him again and again, and he punished, forgave and restored us again and again. Then he sent Jesus to be a once for all sacrifice for sin.
You said that you agreed with that post.
God is a loving father, we are his children. He wants us to accept his Son. John 6:29 and John 6:40 make it clear that God's whole work and his will, is that people should accept Jesus and have eternal life. Of course it is; our salvation cost God his Son, it cost Jesus hours of agony and then his life.
Don't you get it? The shape of the earth has nothing whatsoever to do with this - never has, never will.
There are Christians who believe the earth is a globe - we still believe God, read the Bible and are saved. There are Christians such as yourself who believe the earth is flat - you still believe in God, read the Bible and are saved. There are many, many Christians in other countries who know nothing about the shape of the earth and couldn't care less. They just love, serve and trust God. Their churches are growing big time - probably because they don't waste time on unimportant stuff like this.
ii) Genesis was not dictated by God; it is written in the third person.
If it started, "These are the words of God, I'm going to tell you exactly how I made the earth. In the beginning I made ...... This means ...... and you are to believe this literally, no matter what anyone tells you in the future", then of course we would listen to, and believe, God's own words. But he didn't.
The purpose of the Bible is to tell us about God. Moses, or whoever, wrote that God created the world - of course he did, he's the Creator. But he didn't tell us HOW, he didn't say that his words were all to be taken literally nor that people were to spend all their time debating every word or syllable.
The message of Genesis 1 is that GOD created, full stop. When people say to us, "fate has decided ....", "it's written in the stars" or "the universe is trying to tell me something", our answer should be, I believe that it's GOD who made the universe and the stars who wants to tell you something. He wants a relationship with you."
iii) Moses wrote Genesis 1 in language that people could understand. How many people would have understood if he had given scientific detail?
Apparently, the early Hebrews thought in pictures, so he described the creation in picture language. That does not change the basic truth that it was GOD who created all these things.

So no, in Genesis 1 God is not saying "then I made a firmament, the moon, the rivers, the trees and animals and this is the technical detail.".

I would imagine God is laughing.

I would imagine he's crying at the fact that you are completely obsessed with things that don't matter - to the point where everyone else who says anything that challenges your belief is lying, and anyone who tries to explain the Scriptures to you doesn't know the truth and is deceived.

I've explained all this to David.

Maybe you could give me a link to that post then, or explain it again, briefly, please?

So what supports the waters above and where would you find the flood gates or the windows of heaven ?

I believe this is probably picture language again - maybe how they explained the idea of rain.
You seem to believe that Noah, Abraham, Moses etc would have had the same level of scientific knowledge that people have today. They didn't.
Nor did God explain things to them in scientific terms; that was not his purpose.

I have a Bible - New English, I think - which has a picture of how people imagined the universe in Moses' day.
Not that they would have said that mattered. There were so many other gods around in OT times. Gods of Egypt, gods that other countries believed in, different gods who controlled the weather and so on. All Moses and the prophets needed the Hebrews to understand was that there was ONE God who made, and controlled, everything.

I suppose the great deluge didn't happen either ?

Of course it did; why do you say that I would think otherwise?

Even today, we use images and picture language. Talking about the weather, people say "the heavens opened", meaning that it absolutely poured with rain/rained very heavily. "It's raining cats and dogs" means the same thing - no one believes that animals are falling out of the sky. We even say "the sun's in my eyes". It's not, it's in the sky. It is the rays of the sun which are so strong and bright that they are preventing us from seeing anything else.

None of this can bring us closer to God, help us to grow in faith or means that we are do deceived that God will punish us.
Seriously, God isn't interested in the shape of the earth. He's interested in your faith, your growth as a Christian, how well you know the Bible (NOT just "flat earth verses), how often you pay and whether you love others as Jesus loves you.

 

[Radagast]

For 2000 years, Christians have accepted that the earth is a globe. Indeed, the evidence for the globe is overwhelming.

I'll stick with those Christians and ignore the 19th century flat earth nonsense.

 

[David Lamb]

I've explained all this to David.

Yes you have, by saying that rockets don't go straight up but follow a curved path, and that they are pre-programmed to crash into the ocean. I replied that the reason rockets follow a curved path to start with is to build up to "escape velocity," and I asked you what evidence you have that all space rockets are programmed to crash into the ocean. So you haven't really "explained all this to David."