"All dogs go to..." (the new earth)?

[DennisTate]

I agree, that I don't believe in "soul sleep" either; but I don't think you need NDE's to prove that.

The story of the rich man and Lazarus makes an interesting account of the consciousness of people in Sheol. I'd discussed this with a couple of other people in various other threads (now of course I don't remember what threads those were)? Those conversations involved defining "Abraham's bosom" and "the third heaven", "paradise", "the tree of life" (being in the 3rd heaven / synonymous with "paradise" (I.E Jesus telling the thief "Today you will be with me in paradise.")

Sheol, of course is different than the lake of fire.

One of those (and off the top of my head; I can't remember which one; but I believe the reference is the lake of fire) depicts a "place where they are not heard"; which I think is where the confusion of the "soul sleep" doctrine is coming from.

They're "not being heard" isn't on account of their lack of consciousness; it's because God has shut them in a place where they are void of any comfort of His mercy. They are in the "outer darkness" away from His presence; and what a terrifying proposition that is! The epitome of retribution as being utterly forsaken by God! The irony thereof being that in this life that's all they wanted. The desire of the natural man is to be separated from God so he can enjoy his sin in peace, being a lover of darkness rather than light. And in the end, what the unregenerate desire is exactly what they receive; to be cast out of God's presence.

"Be careful what you wish for; because you just might get it all. You just might get it all; and then some you don't want...." (Home - Daughtry)

If you look at the context of the reference in John that you quoted. "I will show you plainly of the Father." has to do with knowing Christ is the Redeemer. We know this because if you follow the response of what the disciples say to Jesus; they say to him: "We know you came from God..."

From this Jesus explains that he will die; they won't see him and then they will see him again. The peace and security they will have is known at Pentecost when they are indwelled by the Holy Spirit. I don't need someone's (half truth account at best) of a "near death experience" to be assured that heaven is real and that there is a new world coming. I know that is a reality because the Holy Spirit bears record of that as the entity obviously having witnessed all these events the Scripture speaks of. This is why the only testimony I trust is the Scripture.

Things people claim happen may be interesting. They may be a genuine phenomena explainable by other means; yet still not be wholly reliable as "Divine truth" if they are reliable at all?

When the figure told me "Go back, your son needs you." That was true. My son does need me. But was that merely a manifestation of what my subconscious already knew, despite my personal struggle with my own desire to leave this world?

Ultimately, whether we live or die is in the hand of God. I can't "will myself dead" if it isn't my appointed time. Yet I distinctly remember saying to God before the paramedics pulled me out of the car and stuck me in the chopper: "God if You want me to survive this; than You're going to have to make that happen; because I can't." And I knew that was true. If I was going to survive this accident, that was not going to happen just because I "willed it". If death was going to come; I also wasn't of the will to fight that either. I was resigned to the fact that whether or not I lived or died was in God's hands. (Matter of fact, of the condition I was in, the paramedics were shocked that I was still conscious. Both paramedics and police said that.)

Now there did come a time that the shock of the trauma did overcome my ability to remain conscious. I passed out in the chopper and woke up and vomited a couple of times and I vaguely remember being rolled through the corridor to the OR and people cutting my clothing off in preparation for surgery. I'd been intubated and they were "breathing" for me. I just laid there with my eyes open, not really thinking about anything. I couldn't "see" much because of the bright lights. (I couldn't see out of one eye anyways; my face was all torn up and one eye had a "globe rupture"). I remember a nurse saying: "She's awake." and being told I was about to get anesthesia. I felt a sense of relief. I either was going to wake up after surgery or I wasn't going to wake up at all.

The next time I did wake up. I was screaming. It was hard to breath and it felt like my back was broken. I remember the nurse saying: "No, your back isn't broken. You just need to be repositioned and she moved me around and stuck some pillows under my shoulder. It took about 10 minus, but I felt better and "went back to sleep". I think I was in the OR recovery room? (It was bright in there too.) Eventually I was taken to surgical ICU. I don't remember much of that, other than periodically waking up screaming because I was in pain. I remember "trying" to watch TV. and having absolutely no sense of time. I kept asking the staff when ever I woke up what day was it; what time was it. They kept pointing me to the clock on the wall.

One of those points when I woke up. I was asking: "Where is he, where'd he go?" There was one person there. She said: "You're husband in on the 7th floor." I said: "No, I know where he is." Then she said: "Your son is on the 4th floor." Then I said: "That must be where he went." At this point a nurse had come in the room. Then I said: "When he comes back, send him in here. I want him to stay with me." And the one staff said: "Who?" I said: "Jesus". The other staff said: "Jesus who?" And I yelled at them. "Jesus Christ. The guy who rose from the dead. It's Easter Sunday. What's the matter with you people!" The one looked at the nurse and the nurse whispered: "The doctors think she has a head injury." (Which was true I did.)

At some point after that they called a chaplain. He came to see me again the next day when I went into surgery for my leg and he asked me if I remembered talking to him the night before and I said no. He kind of laughed and said: "Well that's probably a good thing." I asked: "What, did I say something stupid?" He said: "Well, you weren't making a lot of sense." Then he asked me if I was Roman Catholic and I said no. He said: "Oh, OK?" and we started talking a little bit about theology. He told me I'd been in a bad car accident. I said: "Yeah, I know that." We talked about finding purpose for things that happen to us. He was what I'd call a "run of the mill, evangelical Baptist type preacher". He'd come to the conclusion that my beliefs were probably similar to his. I remember telling him that I'd be "theologically calvinistic if you were to stick a doctrinal label on me." He said he knew what that was; quoted a couple of Bible passages and we talked about those. I told him about my son; a lot of his trials and tribulations.

He stayed with me until they came and got me for surgery. I asked him if he was going to come back and see me after surgery. He said he was just "on call" and wasn't a regular chaplain there. So unless he got called again. I probably wouldn't see him; but he said if he did and I was still in the hospital, he'd come look me up. I don't know if he'd been called again while I was there. We'd been in the hospital for about a month; but I never saw him again.

So... on the other side of eternity; I guess I'll find out who the mysterious chaplain was that day?

Good points.... but what about the Life Review that
people like Howard Storm report..... there are a number
of scriptures and promises that sure seem to remind me
of this rather common part of the near death experience accounts.

Hebrews 9:27 "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:


John 5:22 "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:"

At the time of his near death experience Howard Storm is an extreme Skeptic but......
after his powerful and scary at first near death experience.....
he leaves a great career as head of the Art department of a university and
goes back to college to become a theologian!!!!!

That sure sounds like Howard did works "meet for repentance" after his near death experience!
Acts 26:20 "But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."


Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience
3. The Life Review of Howard Storm

 

[The Righterzpen]

Good points.... but what about the Life Review that
people like Howard Storm report..... there are a number
of scriptures and promises that sure seem to remind me
of this rather common part of the near death experience accounts.

Hebrews 9:27 "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:


John 5:22 "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:"

At the time of his near death experience Howard Storm is an extreme Skeptic but......
after his powerful and scary at first near death experience.....
he leaves a great career as head of the Art department of a university and
goes back to college to become a theologian!!!!!

That sure sounds like Howard did works "meet for repentance" after his near death experience!
Acts 26:20 "But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."


Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience
3. The Life Review of Howard Storm

People have reformations of their lives without the "near death experience" too though. So that raises the valid question; is it the "near death experience" or is it the event that confronted them with their mortality in the first place?

I've faced death on a few occasions. The one that scared me the most and made me seriously question where I'd end up in eternity was Desert Storm. I was in Poland when Saddam invaded Kuwait and I knew at that point I was probably going to war. Now as it turned out: I did escape the active conflict but didn't escape the war because I helped clean up the mess after it was over.

Almost two years prior to that; I'd started my trek into Christianity. I came to a spiritual awakening when I was about 16 and that came through 12 step groups. (I was going to Al-Anon.) Prior to coming to the conclusion that there really was a God; I was an atheist.) And when one of my Al-Anon friends took me to a Billy Gramm crusade; I started reading the Bible and trying to figure out what exactly this whole concept of "Redeemer paying for sin" was. I knew emotionally and psychologically speaking that I could not straiten my life out by myself. And other than what I'd learned in social studies classes in a secular public school and seeing Bible movies on TV like Charleston Heston's "10 Commandments" I knew nothing about the Bible and my only point of reference about Jesus was that he was a historical figure who started a religion.

So after reading the New Testament and coming to the conclusion that if there really was a Redeemer from sin, death and the wrath of God; it was probably Jesus because he was the only one who ever claimed to be the Redeemer. Now what ever this being God incarnate really meant; I hadn't the foggiest clue. All I knew was that I needed help and the concept of God understanding human suffering and having mercy on those who knew they needed Divine intervention was very attractive to me. So if whomever this Jesus was; was the intercessor - OK - I like you. Help me figure life out. I have no idea what I'm suppose to do; where I'm suppose to be? I've been depressed my entire life. Traumatized by abuse and neglect; I'm dirty and I want to be clean. Show me what that is suppose to mean, because I aint got the foggiest clue. And that was my starting point.

So skip ahead another year and 1/2 or so and a very real event (the Gulf War) confronts me with my mortality. At that point I was at: "God, I barely understand You and my soul is still plagued by memories I can't control now and what happens if I survive this war? I'm going to be even more messed up; but if I don't survive this war... Am I safe? or..... Am I one of those people You'll say "Depart from me you workers of iniquity. I never knew you." God please don't let me die before I know I'm OK." Then one day reading I stumbled upon: ".. he who began a good work in you will be faithful to complete it unto the day of redemption". And at that point I realized my redemption wasn't about me; it was about HIM! He is the author and finisher of what ever faith I have.

Now I wan't any more straitened out at that point in my own head. Externally speaking, I was always rather moral. I didn't have alcohol and drug problems, wasn't promiscuous, didn't steel stuff, didn't really have problems with those in authority. I was just lost, depressed and felt like no-one really cared about me. I was small and insignificant. I could disappear from the earth and it wouldn't matter. No-one would notice. But at that point; I had a little hope that at least God knew I was here and He wasn't going to loose track or misplace me, even if some Iraqi shot me dead.

So, it really isn't the NDE that changes someone. It's the event that confronts them with their mortality. The NDE simply represents the struggle with that mortality that they face. And because all humans are sinners affected by not only their own fallen nature, but their own sin; how their subconscious manifests that struggle to themselves can not be relied upon as truth from God. If you look at these NDE's you will always find that they are about the internal struggle of the individual who has them at the time they occur. They don't really point to God. They point to what that individual is struggling with. They point to that individual's fears or the aspirations of what they wish for. They do not point to God's work. They aren't Scripture.

So if psychological things of such nature are of interest for you to study; to understand what it is and why it happens. I can understand the curiosity of wanting to answer those questions; but know those experiences are not Divinely imparted. They are simply a psychological manifestation of human struggles.

 

[The Righterzpen]

Welcome Home! My Mini AutoBiography Chapter 1: Experience Strength & Hope, a bible fanfic | FanFiction

 

[sparow]

Here's a bit of theological "furry" fluff for all the pet lovers out there who've wondered what becomes of their beloved fuzz faces on the other side of eternity?

I've been thinking about this recently in the wake of my dog having a medical issue where it became quite clear that his pain was not going to be easily controlled by conventional meds used on dogs. (He seemed to have unusual side effects to the most prevalent class of doggy pain meds.) The only permanent solution to this is surgery. (A $8000. to $10,000. endeavor between MRI and post surgical rehab.)

Anyways, after agonizing about this for 4 days; I opted to request of the vet that my dog could "go live with Jesus". Well, to make a long story short, the end result of what will become of my dog has not been determined yet. He was surrendered to an agency who stated that if they can surgically fix him; they will do so and put him up for adoption. If not, he "goes to live with Jesus".

So just before staff took my dog off to his temporary kennel; I said: "See you on the other side of eternity."

Now I have been around enough theological neighborhood blocks to know dog's have not human type souls and so therefore are not held accountable for any disobedience to God's order they may have committed during their lives; in the life immediately here after.

Yet, if the creation "groans and travails" awaiting the revelation of the sons of God; what about the recreated world? It does seem reasonable to me to conclude that if individual humans are raised to eternal life to reside on a recreated earth; so would individual animals be raised. (Now granted, this may mean "earth" "becomes" a much bigger planet. LOL - that's a lot of cats, dogs, turtles and parakeets.)

Joking aside though; who else believes they may very well see pets of this life in the recreated earth?

Jesus did not have a high opinion of dogs; I suspect some animals will accompany those humans who enter in but they would have to be born again into a spiritual form.

 

[Tone]

I find it ironic and "oxymoronacle" that people speak of "intelligent life" and often fail to see how much intelligence is within the animal kingdom of this very planet. We live in a "smart world". And seeing how some of those pieces fit together and interact with each other is a further testament to the genius of God.

I would like to say that the pets go to Narnia...where they can talk...

But really, your point about animals having intelligence sparked an idea about how atheists always like to say that believing in what the Bible says has no rational basis, because they say, the accounts can't be analysed/"critically examined"...I mean, I don't know any animals who do science and yet,they exist and function as rational beings...so...

 

[The Righterzpen]

I would like to say that the pets go to Narnia...where they can talk...

LOL - I like that idea - Although I'm not sure I'd want to know what my dog would have to say to me?? !!!

But really, your point about animals having intelligence sparked an idea about how atheists always like to say that believing in what the Bible says has no rational basis, because they say, the accounts can't be analysed/"critically examined"...I mean, I don't know any animals who do science and yet,they exist and function as rational beings...so...

Good point! At least the Bible can communicate in a language humans can understand. For as in on the same token, I don't know any humans who speak whale, dolphin, dog or chimp. The "linguistic adaptations" animals who are domesticated (or quasi so) have with humans are surprisingly adapted to human interaction. Parrots that can count, dolphins that can color code rings and monkeys with limited use of sign language are all taught to communicate with humans in means humans can interpret; so in that sense, who's really the "smart guy" on the planet? LOL

 

[The Righterzpen]

Jesus did not have a high opinion of dogs; I suspect some animals will accompany those humans who enter in but they would have to be born again into a spiritual form.

I really don't think that Jesus, who created everything on this planet has much of a varied / lower opinion of animals as he has of disobedient humans. After all, nobody's dog will be cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Tone]

I really don't think that Jesus, who created everything on this planet has much of a varied / lower opinion of animals as he has of disobedient humans. After all, nobody's dog will be cast into the lake of fire.

I was just thinking along these lines yesterday...the animals and trees and such are subject to corruption, not because of their choice, but because of mankind's decision...so, they are the truly innocent....A thought actually flittered through my mind that they may actually be the recipients of more honor and glory than we have ever imagined...

 

[The Righterzpen]

I was just thinking along these lines yesterday...the animals and trees and such are subject to corruption, not because of their choice, but because of mankind's decision...so, they are the truly innocent....A thought actually flittered through my mind that they may actually be the recipients of more honor and glory than we have ever imagined...

The creature was made subject to vanity because of man's sin. You are absolutely correct!

Although the Scripture does talk about non human entities "sinning"; they aren't condemned for it. There's actually a verse that speaks of the land sinning. How does land sin? LOL - but it's in there!

 

[Tone]

There's actually a verse that speaks of the land sinning. How does land sin?

Where is this? Hmmmm...it must have to do with what we did with it...

 

[The Righterzpen]

Where is this? Hmmmm...it must have to do with what we did with it...

Yeah, it does. The most direct reference is Deuteronomy 24:4. The context has to do with not remarrying a formally divorced wife after wife #2 dies. "Causing the land to sin." is thrown in-between these verses. I'm not sure what marriage in this case has to do with the land? But anyways, it's context in there.

The other is Jeremiah 16:18, speaks of defiling the land with idols.

I thought there was another direct reference in there too; but I'm not seeing it off hand. (Some of that may have to do with the way its translated.)

 

[Tone]

It also says this:

Leviticus 25
"3For six years you may sow your field and prune your vineyard and gather its crops. 4But in the seventh year there shall be a Sabbath of complete rest for the land— a Sabbath to the LORD. You are not to sow your field or prune your vineyard. 5You are not to reap the aftergrowth of your harvest or gather the grapes of your untended vines. The land must have a year of complete rest."

So,it can be a result of what we didn't do as much as of what we did do...to contribute to its corruption.

 

[The Righterzpen]

It also says this:

Leviticus 25
"3For six years you may sow your field and prune your vineyard and gather its crops. 4But in the seventh year there shall be a Sabbath of complete rest for the land— a Sabbath to the LORD. You are not to sow your field or prune your vineyard. 5You are not to reap the aftergrowth of your harvest or gather the grapes of your untended vines. The land must have a year of complete rest."

So,it can be a result of what we didn't do as much as of what we did do...to contribute to its corruption.

There's also a verse that talks about "no longer curse the ground for your sake" (think it's directed at specifically at Adam).

Genesis 3:17, 5:29, 8:21

I think it's "sin" is that it doesn't produce because it's been defiled.

It speaks in like manner of beasts that "sin". (As an animal that goes against the nature of what it's intended for. Things like "predatory bears" fall into this category. (They "hunt people" and kill them, for reasons unknown to scientists. Something's gone wrong in the bear's psyche. They don't eat the people they kill. They just kill them.)

 

[Tone]

There's also a verse that talks about "no longer curse the ground for your sake" (think it's directed at specifically at Adam).

Genesis 3:17, 5:29, 8:21

This corruption found in "nature" (really it's unnature) is what the evolutionists have idolized and they believe that they are finding some truth in a cursed creation.

 

[The Righterzpen]

This corruption found in "nature" (really it's unnature) is what the evolutionists have idolized and they believe that they are finding some truth in a cursed creation.

There are other animals that fall into this category. (Mountain Lions who've attacked people too. Although with them, they find some of these attacks are not "predatory" they just believe the animal is desperate because there is not enough food. A lot of these attacks are not fatal though, so this is why I think bears get more study.)

Lone, predatory black bears responsible for most human attacks

 

[The Righterzpen]

@Tone

Or the people are attacked because they do something stupid like get between a mother and it's baby.

I was actually walking on the Erie Canal path today and passed a mother dear and her fawn. It's been pretty wet here though so, the deer are getting enough food; but I looked at her for that reason. The fawn was pretty young. She was right by the side of the path. I walked passed her, she wasn't even 5 feet away from me. She was flicking her tail a bit. I looked at her a minute, turned my head and kept walking. It's a pretty populated area though so, the deer are at least somewhat used to humans.

But yeah, mess with some animal's baby and you're probably going to find trouble!

 

[Tone]

There are other animals that fall into this category. (Mountain Lions who've attacked people too. Although with them, they find some of these attacks are not "predatory" they just believe the animal is desperate because there is not enough food. A lot of these attacks are not fatal though, so this is why I think bears get more study.)

Lone, predatory black bears responsible for most human attacks

I saw a black bear the other day...running through a neighborhood...I fumbled around for my phone to take pictures, but he had already moved away from the truck and by the time I was ready, I had to jump out of the truck as he was running down the street and barely snapped off a couple of less desirable pics. I've been seeing a lot of deer too. One little fawn was left behind...or got so frightened that it ran from its mother and was struggling to climb up the mountain side, but finally just gave up and tried to hide under a tree. We got out and petted it and took pics. (probably shouldn't have touched it...). I'll post the deer pic.as my avatar!

*Poor little thing was so frightened, I didn't want to mess with it too much to get a better pic.

 

[JacksBratt]

Here's a bit of theological "furry" fluff for all the pet lovers out there who've wondered what becomes of their beloved fuzz faces on the other side of eternity?

I've been thinking about this recently in the wake of my dog having a medical issue where it became quite clear that his pain was not going to be easily controlled by conventional meds used on dogs. (He seemed to have unusual side effects to the most prevalent class of doggy pain meds.) The only permanent solution to this is surgery. (A $8000. to $10,000. endeavor between MRI and post surgical rehab.)

Anyways, after agonizing about this for 4 days; I opted to request of the vet that my dog could "go live with Jesus". Well, to make a long story short, the end result of what will become of my dog has not been determined yet. He was surrendered to an agency who stated that if they can surgically fix him; they will do so and put him up for adoption. If not, he "goes to live with Jesus".

So just before staff took my dog off to his temporary kennel; I said: "See you on the other side of eternity."

Now I have been around enough theological neighborhood blocks to know dog's have not human type souls and so therefore are not held accountable for any disobedience to God's order they may have committed during their lives; in the life immediately here after.

Yet, if the creation "groans and travails" awaiting the revelation of the sons of God; what about the recreated world? It does seem reasonable to me to conclude that if individual humans are raised to eternal life to reside on a recreated earth; so would individual animals be raised. (Now granted, this may mean "earth" "becomes" a much bigger planet. LOL - that's a lot of cats, dogs, turtles and parakeets.)

Joking aside though; who else believes they may very well see pets of this life in the recreated earth?

I find it curious that the bible says "It is appointed unto men, once to die"

This is a specific fact for "men". Not animals. Not trees or any other living thing.

So, IMO, tongue in cheek.... could animals not just be recycled? So, instead of billions of dogs, cats, horses, bears, sheep, cows and all other creatures... there would only have to be a set amount, dying and reborn.

Then, Everyone could have their favorite pet, in heaven and the place would not be over run with animals.

Is there any scripture to counter this?


Hebrews 9:27 King James Version (KJV)
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

 

[The Righterzpen]

I saw a black bear the other day...running through a neighborhood...I fumbled around for my phone to take pictures, but he had already moved away from the truck and by the time I was ready, I had to jump out of the truck as he was running down the street and barely snapped off a couple of less desirable pics. I've been seeing a lot of deer too. One little fawn was left behind...or got so frightened that it ran from its mother and was struggling to climb up the mountain side, but finally just gave up and tried to hide under a tree. We got out and petted it and took pics. (probably shouldn't have touched it...). I'll post the deer pic.as my avatar!

*Poor little thing was so frightened, I didn't want to mess with it too much to get a better pic.

Yeah, I've heard that if you touch babies they are "rejected" by their mothers. I don't think that's wholly true though. I've seen footage of researchers "tagging" young animals for tracking purposes and although they are careful not to leave too much "human smell" behind; I'm sure the parents can tell something has been in their den / nest.

I hypothesis that the "fear" might come in that if the baby "too much" doesn't "smell right" that its contracted some sort of illness and therefor may be abandon for fear of getting the rest of the babies sick. I know animals come in contact with all kinds of other species, I'm sure there's always quite the flow of hapless rodents that wander into dens and end up as lunch.

So, I don't know about the "animal smells like a human" bit. I read a study once where they tested a bunch of wolves and found they had DNA markers of domesticated dogs. Now granted wolves and domesticated dogs are actually genetically the same species; it's just certain DNA sequences are more evident within the separate groups.

Now if I'm recalling correctly, they found this in Scotland too. There's a certain type small species wild cat that's native to Britain that they've found "domestic feline" DNA markers in that "species" too.

So what I think this goes to show is that animal families (canine, feline, what ever genus bear and deer are) are all "genetically closer" to each other than adherents to evolutionary theory would want us to believe. You can cross lions and tigers and bears actually naturally cross "species" too. Which raises the question of whether or not these are really separate species or such as what we would call different "breeds" in the domesticated dog world?

 

[The Righterzpen]

I find it curious that the bible says "It is appointed unto men, once to die"

This is a specific fact for "men". Not animals. Not trees or any other living thing.

So, IMO, tongue in cheek.... could animals not just be recycled? So, instead of billions of dogs, cats, horses, bears, sheep, cows and all other creatures... there would only have to be a set amount, dying and reborn.

Then, Everyone could have their favorite pet, in heaven and the place would not be over run with animals.

Is there any scripture to counter this?


Hebrews 9:27 King James Version (KJV)
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

I think the passage itself explains to us what it means. Animals and plants don't face judgement. They are not created in God's image.

As for your other question about "recycled animals and plants"?

I think science answers that. Every individual life form has its very own unique combination of DNA to its individual genome. Even identical twins aren't genetically "exactly the same".

If you take all the seeds shed by one plant in a season and test them, they are all genetically different. So even though you could have 500 different maple tree seeds from one parent tree, all those "baby maple trees" should you plant them, would be different from each other and different from the parent tree.

Now here's the weird thing. Trees can actually "tell" which baby trees that spring up on the forest floor came from their seeds. So the parent trees will actually shunt nutrients to the baby trees that belong to them. How they "know" this, scientists only guess has to do with chemicals released in the soil as part of regular biological life processes.

Trees also have the ability that if there is a "mass threatened extinction event" like a forest fire; they can "warn" other trees by releasing a certain chemical. This causes those trees to "shut down" certain functions to hold in reserve to ensure the root base survives and the next generation of trees can grow up again even if the fire is severe enough to kill this generation of trees. Sometimes it isn't. There are times the forest can survive the fire.

So looking at the complexity of life and what it's capable of doing. There is no reason to "recycle" plants and animals.

Now the pattern to all life is its DNA genome; which actually has infinite numbers of possible combinations within the different kingdoms and phyla and genomes etc. And this is why no two animals or plants are exactly the same.

Now here's a little "Theology of life theory":

We know all humans have a body, soul and spirit.
The body is the material aspect of us.
The soul houses consciousness as well as the "processes" that create emotion which is what makes us accountable to God.
The spirit is the portion of existence that God communicates to us through. It's like the electric receptacle that you "plug" something into.

All these components of our existence come about as the natural process of our conception. We don't "inherit" soul or spirit from God, we inherit them from our parents at the point God determines we will be a viable life form and we receive the breath of life.

The breath of life is the only thing we get from God and all life receives it. This is what makes life distinct from non life. And this (for example) is why artificial intelligence will never be a "life form". No matter how smart your computer gets; it will never have the breath of life imparted to it by God.

Now the breath of life is what brings forth the body, soul and spirit as a viable life form. At the point God removes the breath of life; that constitutes "death". That is something only God has control over. We can not remove the breath of life from ourselves and "will ourselves dead". We can destroy a body to the point that the breath of life exits it and depending on if that is human, animal or plant and the motivation wherewith we caused that death could constitute murder.

Now personally I do believe plants and animals have "souls" and "spirits" as being life forms created by God. I just don't believe their forms of "soul" or "spirit" are on the same par with humans because they are not created in God's image. Animals and plants can not contemplate the purpose of their existence because they have no conscience. And this is why morally they are not held accountable to acts committed as being "right" or "wrong".

Now animals that have the intellectual capacity to make choices (which many certainly do) are capable of executing actions that displease God. The Scripture does speak in general terms of an animal's capacity to "sin". It's just they are not held accountable for that in eternity because they don't have consciousness whereby with to contemplate the purpose of their existence, or the reason they'e done something that displeases God. Now they do receive a "form" or "retribution" in this life in that humans often kill them because they pose a threat to humans and other animals.

Yet, this intellectual capacity though, is also what makes animals capable of learning. And learn some pretty complex patterns of behavior they certainly can! (Which often they learn from humans.) Look at behavior patterns of domesticated animals that differ from quasi-domesticated (ex. zoo or circus animals) that differ from those in the wild. Wild animals and those in captivity can "be friendly" to humans in behavior patterns they don't exhibit in the wild. They can actually "learn" to "go out of their way" to display behaviors toward us that we associate with morals and ethics; like gratitude and empathy. Now animals I believe do naturally possess a certain degree of gratitude and empathy as part of their natural "survival instinct". If they didn't, we wouldn't see "packs" of animals that group together to ensure their own survival.

All that being said, I believe plants and animals are "periphery"(ably) aware of the fact that there is a Creator; (the Scripture does say that the "creature having become subject to vanity" does "groan and travail waiting for the revelation of the sons of God") yet again, because they are not created in God's image; their capacity is limited.

And here is where the relational difference between man and animal is distinct and unique. Man as at "the top of the food chain". No animal on this planet preys upon us as a consistent food source; or as a food source at all really. Now obviously animals do attack humans. That does happen, and for a variety of reasons; but it is not of the normal course of events and often times when an animal does kill a human, they don't eat them. Now scavenger animals will eat a human carcass; but scavenger animals don't "hunt to kill" in the same capacity that carnivores do.

So here are some of the Scriptural "ins and outs" of both human and non-human life existence as they relate to God. And given God's infinite ability to maintain the propagation of life; (He did tell all life to "be fruitful and multiply" - that was the first commandment given to the entire creation) there'd be no reason to "recycle" plants and animals.