• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Status
Not open for further replies.
hey people,

Just signed up today, anyways what does everyone think about abortion? I've been taught that "fetuses" don't have a soul until they are born, until they can breathe, and it's biblical, also that babies are parasites (that means we should kill the mentally retarded too)

So when do people get their souls? upon conception? or upon birth?

Thanks your bro in christ
 

Serapha

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2003
5,133
28
✟6,704.00
Faith
Non-Denom
HOTTEST DIGGEDY DOG EVER said:
what does everyone think about abortion? I've been taught that "fetuses" don't have a soul until they are born, until they can breathe, and it's biblical, also that babies are parasites (that means we should kill the mentally retarded too)

So when do people get their souls? upon conception? or upon birth?


What do I "think"?

I "think" that the soul and spirit are different aspects of man. The spirit is the breath of life, given by God when we take our first breath, and is that which is returned to God at death.

The soul, though, is the inner man, the will, the intellect, emotions, thoughts, decision-making ability, or discernment. In Hebrew, it is a concept and not just a word that can be defined. The spirit may be recognized as the life principle bestowed on man by God, the soul as the resulting life constituted in the individual, the body being the material organism animated by soul and spirit.

Therefore, when I view a sonar image of a baby being aborted, and I see the baby attempting to move away from the instruments which are trying to destroy it, that fetus has made a decision that it doesn't like what is happening and it is trying to move away from the circumstance in the only way it knows how. That is the will, the intellect, the discernment, and the decision-making abilty that God gives each person through their soul. Therefore, I can know that the soul is in existence in a fetus before it breaths the breath of life and receives it's spirit from God.


"THAT's" what I think.


~malaka~
 
Upvote 0

Philosoft

Orthogonal, Tangential, Tenuously Related
Dec 26, 2002
5,427
188
52
Southeast of Disorder
Visit site
✟6,503.00
Faith
Atheist
Would that there was no need for abortion.

Here's a problem. Suppose abortion is illegal. Now, what are the logical implications insofar as the state is concerned?

Here's one - State: "You, as a pregnant woman must attempt to give birth to your child-to-be."

Now, the contrapositive of that is, "You, as a pregnant woman, must not attempt to give birth to your child-to-be."

These statements are logically equivalent, insofar as the law is concerned.

A recourse for the state would be to declare the latter statement unacceptable because it is morally wrong to murder a person. Unfortunately, bestowing legal personhood on an embryo is a dubious proposition, at best. They would have to be counted in the census, for one thing.
 
Upvote 0
Philosoft said:
Would that there was no need for abortion.

Here's a problem. Suppose abortion is illegal. Now, what are the logical implications insofar as the state is concerned?

Here's one - State: "You, as a pregnant woman must attempt to give birth to your child-to-be."

Now, the contrapositive of that is, "You, as a pregnant woman, must not attempt to give birth to your child-to-be."

These statements are logically equivalent, insofar as the law is concerned.

A recourse for the state would be to declare the latter statement unacceptable because it is morally wrong to murder a person. Unfortunately, bestowing legal personhood on an embryo is a dubious proposition, at best. They would have to be counted in the census, for one thing.
Very well said. Choice is needed.
 
Upvote 0

JillLars

It's a Boy! Jace David- Due 1/20/07
Jan 20, 2003
3,105
115
42
New Hope, MN
Visit site
✟3,944.00
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Single
I don't think abortion is a morally correct choice, but I do believe it depends on the circumstances. I believe that people should make responsible choices, but try telling people that nowadays. I have questions about whether or not life actually begins at conception, because there are many eggs that are fertalized that never reach the implantation stage. I would not compare babies to parasites, and use that as an argument for abortion, in some respect, we are all parasites. Yes we can walk and get food if we need it, but what if its not there, we depend on others to supply is with the things we need, very few of us are actually completely fully self sufficient, and even if we were, we'd still be depending on the earth, the environment to get what we need. I dunno, I know that if I became pregnant, abortion would not be an option.
 
Upvote 0

draper

Perspicacious Poster
Jul 5, 2003
4,323
219
35
Toronto, Canada
✟28,134.00
Faith
Agnostic
Politics
CA-Others
Skaven said:
[qb]i personally think abortion is wrong! if you were to have sexual relations with someone with out using a condom or a form of protection then you should take the responsabilty for that child born or not. It is part of you..and I feel you kill it...you kill part of yourself.[/qb]

Now what if a condom and other preventative forms were used and someone still got pregnant?

I think that abortion should be someone's choice. I wouldn't recommend a woman get one but if a 10 year old is raped then I don't see how anyone could say that the 10 year old must be forced to give birth.

Also I think rape victims should not need to bear a child should they become pregnant.

Is the pro-life movement to out law abortions or convince people that they're immoral?
 
Upvote 0
Lol, I think abortion is murder no matter what, but what I'm looking more for is when do people Get their souls (thanks malaka) and what you would say to a person considering of getting an abortion, are you going to walk up to them and say "you get an abortion and you'll go to hell" or "abortion is murder." and what I'm also looking for is what you would say to a person who thinks that thinks it's biblical, thanks

God bless
 
Upvote 0

Knight

Knight of the Cross
Apr 11, 2002
3,395
117
51
Indiana
Visit site
✟4,472.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
draper said:
Now what if a condom and other preventative forms were used and someone still got pregnant?

One of the "risks' of sex is pregnancy. There is no contraceptive that is 100% effective. If you don't understand that then you shouldn't be having sex.


Is the pro-life movement to out law abortions or convince people that they're immoral?

I'd say that the Pro-life movement is out to convince people that abortion is wrong.
 
Upvote 0

Vylo

Stick with the King!
Aug 3, 2003
24,768
7,823
44
New Jersey
✟212,869.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
Mentally retarded people do not develop into full independent human beings, fetuses (in most cases) do. Parasites, cancer etc. also do not develop into human beings, I believe there is a distinction there that should not be brushed off as trivial.
 
Upvote 0

ZiSunka

It means 'yellow dog'
Jan 16, 2002
17,006
284
✟46,267.00
Faith
Christian
HOTTEST DIGGEDY DOG EVER said:
hey people,

Just signed up today, anyways what does everyone think about abortion? I've been taught that "fetuses" don't have a soul until they are born, until they can breathe, and it's biblical, also that babies are parasites (that means we should kill the mentally retarded too)
Thanks your bro in christ

Who taught you that and where did they get their information from?

Were you a parasite when you were in your mother's womb? Will your children be parasites while they are gestating? If children are parasites, at what point to they become loved little humans, at birth, when they take their first breath, or when they graduate from college?
 
Upvote 0

ZiSunka

It means 'yellow dog'
Jan 16, 2002
17,006
284
✟46,267.00
Faith
Christian
draper said:
Now what if a condom and other preventative forms were used and someone still got pregnant?

The time to choose is before you have sex, not after you conceive. If you are not ready to raise a family, you ought not have sex, since reproduction is the biological purpose of sex. It's like saying, "I want to crash my car into a wall at 60 miles per hour because it's fun, but I don't want to die. If I die, it's not my fault, it's the car's fault for not protecting me better."
 
Upvote 0

Knight

Knight of the Cross
Apr 11, 2002
3,395
117
51
Indiana
Visit site
✟4,472.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
lambslove said:
The time to choose is before you have sex, not after you conceive. If you are not ready to raise a family, you ought not have sex, since reproduction is the biological purpose of sex. It's like saying, "I want to crash my car into a wall at 60 miles per hour because it's fun, but I don't want to die. If I die, it's not my fault, it's the car's fault for not protecting me better."

Good analogy. Mind if I steal it sometime?
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.