Abortion

[Libby1]

msjones21. Do you work in the 'medical' field?

Libby1

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

msjones21. Do you work in the 'medical' field?

Libby1

I do. I am an OB nurse, at that.

 

[Arturis]

Abortion is wrong because it goes against nature. It is scientifically proven that the fetus from the moment of conception is not the woman’s body because it has a unique genetics structure, and therefore not the right of the woman to choose to end a life because it is not her life to choose.

The only time an abortion would be legitimate is if the pregnancy will jeopardize the life of the woman. Other than that, nature has its own ways to tell whether the fetus is sustainable and “viable”...its called a miscarriage.

 

[jazzbird]

It's impossible to use abortion as a means of birth control. Most women who have an abortion never have subsequent ones. If your birth control fails or if you do engage in unprotected sex (yes, it does happen) and can't get the morning after pill (a very common problem) then I see no reason why she shouldn't be allowed to have an abortion.

This is incorrect information. Almost 50% of abortions are performed on women who have previously had one, or more.

The repeat abortion rate in the U.S. has risen rapidly since Roe v. Wade was decided in 1973. In 1973 it was estimated that only about 12% of the induced abortions were repeat abortions. By 1979 the national repeat rate had risen to 29.4% and by 1983 it had reached 38.8%. In 1987 the Alan Guttmacher Institute took a survey of 9480 women at approximately 100 abortion clinics throughout the U.S. and found that 42.9% of the women said they were having repeat abortions. 26.9% were having a second abortion; 10.7% were having a third abortion; and 5.3% were having a fourth abortion or more. (Henshaw 1987, 1988)

Based upon these figures and also extrapolating the fourth abortion or more category to more precise figures based upon state health department reports of repeat abortions, it is estimated that there were about 643,500 repeat abortions in the U.S. in 1987 out of a total of 1.5 million abortions. Of these 403,500 women had a second abortion; 160,500 had a third abortion; 53,250 had a fourth abortion; 17,500 had a fifth abortion; 4400 had a sixth abortion and 4400 had a seventh or higher abortion.

Almost half of the women undergoing an abortion - - 46% - - have already had at least one previous abortion,' a percentage which has tripled since 1974. In 1983, 39% of abortion patients reported having 1, 2, 3, or more abortions; in 1974 the percentage was 15. (Facts in Brief, Alan Guttmacher Institute, September 1995.)

http://www.lifeissues.net/writers/air/air_vol2no3_1989.html#rar
http://www.frtl.org/abortion/abortion statistics paint a grim.html

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

I'm sorry but that is false. At 10-12 weeks into gestation the embryo is only 1"-2" in length. A 1" embryo could not grasp the finger of a surgeon. Not to mention, embryos cannot feel pain nor are they aware of their surroundings. A newborn baby's hands are so tiny at birth they can barely grasp an adult finger. A fetus that could grab a finger during surgery on the uterus would have to be around 30-34 weeks into the gestation period.

msjones21, please note the following website:
http://www.fetal-surgery.com/fs-pics.htm

Abortion IS used many times for a means of birth control, and 97%-98% of all abortion cases are done because "the woman has the right to decide" I think most people forget that the mom has feelings, also. I have seen many women that have had abortions, and its very painful for them. Most women feel as if they have made bad choices, and were lied to about what really is going on. The reason the baby is not called a baby is because it takes away from the humanity of the baby...its much easier to think of the child as a foreign object, as you are destroying their life.

By the same token, all of us should be doing our part in supporting these moms that choose not to abort. I don't mean just with money, but love, and concern. Help get mom to the doc, surprise her with a home cooked meal, get her something special from the store, babysit, so she can get out sometimes. If you can adopt-ADOPT! It should not matter what sex or color the baby is. When you hold that little child believe me, it won't matter. If you can't adopt, be a foster parent. It amazes me the people in our society with huge homes, a large income, and they don't want help with the homeless children here-but they will sent $30-$60+ a month to help some child in Africa. (not that that is wrong, just remember the children here, too!)We do have children here, too. Or, find a non-profit that deals with moms and children, and give. Its tax deductable in most cases.

Love-n-Blessings
dee

 

[transientlife]

A lot of those people in big huge homes would rather spend the $30-$60 a month on manicures and hair care.

 

[Libby1]

Quote from dede10 "...The reason the baby is not called a baby is because it takes away from the humanity of the baby...its much easier to think of the child as a foreign object, as you are destroying their life..."

So very true. Makes it extremely easy to 'remove' what is considered to be 'offensive' material.

Pleased to meet you dede10

 

[WiccanHeart]

In 1973 the U.S. supreme court ruled that a unborn fetus is not a person.
Therefore abortion would not be commiting murder and is a way to respect the choice of a womens rights.

How arrogant are the people in the supreme court to determine whether or not an unborn BABY is a person or not?

Even though I am not Christian I will quote the commandment "Thou shall not kill." its pretty fundamental and follows "an it harm none, do what thou wilt."

To me abortion = murder. Why in the world would anyone want to get rid of something they created? You aren't ready for a baby? Why did you have sex then? You used a condom? Well, they break, they are not 100% effective.

 

[flicka]

You aren't ready for a baby? Why did you have sex then? You used a condom? Well, they break, they are not 100% effective.

Most people have sex for reasons other than 'baby making'...something you may find out someday

As for condoms, you are correct. Why don't you get to work on finding a solution rather that sitting in judgement of people who suffer from 'condom malfunction'?

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

Most people have sex for reasons other than 'baby making'...something you may find out someday

As for condoms, you are correct. Why don't you get to work on finding a solution rather that sitting in judgement of people who suffer from 'condom malfunction'?

The solution is much easier than you seem to let on. It's called self control-and self respect. Learning responsibility for your own actions, would be good. Also, a healthy respect for life.

Love-n-Blessings
dee

 

[flicka]

The solution is much easier than you seem to let on. It's called self control-and self respect. Learning responsibility for your own actions, would be good. Also, a healthy respect for life.

Love-n-Blessings
dee

I don't need self control to have sex with my husband but I don't necessarily want a baby every year either. Don't forget, us married gals have sex too! You can't use that argument on us!

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

I don't need self control to have sex with my husband but I don't necessarily want a baby every year either. Don't forget, us married gals have sex too! You can't use that argument on us!

So, you would think it ok to abort-you & your husband?

 

[Libby1]

quote from flicka "... don't need self control to have sex with my husband but I don't necessarily want a baby every year either..."

Is birth control not in the equation?

I too ask the question you feel it okay then to abort you? or your hubby? your mother? your father?

Libby1

 

[flicka]

Of course BC is in the equation...I think you know I'm talking about BC failure here, something that can happen whether you are married or not. I just get the feeling everyone assumes all unexpected pregnancies are a result of young woman sleeping with men left and right and not worrying about the consequences, and that it not the case.

And FYI, both my husband and I are pro choice. Sorry I can't provide you with something more titillating than that but my personal life isn't the issue and has no relevance to this debate.

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

Of course BC is in the equation...I think you know I'm talking about BC failure here, something that can happen whether you are married or not. I just get the feeling everyone assumes all unexpected pregnancies are a result of young woman sleeping with men left and right and not worrying about the consequences, and that it not the case.

And FYI, both my husband and I are pro choice. Sorry I can't provide you with something more titillating than that but my personal life isn't the issue and has no relevance to this debate.

Birth control is 99.8% effective when used correctly. Again, most women, after having an abortion, are very heartbroken. The true aspects of abortion are not explained, and this is something they live with for the rest of their lives.

Love-n-Blessings
dee

 

[flicka]

I understand the effectiveness of BC and many couples who use it do NOT do so correctly, unfortunately that is a fact of life...

Abortion can't be any fun, and I'm sure some women do regret it, but some don't. I'm going to give women the benifit of the doubt and let them make their own decisions tho.

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

Then the abortion clinics should educate their clients, before allowing an abortion. Again, the baby is never called a baby in an abortion clinic. The baby is a "mass" or a "foreign object", but never a baby.

In our "advanced" society, with the onset of ultrasounds, and monitors, we can see soooo much. Now we just destroy what we no longer want, and its even legal. What greater love than to have the child, and give him up for adoption?

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

'Dear Mom,
Gosh, can you believe it's 2023 already? I'm still writing "22" on nearly everything. Seems like just yesterday I was sitting in first grade celebrating the new millennium. I know we haven't really chatted since Christmas. Sorry. Anyway, I have some difficult news, and I really did not want to call and talk face-to-face. Ted's had a promotion and I should be up for a hefty raise this year if I can keep up those crazy hours. Yes, we're still struggling with the bills. Michael's been "okay" at Kindergarten although he complains about going. But then, he wasn't happy about daycare either, so what can I do? He's been a real problem, Mom. He's a good kid, but quite honestly, he's an unfair burden in our lives at this time. Ted and I have talked this through and through and finally made a choice. Plenty of other families have made it and are much better off as a result. Our pastor is supportive and says hard decisions are necessary. The family is a "system" and the demands of one member shouldn't be allowed to ruin the whole.
He told us to be prayerful, consider all the factors, and do what is right to make the family work.

He says that even though he wouldn't probably do it himself, the decision is really ours. He was kind enough to refer us to a children's clinic near here, so at least that part's easy.

I'm not an uncaring mother. I do feel sorry for the little guy. I think he heard Ted and me talking about "it" the other night. I turned around and saw him standing at the bottom step in his PJ's with the little bear you gave him under his arm and his eyes sort of welling up. Mom, the way he looked at me just about broke my heart. But I honestly believe this is better for Michael too. It's not fair to force him to live in a family that can't give him the time and attention he deserves. And please don't give me the kind of grief Grandma gave you over your abortions. It is the same thing, you know. We've told him he's just going in for a vaccination. Anyway, they say it is painless. I guess it's just as well you haven't seen that much of him.

Love to you and Dad,

Jane.

I found this in another forum.....

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

http://news.scotsman.com/uk.cfm?id=93982004


http://www.usccb.org/prolife/issues/pba/pbaban.htm

A couple more interesting places.

 

[flicka]

I think you should have the last word dede10...because you always seem to on the subject of abortion...opps! I guess by posting this you will have to post again. sorry