This forum is not restricted to "issues" ... but more for the sharing of information, questioning, discussing, and fellowship.
Thankful the forum is not restricted to "issues" (although I am not certain as to where it was said that it was) - as there are many threads dedicated to sharing information/fellowship and discussion.
Nonetheless, there are a lot of times when non-issues are made into crisis issues when they really are not that deep or worth investing time/energy into since they're made to be larger than they really are - and thus, there's LESS focus on issues based in fellowship or learning (including many you've attempted to make) and more in the realm of arguing who does or doesn't fit. And the latter tends to overshadow the former.
we get people with issues who want to argue with everyone else who have issues.
Sadly...it'd be the case that one would have to say you'd be among those people with issues wanting to argue with everyone else who has issues - and continuing the bickering without necessity.
In regards to what you erroneously claimed elsewhere:
EG started out with a cross until he got in trouble for posting in MJ. Then low and behold he changed it to the scroll. But now he conveniently has no icon at all. That way he can do what he does best, play the field and jump to either Christianity or Messianic Judaism depending on who he wants to impress. Frankly I find that more damaging. I'm surprised no one has called him on it. But he isn't one to take criticism well.
There are times when one can spread a misconception and be sincere on it - and in those events, one may be mistaken but graciousness/mercy are a must. On the same token, in times where one does things intentionally - without evidence or basis - because they do not know how to interact with others they don't like without attempt at defaming them however possible, that'll always be an issue that is beneath us as men/women of the Lord.
This is noted in light of how you have seemed to talk often on others needing to take "criticism" - and yet have ignored where you didn't listen to your own advice...or liked being critically examined for when/where you didn't match up with what you said because the accusation was more so a matter of appeal to ridicule rather than really addressing an issue (Proverbs 18:13, Proverbs 19:2, etc.)....and there've already been several scenarios where it seemed apparent you were making false scenarios anytime I mentioned something simply because I said it - with others pointing out the same as being an issue (more in #
14 , #
19 , #
29 , #
61 #
68 #
85 #
83 ,
126 , #
129, #
292 and#
297 amongst others).
You claimed of myself "he can do what he does best, play the field and jump to either Christianity or Messianic Judaism depending on who he wants to impress" - yet on what basis did the claim have at any point?
Your comment assumes from the jump the erroneous ideology that to be within Messianic Judaism is opposite of Christianity - and that is something numerous Messianic Jews and Messianic Gentiles have addressed over the years since what's said in the MAJORITY of the movement is that Messianic Judaism is in connection with Christianity. Only for someone either against Christianity or not aware of what is said in most of Messianic Judaism today can it be the case that others noting how they're for Messianic Judaism (sub-set within Christianity) and Christianity is trying to "play the field".....but as that has already been covered before, it's one own choice whether or not to deal with that squarely - including covering EVERY Messianic Jew whom the same can be said of when it comes to them working with those in Messianic Jewish circles and Christianity. As it was not assumed of them they were "playing fields" - it is neither accurate NOR proper to assume I am when I directly follow their example.
On claiming to want to "impress others", I have to admit I find that humorous one would try to attempt claiming such - for I don't really care to impress anyone - be it yourself or anyone else - just as others do not care...and as such, have made plain where it is of no concern whether or not you agree with them when you (or anyone else) resorted to assuming the same. One only "plays the field" when pretending to be something they're not to a specific audience - and the bottom line is that I've be consistent regardless of audience. I have long noted to others in Orthodoxy where I was OO as well as Messianic - and the same applies here in this forum when sharing with other Messianic Jews/Gentiles where I identify with being OO (supportative of Eastern Christianity) alongside Messianic. One can see that as far back as December of 2011 in the thread
Real Curious about Paintings ( #
27 #
28 #
29 #
31 #
35 #
36 ) - when seeing where there was a cross-over discussion from the Orthodox forum that got brought up in the Messianic one (on the subject of icons/iconography and Mosaics in Jewish culture) - where I went back/forth - sharing here and there, with all knowing where I (as a Messianic) appreciated liturgical circles like Orthodoxy....and so did others like Contra.
Another instance was the thread from entitled
Messianic Judaism and Ethiopian Orthodoxy (as seen in #
24 from July of 2011) where it was shared plainly identification with Messianic Judaism AND Oriential Orthodoxy. One would have to chose to ignore what was said in order to assume there was not directness on where others stood. Many other threads besides that can be noted.
There has not been a time where any secrets were made on that at any point - except for anyone who chose to either NOT READ or skip over anything they disagree with.
The entire comment you made - in addition to being an attempt at personal commentary via mocking (against the CF Rules) was also based on several inaccuracies which others have addressed. That's either a matter of innocent oversight - or willful neglect of details for the sake of argument - and choosing to resort to partiality in assessments - something the Lord said plainly He never liked in the Law (
Deuteronomy 1:17,
Deuteronomy 16:19,
Proverbs 11:1,
Proverbs 20:23,
Micah 6:11,
James 3:16-18 ) - will never be Biblical.
Whenever one does an inaccurate presentation, it is a matter of spreading a falsehood - in the realm of
Three men make a tiger" ideology where something is accepted so long as others choose to repeat it enough to a lot of people - and if one does choose to spread falsehood intentionally (which is already a lack of real credible action on issues and within the realm of being petty/bickering), then there should be evidence of such to establish rather than trying to resort to claiming whatever one hopes to work - for I was already Messianic/attending a Messianic synagogue for years (since 2008)/had that directly on my "About Me" section - something numerous others (including other Messianics) noted. ...and that was done when I had a regular cross icon like Contra - and had no issue with it since the cross meant "Christian" and that with my Bio already showed were I identified with Christianity and Messianic Judaism. Contra and I had good dialogue when I didn't have the "Messianic" icon since he had the maturity to address where others were based on CONTENT - as seen in places like #
3 when he and I talked on Messianic culture from a Caribbean perspective back in 2010.
Other Messianics at places such as CARM are well aware of where I was involved in the Messianic Jewish movement since 08 - as seen on their forums and which others, from Shimshon to Rachael Rachel (a newbie I invited over from there) and several others who went between forums - and it's no problem giving reference.
I also noted directly (when I had the "Christian" cross icon) my involvement at my Messianic fellowship as early as February 2010 in threads such as
"Hazakim"--2 Jewish Kats Briding The Gaps between the Hebraic, Holiness and Hip Hop?. In 2009, in finding out there was a 'Messianic' icon, I decided to take that up after being encouraged by others since I was not aware that one of the ways one was identified as a Messianic in the forum was by a "Messianic" icon. It seemed unnecessary at the time since I already shared from a Messianic perspective for years and other Messianic Jews/Gentiles did not have an issue....in addition to the fact that many Messianic Jews did not have a Messianic icon but shared with me freely from what they experienced in the Messianic world/Jewish experience - and I already have the emails/PMs on the issue for ANYONE (in regards to the average lurker/reader) who wishes to see in-depth what was said. I also addressed the issue before in places such as #
9 when it came to others erroneously claiming I wasn't "Messianic" just like they did to those who were Jewish and yet not rocking a Messianic icon - silly as that is..
But since adopting the Messianic icon, my bio/"About Me" section has remained consistent - and at NO point was it ever the case where I identified as being non-Messianic. Anyone argued otherwise is a falsehood - and it'll continue to be called out as such so long as it continues alongside the agenda.
As it is, it's rather foolish for anyone to raise fuss over an icon since (As said before)
my SIGNATURE - at the end of every post - and my BIO has had directly "Messianic" in it just as the icon - and my BIO has had "Oriential Orthodox" as well for ages. Choosing to make my icon into an Oriential Orthodox one doesn't change where I remained Messianic - and arguing one "plays the field" for doing so is no more logical than one arguing a Jewish believer like Contra/others is "playing the field" because he chose to say he was "Messianic" in his title but showed icon where he had CHURCH affiliation (i.e. Anglican, then Lutheran..then regular CHRISTIAN).
If really wishing to be consistent on the matter, you would have dealt with him as well as other Messianic Jews/Messianic Gentiles - but instead, you chose to argue selectively...and thus, show a hermeneutic akin to cherry-picking based on what you do or don't want to deal with. Truthfully, it doesn't make you look good in the slightest since you should be above that as a believer in Christ.
Frankly, when using selective argumentation, it's more damaging to the Body than many things since it shows a willingness to engage in partiality rather than fair judgment of others.
Again, others have already noted what you (or anyone else choosing to cry over nothing) have done to be an issue - and prayerfully you can receive the correction on the matter rather than trying to deflect it. For as said before, spreading falsehood is a sin (Proverbs 6) - and it'd behoove you to learn not to do so simply because you have an agenda or beef against anyone whom you disagree with in the Messianic movement.
To engage in such doesn't show anything except a desire to engage in politics (a form of "playing the field" rather than serious dialogue when spinning things ) - and it shows nothing more than evidence that others will always have issue with Messianics who consistently identify with Messianic Jewish culture and the Church....particularly when those having issue have made plain that they want no association with the Church - counter to what's said in the rest of the Messianic movement
Prayerfully, the bickering can cease - but till then, blessings on you. Shalom ...
