A question about divorce

[Svt4Him]

Divorce is wrong, except under very specific circumstances. Contrary to what many like to say, the issue is that simple.

However, gluttony is also wrong, so is pride, hatred, unjust anger, envy... Last time I checked most of us do quite a few of those on a daily basis, or a weekly basis.

Sin is bad, we should try to avoid it. However a sin, even many sins, is not going to condemn you to hell. If you accept sin, and justify sin, that might lead you down the path to hell.

It is not the church's job to tell people.. its ok, go ahead and sin if you really need to. It is the church's job to tell people, you sinned, but God will make you new. You may sin over and over, but God will make you new.. So keep fighting, keep getting up, keep striving and seeking after righteousness, pray for it, desire it, and God will make you new. Never give up.

Actually it really isn't that simple, since you then open up the Bible to error. For instance, why did Paul, who was taught by Jesus, then say it was ok if an unbeliever left? If Jesus' statement was absolute, Paul was wrong which then means we can pretty much write off a lot of the Bible. Sorry, but I never think misunderstanding the Bible should be dismissed under the guise of being easy.

Who married Adam and Eve? Did they say vows and exchanged rings or was their marriage ordained by their physical devotion to one and another. If this is not the case, then Adam and Eve lived in sin and God caused them to be in sin which we all know is impossible. So the only conclusion is that marriage is not a ceremony but a physical union between man and woman.

Who married Adam and Eve? Well, since God was the only one around, I'd say He did. Pretty sure of it actually. But that is not relevant to the discussion. Obey the laws of the land. Physical union is not marriage, never has been.

 

[jrlinz]

Fornication

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The origin of the word derives from Latin. The word fornix means "an archway" or "vault" (in Rome, prostitutes could be solicited there). More directly, fornicatio means "of the archway"; thus a euphemism for prostitution.

fornicate Averb1 fornicate
have sex without being married Category Tree: connect; link; tie; link up ╚join; conjoin ╚copulate; mate; pair; couple ╚roll in the hay; love; make out; make love; sleep with; get laid; have sex; know; do it; be intimate; have intercourse; have it away; have it off; screw; [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth]; jazz; eff; hump; lie with; bed; have a go at it; bang; get it on; bonk ╚fornicate WordReference.com



Main Entry: for·ni·ca·tion
Pronunciation: "for-n&-'kA-sh&n
Function: noun
: consensual sexual intercourse between two persons not married to each other --

Merriam Webster Dictionary

 

[Simon_Templar]

Actually it really isn't that simple, since you then open up the Bible to error. For instance, why did Paul, who was taught by Jesus, then say it was ok if an unbeliever left? If Jesus' statement was absolute, Paul was wrong which then means we can pretty much write off a lot of the Bible. Sorry, but I never think misunderstanding the Bible should be dismissed under the guise of being easy.



Who married Adam and Eve? Well, since God was the only one around, I'd say He did. Pretty sure of it actually. But that is not relevant to the discussion. Obey the laws of the land. Physical union is not marriage, never has been.

actually Svt, I didn't open the bible up to error, YOUR understanding of my words, doesn't mesh with YOUR understanding of scripture.

First off, the statement "divorce is wrong except under very specific circumstances" does not mean that there are NO circumstances under which divorce is allowable.

There are clear circumstances under which divorce is ALLOWABLE, infact, God even commanded the Israelites to divorce their foreign wives when they had married in defiance of God's commands.

The statement means that divorce is generally wrong, but there are excepted instances in which God allows it.
However, people frequently use those few exceptions as an excuse to justify any divorce. The fact that they do this is worse than the fact that there was a divorce in the first place.

 

[Svt4Him]

actually Svt, I didn't open the bible up to error, YOUR understanding of my words, doesn't mesh with YOUR understanding of scripture.

First off, the statement "divorce is wrong except under very specific circumstances" does not mean that there are NO circumstances under which divorce is allowable.

There are clear circumstances under which divorce is ALLOWABLE, infact, God even commanded the Israelites to divorce their foreign wives when they had married in defiance of God's commands.

The statement means that divorce is generally wrong, but there are excepted instances in which God allows it.
However, people frequently use those few exceptions as an excuse to justify any divorce. The fact that they do this is worse than the fact that there was a divorce in the first place.

Actually God commanded His people to put away their foreign wives. Very different when you read it in light of your understanding.

 

[JimB]

Actually God commanded His people to put away their foreign wives. Very different when you read it in light of your understanding.

Interesting … and true.

In Ezra Chapter 10, the people of Israel in repenting of their sin agreed to put away (divorce) their pagan wives, “Now therefore, let us make a covenant with our God to put away all these wives and those who have been born to them, according to the advice of my master and of those who tremble at the commandment of our God; and let it be done according to the law. . . . 18 And among the sons of the priests who had taken pagan wives the following were found of the sons of Jeshua the son of Jozadak, . . . . 19 And they gave their promise that they would put away their wives;and being guilty, they presented a ram of the flock as their trespass offering.” (vv.3, 18-19)</SPAN>

~Jim

And now let us pray for good luck.​

 

[NewSong]

Maybe in this thread someone should define what a marriage is in God's eyes before we start knocking divorcee's and remarriages... Just a suggestion...

 

[Hisgirl]

I love these threads. Reminds me of how I used to be....before I got divorced. Thank God I've taken off my robes of self-righteouness and tried to put on compassion. I've watched friend after friend go through divorces for all kinds of reasons, some biblical ,some not. And I just loved them through it. I sure wish folks had done the same for me when I walked down that path.

I instigated an unbiblical divorce. What were God's options at that point?

He could have
A. Killed me and brought me home
B. Killed me and taken away my salvation
C. Allowed me to live but removed any blessings
D. OR strangely enough....loved me despite myself

I have some good news!! He chose D.

He spoke to me and said "Let me love you". I figured He was wanting to kill me as I had so many acquaintances who believed as many of you do.

THEN, He blessed a company I started and I never wanted for a thing.

THEN, older women came into my life and repeated the same words, "Dana...God loves you and forgives you...let him bless you."

THEN, I was introduced to, and married a man who fulfilled all my dreams. A gifted prophetic woman said God told her to tell me He sent my husband to SHOW ME HOW MUCH HE LOVED ME.

THEN, God baptised me in the Holy Spirit totally out of the blue. I had never heard of such a thing and wasn't looking for it. In fact, had an almost stranger walk up to me and say God was commanding him to lay hands on me for this.

THEN, God used my hands to heal many people of various diseases. Many words of knowledges were shared. He even used me to lead a young lady to Him.

All you who are so convinced divorce is wrong are right. It is wrong and isn't God's desire for anyone. But, God can win with a pair of twos and turn any situation into a victory. He's about love and forgiveness.

Keep that in mind because you may find yourself walking down that path one day, quite unexpectedly.

 

[Raph]

Maybe in this thread someone should define what a marriage is in God's eyes before we start knocking divorcee's and remarriages... Just a suggestion...

Have you been reading the whole thread?

The Bible seems to say that sex is the bond of marriage; therefore, divorce is the parting of this sexual relationship.

Did not know that the point of the thread was to knock divorcee's or remarriages, I thought we were discussing scripture.

.

 

[heron]

why did Paul, who was taught by Jesus, then say it was ok if an unbeliever left?

Um... I shouldn't distract the discussion with a picky thing, but Paul had a revelation, not years of solid training
with Jesus. Paul was trained in depth in Jewish law.

Reminds me of how I used to be....before I got divorced.

Really! I have noticed one thing though -- when friends go through a divorce, it becomes a consuming entity that ravages the whole family and finances. But that destruction easily goes on within marriages, too -- without the outside forces of lawyers etc.

 

[heron]

Have you been reading the whole thread?

The Bible seems to say that sex is the bond of marriage; therefore, divorce is the parting of this sexual relationship.

Everyone did not agree with that definition... (have you been reading....)

 

[jrlinz]

Have you been reading the whole thread?

The Bible seems to say that sex is the bond of marriage; therefore, divorce is the parting of this sexual relationship.

Did not know that the point of the thread was to knock divorcee's or remarriages, I thought we were discussing scripture.

.

Out of thousands of Christians I know, none of them that I am aware of hold this view, and very many I know hold a different view. Also, in mainstream Christianity, This is not to my knowledge what is believed, taught. Is this some small, secretive cult that teaches this doctrine?

 

[Raph]

I love these threads. Reminds me of how I used to be....before I got divorced. Thank God I've taken off my robes of self-righteouness and tried to put on compassion. I've watched friend after friend go through divorces for all kinds of reasons, some biblical ,some not. And I just loved them through it. I sure wish folks had done the same for me when I walked down that path.

Actually I was hoping someone could correct (through scripture) my scriptural references on the subject because I would like to marry and have a family in good conscience.

God's grace is another thread.

 

[Raph]

Out of thousands of Christians I know, none of them that I am aware of hold this view, and very many I know hold a different view. Also, in mainstream Christianity, This is not to my knowledge what is believed, taught. Is this some small, secretive cult that teaches this doctrine?

No secretive cult here, only a guy reading his Bible!

Not interested in what the mainstream "thinks" only it what the Bible says. Looking for the narrow gate.


.

 

[jrlinz]

No secretive cult here, only a guy reading his Bible!

Not interested in what the mainstream "thinks" only it what the Bible says. Looking for the narrow gate.


.

You did imply the concensus in the thread was that sex was the bond of marriage. I do not believe that statement is truth, but what about a much wider concensus? Why would that not be better than a small population, such as this thread, in determining concensus, if that is what you want to do?

 

[Hisgirl]

Actually I was hoping someone could correct (through scripture) my scriptural references on the subject because I would like to marry and have a family in good conscience.

God's grace is another thread.

If you want to remarry, then share that with God and ask Him that if He is ok with it, to please send you a wonderful, God-fearing wife. And ask Him to confirm this all to you. God is bigger than the Bible and our understanding of the passages.

 

[Yitzchak]

I love these threads. Reminds me of how I used to be....before I got divorced. Thank God I've taken off my robes of self-righteouness and tried to put on compassion. I've watched friend after friend go through divorces for all kinds of reasons, some biblical ,some not. And I just loved them through it. I sure wish folks had done the same for me when I walked down that path.

I instigated an unbiblical divorce. What were God's options at that point?

He could have
A. Killed me and brought me home
B. Killed me and taken away my salvation
C. Allowed me to live but removed any blessings
D. OR strangely enough....loved me despite myself

I have some good news!! He chose D.

He spoke to me and said "Let me love you". I figured He was wanting to kill me as I had so many acquaintances who believed as many of you do.

THEN, He blessed a company I started and I never wanted for a thing.

THEN, older women came into my life and repeated the same words, "Dana...God loves you and forgives you...let him bless you."

THEN, I was introduced to, and married a man who fulfilled all my dreams. A gifted prophetic woman said God told her to tell me He sent my husband to SHOW ME HOW MUCH HE LOVED ME.

THEN, God baptised me in the Holy Spirit totally out of the blue. I had never heard of such a thing and wasn't looking for it. In fact, had an almost stranger walk up to me and say God was commanding him to lay hands on me for this.

THEN, God used my hands to heal many people of various diseases. Many words of knowledges were shared. He even used me to lead a young lady to Him.

All you who are so convinced divorce is wrong are right. It is wrong and isn't God's desire for anyone. But, God can win with a pair of twos and turn any situation into a victory. He's about love and forgiveness.

Keep that in mind because you may find yourself walking down that path one day, quite unexpectedly.

This is such a difficult lesson for us to learn. I have been trying to get this sentiment accross many times when this subject comes up.

I stand upon the grace of God and His mercy and not upon a list of rules that I have kept.

There are exceptions even to God's rules. Oh , how this statement messes with people's hearts and minds. It really comes down to a control issue. But we all struggle trying to pin God down so we can figure out the rules and come out on the good side of things. Thinking that we are motivated by a zealousness for God's glory and righteouness just like my earthly family so often does(see we are jews).

[BIBLE]Romans 9:8-16[/BIBLE]

We so often deceive ourselves that we are so sincere in our pursuit of God. That we are keeping His word in all things. That is how I would like it to be. But all too often God reveals to me how much I hold back. How much I select what I want to follow and ignore what I don't

I too have experienced this thing called grace and found that it is indeed God's goodness that leads me to repentance.

[BIBLE]Romans 2:1-4[/BIBLE]

It always somehow ends up feeling like we are not really judging although , of course we are. We say , no this is different because I am just standing up for the bible and what is right. if God wanted to be really harsh , he would come to us and expose all of our sinfulness and how we do the same things that we are judging but just with different details.

What strange thing this is that the church is filled with men who have given into inappropriate content but now judge adulterers as worthy of hell. I am hard pressed to find a man out there who has not at some point in his life struggled with lustful thoughts or inappropriate content. Yet somehow it is always in the past or not the same thing because we have truelly repented or at least we did not mean to do it or don't really condone it. The multi billion dollar inappropriate content industry and Hollywood with their soft inappropriate content that is not called inappropriate content don't really care. They just want what works to make money. Newsflash , their fortune came from both people inside and outside of the church.

I am not justifing sin here. It is not mine to justify or not justify. That is God's. But the fact remains that we do end up sinning whether we justify it or preach against it. That is 100% of us. We all sin. Maybe for me it is not inappropriate content. Or even soft inappropriate content or even lustful thoughts. Maybe it is anger and unforgiveness or greediness and idolatry or witchcraft that comes with a rebellious and controling spirit. if we want an honest appraisel , lets ask our children or our ex's and not the church people who see only our sunday best.

We religious people have our distinctions. We say we sin but not intentionally or as a lifestyle. Those people do it on purpose so they deserve judgment and not mercy.

What do we suppose the root of adultery is ? Do we really think that that root does not exist in us and manifest in some area of our life ?

There. Done with my sermonette.....

 

[Yitzchak]

Actually I was hoping someone could correct (through scripture) my scriptural references on the subject because I would like to marry and have a family in good conscience.

God's grace is another thread.

If I could paraphrase this I would say you want to know what is the right thing to do in a given situation.

There are plenty of experts on that subject both amongst the jews and Christians. I can likely find lots of rules and guidelines. Lots of scriptures.

But there is no seperating grace from things if you really want a good conscience. That only comes through grace. We cannot understand what the right thing is in our sinful state outside of grace

 

[Yitzchak]

Actually I was hoping someone could correct (through scripture) my scriptural references on the subject because I would like to marry and have a family in good conscience.

God's grace is another thread.

Here then is your answer.

[BIBLE]Mark 10:2-12[/BIBLE]

Not any more complicated than that. You want God's perfect will and what is right. Marry one woman and stay with her until death parts you. That is what the bible teaches.

If that goes wrong for whatever reason and you find yourself divorced , then you will have to get into messy side issues like grace and God's plan B's.

If you stick with plan A listed first then it is really pretty simple.

Just ask a jew. We've been trying to figure this one out for a few thousand years now. God's will and ways are not complicated and don't require 613 laws like we jews came up with. Marriage....Get married to one woman and stay married...end of subject. Stealing...Don't do it ever either from God or from man. End of subject. Adultery ...don't do it either in your mind or in action ever. End of subject.

The reason these threads are so long and complicated is not because God's ways are complicated or His will so hard to figure on this matter. It is because we sooner or later don't follow plan A and so we look fro ways to get back on track. That , my friend , is where grace comes into the subject.

 

[Yitzchak]

By the way, if I sound harsh , please don't take it to heart. I am passionate about the subject and not offended at anyone's posts on here. This is a fun and honest discussion and I enjoy it.

 

[Raph]

By the way, if I sound harsh , please don't take it to heart. I am passionate about the subject and not offended at anyone's posts on here. This is a fun and honest discussion and I enjoy it.

Good ... very good!

I don't think you are being harsh, I want an honest discussion on the subject.

I believe marriage in not a ceremony but a sexual union between a man and a woman.

If I have never married but have had multiple partners but repented, should I now get married to a woman who is a virgin. In God's eyes, am I not still married to those other women? If I marry this wonderful God-fearing woman, am I not defiling her?

.