A-Fib

[Akita Suggagaki]

I can't help but notice a lot more people seem to have A-Fib these days.

The incidence and prevalence of AF are increasing globally. Based on data from the FHS (Framingham Heart Study), the prevalence of AF increased 3-fold over the last 50 years

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.120.316340

Risk factors for AFib include4,5

• Advancing age
• High blood pressure
• Obesity
• European ancestry
• Diabetes
• Heart failure
• Ischemic heart disease
• Hyperthyroidism
• Chronic kidney disease
• Moderate to heavy alcohol use
• Smoking
• Enlargement of the chambers on the left side of the heart

Atrial Fibrillation | cdc.gov

Learn about atrial fibrillation, often called AFib or AF, the most common type of treated heart arrhythmia.

www.cdc.gov

Our analyses suggest that atrial fibrillation incidence and prevalence have increased over the last 20 years and will continue to increase over the next 30 years, especially in countries with middle socio-demographic index, becoming one of the largest epidemics and public health challenges.

Global epidemiology of atrial fibrillation: An increasing epidemic and public health challenge - PubMed

Our analyses suggest that atrial fibrillation incidence and prevalence have increased over the last 20 years and will continue to increase over the next 30 years, especially in countries with middle socio-demographic index, becoming one of the largest epidemics and public health challenges.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[FireDragon76]

A-fib seems to occur mostly among those who never exercise, as well as those who engage in extreme amounts of exercise.

Aging, competitive endurance athletes, for instance, are more prone to getting atrial fibrilation. Intense exercise while you are ill is thought to be a big culprit. Alot of these athletes will train through a cold or flu.

Most exercise people need to do should be relatively low intensity, like walking or jogging, not running. Running or high intensity training should just be a small part of a person's total physical activity, even for endurance athletes. If you can't hold a conversation while you are exercising, then the exercise is too intense.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

A cardiologist told me that now we save so many people form blockage issues they survive longer to get A-Fib

 

[FireDragon76]

A cardiologist told me that now we save so many people form blockage issues they survive longer to get A-Fib

It does seem common in older people now days. A surprising number of older women at our church have a-fib.

A sedentary lifestyle is a big risk factor for more severe a-fib.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I can't help but notice a lot more people seem to have A-Fib these days.

The incidence and prevalence of AF are increasing globally. Based on data from the FHS (Framingham Heart Study), the prevalence of AF increased 3-fold over the last 50 years

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.120.316340

Risk factors for AFib include4,5

• Advancing age
• High blood pressure
• Obesity
• European ancestry
• Diabetes
• Heart failure
• Ischemic heart disease
• Hyperthyroidism
• Chronic kidney disease
• Moderate to heavy alcohol use
• Smoking
• Enlargement of the chambers on the left side of the heart

Atrial Fibrillation | cdc.gov

Learn about atrial fibrillation, often called AFib or AF, the most common type of treated heart arrhythmia.

www.cdc.gov

Our analyses suggest that atrial fibrillation incidence and prevalence have increased over the last 20 years and will continue to increase over the next 30 years, especially in countries with middle socio-demographic index, becoming one of the largest epidemics and public health challenges.

Global epidemiology of atrial fibrillation: An increasing epidemic and public health challenge - PubMed

Our analyses suggest that atrial fibrillation incidence and prevalence have increased over the last 20 years and will continue to increase over the next 30 years, especially in countries with middle socio-demographic index, becoming one of the largest epidemics and public health challenges.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I had a-fib a few years ago. One factor is simply people are living longer, courtesy of medications and modern medicine. I'm 72.

 

[timewerx]

A-fib seems to occur mostly among those who never exercise, as well as those who engage in extreme amounts of exercise.

Aging, competitive endurance athletes, for instance, are more prone to getting atrial fibrilation. Intense exercise while you are ill is thought to be a big culprit. Alot of these athletes will train through a cold or flu.

Most exercise people need to do should be relatively low intensity, like walking or jogging, not running. Running or high intensity training should just be a small part of a person's total physical activity, even for endurance athletes. If you can't hold a conversation while you are exercising, then the exercise is too intense.

The overall total mortality rate with all risk factors (including complications of aging, cancer, and CVD, not just AF) for the "high intensity" endurance exercise group is still lowest compared to sedentary, light intensity, and medium intensity exercise group despite the increased risk of AF for "high intensity" group.

Also, athlete AF does not conform to the same risk pattern of AF with sedentary individuals.

Thus, more recent studies are not recommending reducing exercise volume for athletes or anyone who have high exercise volumes despite the knowledge of increased AF risk.

Ironically if you just want to reduce AF risk then exercise less. But if you want to reduce all mortality rate factors and live longer, then you should still exercise more. I'd go with the latter. The only thing to avoid is over-training, supplements not required by your doctor, and eating frequently.

The only risk to running is over-working and even ruining your joints but there are solutions around that problems if you still have good joints.

Atrial Fibrillation (AF) in Endurance Athletes: a Complicated Affair

A complex relationship exists between exercise and atrial fibrillation (AF). Moderate exercise reduces AF risk whereas intense strenuous exercise has been shown to increase AF burden. It remains unclear at which point exercise may become detrimental. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[FireDragon76]

The overall total mortality rate with all risk factors (including complications of aging, cancer, and CVD, not just AF) for the "high intensity" endurance exercise group is still lowest compared to sedentary, light intensity, and medium intensity exercise group despite the increased risk of AF for "high intensity" group.

Also, athlete AF does not conform to the same risk pattern of AF with sedentary individuals.

Thus, more recent studies are not recommending reducing exercise volume for athletes or anyone who have high exercise volumes despite the knowledge of increased AF risk.

Ironically if you just want to reduce AF risk then exercise less. But if you want to reduce all mortality rate factors and live longer, then you should still exercise more. I'd go with the latter. The only thing to avoid is over-training, supplements not required by your doctor, and eating frequently.

The only risk to running is over-working and even ruining your joints but there are solutions around that problems if you still have good joints.

Atrial Fibrillation (AF) in Endurance Athletes: a Complicated Affair

A complex relationship exists between exercise and atrial fibrillation (AF). Moderate exercise reduces AF risk whereas intense strenuous exercise has been shown to increase AF burden. It remains unclear at which point exercise may become detrimental. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Do Marathon runners and triathletes actually live longer than those that engage in less arduous forms of physical activity, like walking? It seems to me the evidence is far from clear cut. Keep in mind half of Americans are physically inactive, walking only a few thousand steps a day at most. Of course Marathon runners will live longer than a couch potato, but that doesn't mean endurance running is a good idea for the general population. Endurance running poses much more risks of physical injury, as well as depression of the immune system and potentially stress on the heart (measurable after a Marathon: most athletes running in long endurance events will have elevated levels of troponin, a protein associated with injury to the heart).

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.119.041627

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN1O222Y/

The general population would be much better served by engaging in lower intensity, steady-state cardiovascular exercise, like walking or jogging, to build up aerobic capacity.

 

[timewerx]

Do Marathon runners and triathletes actually live longer than those that engage in less arduous forms of physical activity, like walking? It seems to me the evidence is far from clear cut. Keep in mind half of Americans are physically inactive, walking only a few thousand steps a day at most. Of course Marathon runners will live longer than a couch potato, but that doesn't mean endurance running is a good idea for the general population. Endurance running poses much more risks of physical injury, as well as depression of the immune system and potentially stress on the heart (measurable after a Marathon: most athletes running in long endurance events will have elevated levels of troponin, a protein associated with injury to the heart).

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.119.041627

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN1O222Y/

The general population would be much better served by engaging in lower intensity, steady-state cardiovascular exercise, like walking or jogging, to build up aerobic capacity.

From your reuters link, it says potential damage of heart muscles is strongly linked to poor training leading to long endurance events.

Other things from your reuters link like heart fibrosis I also know to be caused by elevated/excess levels of cytokines (pro-inflammatory) in the blood which can also be triggered by long bouts of exercise.

Coincidentally, in my previous post, I mentioned about avoiding over-training. Having a good structured training should prevent over-training. I also mentioned about not eating frequently because frequent eating can worsen inflammatory response. On the other-hand, periodic or intermittent fasting will enhance anti-inflammatory response. Eat after exercising, not before, nor during because exercising will make you hungry (naturally). If you ate before exercise, you'll be eating again after exercise so you'll be adding to the frequency of eating

I did lots of research on the subject since last year.

I know many professional athletes develop health problems and this can be attributed to their frequent eating habit (that is probably part of their training or contract), high consumption of sugar or simple, very high glycemic carbs sponsor products, huge consumption of supplements/drugs also provided by their sponsors.

But since I'm not a professional / paid athlete, I don't have to gorge myself on sponsor products on a potentially unhealthy diet and unhealthy eating routines nor any performance-maximizing routines/supplements/drugs that may not be healthy in the long term. I'm free to eat (or not eat) and free to do what I know is healthy.

Sadly, even amateur/recreational athletes are fooled to consume the same sponsor products of their favorite teams. To look cool maybe, but I don't buy it. I'm not after appearances.

I have the opposite of heart problems. I used to have Angina and palpitations since childhood and hypertension recently but Praise the Lord. I don't have it anymore!

There's also evidence of increased apoptosis or accelerated cardiomyocyte turnover, not from actual heart damage.

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056208

 

[FireDragon76]

From your reuters link, it says potential damage of heart muscles is strongly linked to poor training leading to long endurance events.

Other things from your reuters link like heart fibrosis I also know to be caused by elevated/excess levels of cytokines (pro-inflammatory) in the blood which can also be triggered by long bouts of exercise.

Coincidentally, in my previous post, I mentioned about avoiding over-training. Having a good structured training should prevent over-training. I also mentioned about not eating frequently because frequent eating can worsen inflammatory response. On the other-hand, periodic or intermittent fasting will enhance anti-inflammatory response. Eat after exercising, not before, nor during because exercising will make you hungry (naturally). If you ate before exercise, you'll be eating again after exercise so you'll be adding to the frequency of eating

I did lots of research on the subject since last year.

I know many professional athletes develop health problems and this can be attributed to their frequent eating habit (that is probably part of their training or contract), high consumption of sugar or simple, very high glycemic carbs sponsor products, huge consumption of supplements/drugs also provided by their sponsors.

But since I'm not a professional / paid athlete, I don't have to gorge myself on sponsor products on a potentially unhealthy diet and unhealthy eating routines nor any performance-maximizing routines/supplements/drugs that may not be healthy in the long term. I'm free to eat (or not eat) and free to do what I know is healthy.

Sadly, even amateur/recreational athletes are fooled to consume the same sponsor products of their favorite teams. To look cool maybe, but I don't buy it. I'm not after appearances.

I have the opposite of heart problems. I used to have Angina and palpitations since childhood and hypertension recently but Praise the Lord. I don't have it anymore!

Those are ways to mitigate the risks of endurance running (don't eat junk, have a training program). However, it seems wiser to not see running as a panacea to poor cardiometabolic health, something that there is a history of in the country like the United States or Britain.

There's also evidence of increased apoptosis or accelerated cardiomyocyte turnover, not from actual heart damage.

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056208

Apoptosis isn't necessarily a good thing. It's another form of cell death, albeit one that's less messy than necrosis.

The majority of long-lived populations in the world engage in little in the way of formal exercise. The one thing they do have in common is regular physical activity, typically through walking. People that walk over 7,000 steps per day have over 50 percent lower all-cause mortality. Marathon runners, on the other hand, only have 30 percent lower all cause mortality.

 

[timewerx]

Those are ways to mitigate the risks of endurance running (don't eat junk, have a training program). However, it seems wiser to not see running as a panacea to poor cardiometabolic health, something that there is a history of in the country like the United States or Britain.

Chronic inflammation is implicated in A fib. Given that chronic inflammation is a risk factor in so many disease including cancer, I'd bet on the side of being a strong risk factor.

Given the huge importance of exercise in health, I would rather mitigate factors contributing to increased inflammation than to reduce exercise volume. Reducing exercise volume isn't the only path to reducing inflammation.

Migratory birds do extreme degree of exercise don't fly less to deal with inflammation. They simply fast (avoid eating) during long migratory flights because the body metabolizing their body fat elevates fatty acids and ketones in the blood which protects against excessive inflammation and damage to the heart and skeletal muscles.

I've been telling you these things since last year. I did lots of research on the subject, even conducted simple experiments on myself. This is how I know it works. You'll feel it when you're losing significant amount of skeletal and heart muscle mass. It's an unmistakable feeling. It's a bad feeling. The link you provided earlier implicated loss of heart muscle mass coinciding with loss of skeletal muscle mass and sore muscles from prolonged/high intensity exercise.

I would not have progressed so rapidly at this age otherwise. This is how I'm able to sustain relatively large workout volume and still able to work two jobs 7 days a week (no day off) and actually de-stress and really enjoy the workouts. I don't experience sore muscles, have high levels of energy all the time and rapidly acquire the needed muscle strength for any exercise I'm training myself to.

It's the food really. The typical junk food and frequent eating that makes even good things seem bad. Frequent eating just makes it so much easier to reach the tipping for chronic inflammation.

There are so many things professional athletes do that I wouldn't do for long term health and I'm not just talking about performance-enhancing drugs but also diet and eating habits. I would regard their sports nutrition and eating frequency as generally unhealthy and is probably the culprit to their elevated chronic inflammation risk factor.

The majority of long-lived populations in the world engage in little in the way of formal exercise. The one thing they do have in common is regular physical activity, typically through walking. People that walk over 7,000 steps per day have over 50 percent lower all-cause mortality. Marathon runners, on the other hand, only have 30 percent lower all cause mortality.

It's probably the place and other factors to consider.

I also used to fast-walk two miles a day for at least 10 years. No running, no cycling, just none of high intensity exercise. My BMI and body fat % is already close to endurance athlete level at the time.

That did not cure my Angina and heart palpitations. Heart conditions I've had since childhood, inherited from mother's side. Other factors may have neutralized the good effect of light exercise like high levels of air pollution and higher levels of stress and danger from the environment.

It was a combination of vigorous/heavier exercise workload and intermittent fasting that would eventually cure all my cardiovascular disease. It literally turned back the clock for me by at least 10 years. I feel like a child again, especially the levels of energy.

 

[FireDragon76]

Chronic inflammation is implicated in A fib. Given that chronic inflammation is a risk factor in so many disease including cancer, I'd bet on the side of being a strong risk factor.

Given the huge importance of exercise in health, I would rather mitigate factors contributing to increased inflammation than to reduce exercise volume. Reducing exercise volume isn't the only path to reducing inflammation.

Exercise is important, but I it's just one factor among many. I prefer a more holistic perspective. It's possible to get too much exercise, or especially, to exercise in the wrong way, in a way that causes undue stress to the body and doesn't promote health.

Migratory birds do extreme degree of exercise don't fly less to deal with inflammation. They simply fast (avoid eating) during long migratory flights because the body metabolizing their body fat elevates fatty acids and ketones in the blood which protects against excessive inflammation and damage to the heart and skeletal muscles.

Humans aren't birds. Birds don't necessarily live a long time. They only have to live long enough to reproduce.

I would not have progressed so rapidly at this age otherwise. This is how I'm able to sustain relatively large workout volume and still able to work two jobs 7 days a week (no day off) and actually de-stress and really enjoy the workouts. I don't experience sore muscles, have high levels of energy all the time and rapidly acquire the needed muscle strength for any exercise I'm training myself to.

Well, people are at different places. What works for a relatively young person, might not be good advice for somebody that's "over the hill".

It's the food really. The typical junk food and frequent eating that makes even good things seem bad. Frequent eating just makes it so much easier to reach the tipping for chronic inflammation.

The evidence intermittent fasting lowers inflammation independent of caloric consumption is far from clear. Certainly, if you are exercising frequently, fasting is not a wise idea.

It's probably the place and other factors to consider.

I also used to fast-walk two miles a day for at least 10 years. No running, no cycling, just none of high intensity exercise. My BMI and body fat % is already close to endurance athlete level at the time.

That did not cure my Angina and heart palpitations. Heart conditions I've had since childhood, inherited from mother's side. Other factors may have neutralized the good effect of light exercise like high levels of air pollution and higher levels of stress and danger from the environment.

Angina is typically associated with high cholesterol and atherosclerosis (hardening of the arteries). While exercise is known to be beneficial for people with heart disease, it's unlikely to lead to remission of atherosclerosis on its own. Control of dietary saturated fat intake would be the more straightforward approach. The American Heart Association, based on very good scientific evidence gathered over decades, recommends people concerned about their heart health consume less than 7 percent of their total calories from saturated fat. For a 2,000 calorie diet, that's about 13g of saturated fat.

 

[timewerx]

Humans aren't birds. Birds don't necessarily live a long time. They only have to live long enough to reproduce.

In recent times, birds are gathering attention in research that's looking for ways to extend human lifespans or delay the effects of aging.

Researchers are not just looking at the absolute lifespan of birds but lifespans in relation to the animal's weight or body size and birds live much longer than mammals of the same weight and size in this regard. Even if we look at absolute lifespans, some birds have lived over the age of 100. An albatross in her 70's still fly long distances, lays eggs, and shows no visible signs of aging.

A bird's metabolism is similar to an elite human athlete, subsisting heavily on ketones and fatty acids. A bird's physiological response to prolonged physical exertion is also very similar to a world class endurance human athlete, including inflammatory and anti-inflammatory response.

A bird's very strong anti-inflammatory response is also a subject of study since they exercise at extreme levels, yet don't die from it and don't even show signs of chronic inflammation nor accelerated aging.

Personally, I've been comparing studies done on bird metabolism during prolonged exertion compared to human athletes and the similarities are plentiful. The physiological response is almost identical.

The one major difference between birds and elite athletes is that some birds, especially migratory birds can survive very long physical exertion without eating nor drinking anything. The combined factors would have mounted a very strong anti-inflammatory response against the inflammatory effects of prolonged exercise.

The experiments I performed on myself went that direction. It really worked. Sore muscles became a thing of the past post adaptations. More radical adaptations followed and I was able to lose body weight during exercise at percentages considered lethal to human beings.

The evidence intermittent fasting lowers inflammation independent of caloric consumption is far from clear. Certainly, if you are exercising frequently, fasting is not a wise idea.

There's mountain loads of research on the subject observing positive effects of intermittent fasting.

When I added and combined intermittent fasting to my exercise routine last year as an experiment, I underwent significant improvement in exercise performance with my VO2max reaching world class endurance athlete level.

My muscles got sore less from adaptations and eventually did not get sore anymore. Not getting sore after a very large workload exercise session is a good sign of avoiding loss of muscle mass (both skeletal and cardiac muscle mass).

It's also a very good sign of avoiding chronic inflammation associated with exercise.

Where are you getting those sources that intermittent fasting with exercising is bad. All search results tell it's a good thing. Positive/enhanced results in terms of losing weight.

Angina is typically associated with high cholesterol and atherosclerosis (hardening of the arteries)

My diet is mostly steamed vegetables during the time I had my first bouts of angina at the age of 11 and at normal BMI.

While exercise is known to be beneficial for people with heart disease, it's unlikely to lead to remission of atherosclerosis on its own

Studies showing that exercise improves suppleness or elasticity and promotes repair and growth of new blood vessels.

This is probably how my angina went away. At least I don't get chest pains anymore for a year now.

So many good things brought by exercise especially in cancer prevention so I would rather mitigate inflammation than cut down on exercise.

Inflammation is implicated as cause of A-Fib and in my experience, a strong one. I sometimes get sore at the chest, around the heart after a long bout of exercise. So I studied ways to mitigate inflammation and did just that and it worked.

Frequent eating is bad by contributing to inflammation and could somehow, dampen the positive effect of a good and healthy diet. Avoid eating all the time, in fact, minimize your frequency of eating to as little as possible.

You'll be healthier this way and ironically have higher energy levels once your body has adapts to low frequency eating or intermittent fasting.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Do Marathon runners and triathletes actually live longer than those that engage in less arduous forms of physical activity, like walking? It seems to me the evidence is far from clear cut. Keep in mind half of Americans are physically inactive, walking only a few thousand steps a day at most. Of course Marathon runners will live longer than a couch potato, but that doesn't mean endurance running is a good idea for the general population. Endurance running poses much more risks of physical injury, as well as depression of the immune system and potentially stress on the heart (measurable after a Marathon: most athletes running in long endurance events will have elevated levels of troponin, a protein associated with injury to the heart).

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.119.041627

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN1O222Y/

The general population would be much better served by engaging in lower intensity, steady-state cardiovascular exercise, like walking or jogging, to build up aerobic capacity.

Cycling is excellent. Just don't fall off. It hurts.

 

[timewerx]

Cycling is excellent. Just don't fall off. It hurts.

TRUE! I've been cycling long distances for 3 years but very recently just a few months ago, I took up skating for the first time in my life. Just DIY lessons.

It hurt far less to fall while skating probably because you're lower to the ground and your movements are not constrained so you can crash-land at a posture where you're far less likely to be injured.

Otherwise, skating feels quite identical to cycling once I got used to it. They're both low impact workouts where force is applied progressively and skating is somewhat more fun probably because I'm still new to it. But I'm loving it so far and there are advantages like you can skate in places considered very awkward or unwelcome for cyclists.

Intensity can range from Zone 1 to >100% heart rate. Covering the whole range from high intensity to recovery sessions. However, skating recruits more muscles at higher forces compared to cycling so you might get stronger with skating as well and make you less prone to injuries.