A few questions for Protestants

[timothyu]

Actually not. The preceding verses are all about Peter's view of Christ, and Christ responds to him with the famous "keys" statement we were discussing.

I'm sorry to see you left out His teachings about what truth was and where it came from.

Matthew 16:13When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, He questioned His disciples: “Who do people say the Son of Man is?”14They replied, “Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”15“But what about you?” Jesus asked. “Who do you say I am?”16Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”17Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah!b For this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by My Father in heaven. 18And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it. 19I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”

 

[timothyu]

to contemporary "so called Christians " maybe. But not those those who follow the Bible and 2,000 years of scriptural teachings.

I meant the authourity the Magdalene what reported to have had.

 

[timothyu]

yeah, God was funny that way, always giving people nicknames Oh how far some have strayed from the Gospel.

I agree if they don't know the story of how Simon became Peter.

 

[concretecamper]

I meant the authourity the Magdalene what reported to have had.

 

[Albion]

I'm sorry to see you left out His teachings about what truth was and where it came from.

I was only following your lead by consulting the verses that come before the keys verse. And they are quite in line with Jesus making his statement to Peter after the back and forth that occurred over Peter's attitude towards Christ.

Matthew 16:13When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, He questioned His disciples: “Who do people say the Son of Man is?”14They replied, “Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”15“But what about you?” Jesus asked. “Who do you say I am?”16Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

17Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah!b For this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by My Father in heaven.

18And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it. 19I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven."

 

[timothyu]

So you are calling Peter the foundation and it is not the truth coming from God rather than man?

 

[Albion]

So you are calling Peter the foundation

No, I've argued that it's the "household of God'' that Jesus was referring to there. It couldn't be clearer.

However, those posts were on other threads.

 

[timothyu]

"household of God''

Define. The original if I get your drift was the Way.

 

[Valletta]

Correct.

Matthew 16:21-23, "From that time on Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and experts in the law, and be killed, and on the third day be raised. So Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him: “God forbid, Lord! This must not happen to you!” But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me, because you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s.”

The rock that Catholics claim Jesus said He would build His church on was called Satan shortly thereafter. So obviously Peter is not that rock. Rather it is his confession that Jesus was (and is) the Christ, something all Christinas agree upon.

Your conclusion is not supported by logic.

 

[Valletta]

No but Peter was the nickname Jesus gave to him which meant pebble, like calling him a chip off the ol' block (rock). A small truth about a larger truth.

The original Aramaic name given by Jesus to Simon was Kepha, transliterated as Cephas. That Aramaic name is preserved within the mostly Koine Greek Biblical text. Kepha means Rock in Aramaic.

 

[Albion]

Define. The original if I get your drift was the Way.

Well, "The Way" was what Christianity was called at first, but the reference in that passage to the "Household of God" was to the whole body of believers (i.e. the church, properly understood) which would be the support system of the new church.

 

[timothyu]

Well, "The Way" was what Christianity was called at first, but the reference in that passage to the "Household of God" was to the whole body of believers (i.e. the church, properly understood) who would be the support system of the new church.

But the believers were the church as shown in the Way, not the supporters of some new government.

 

[Albion]

But the believers were the church as shown in the Way, not the supporters of some new government.

Not government. Where'd you pick that up?

I didn't say anything about supporting a new "government."

 

[concretecamper]

“Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called ‘the rock on which the Church would be built’ [Matt. 16:18] with the power of ‘loosing and binding in heaven and on earth’ [Matt. 16:19]?” (Demurrer Against the Heretics 22 [A.D. 200]).

Hmmm, who do I believe? A self proclaimed doctor of something, some recent innovation from protestants, or a Father of the Church.

This is the correct use of the Fathers. They are used to show that the early Church believed then what she teaches now.

 

[timothyu]

Not government. Where'd you pick that up?

I didn't say anything about supporting a new "government."

And just what do call the overlords of an institution that sets itself up like any other institution of man?

 

[timothyu]

a Father of the Church.

A Father of the Church is like identity theft from the real Father of a completely different body called the Kingdom, which is not an institution but a way of life which Jesus showed us which differed even from the clean on the outside but filthy on the inside Sanhedrin. Nothing changes when the cup and plate becomes Gentile.

 

[concretecamper]

A Father of the Church is like identity theft from the real Father of a completely different body called the Kingdom.

call them what you will. I'll take their opinion over YOURS everytime!

 

[eleos1954]

Under the Protestant/Sola Scriptura (the Bible alone) theological system, is it your belief, and would you agree, there exists no person or no institution that can infallibly decide what is true and what is false for Christians when it comes to matters of faith and/or morals?

If you happen to answer yes to this question, my next question would be.... under this theological system, would you agree there is no sure way you could have absolute assurance of anything you believe being true? In other words, there is no way of knowing the truth?

Yet, Jesus says, "Know the truth and the truth will set make you free." (John 8:32)

So, let me leave you with this last question: For a Christian, what is the pillar and ground of the truth - i.e., the upholder and foundation of the truth? Is it the Bible? Yes or no?

Have a Blessed day!

well in the context of the verse you quoted .... He was referring to us being freed from sin.

John 8:31
Amplified Bible
So Jesus was saying to the Jews who had believed Him, “If you abide in My word [continually obeying My teachings and living in accordance with them, then] you are truly My disciples.

The Truth of Freedom

Freedom from sin comes through accepting Jesus Christ’s death on the Cross as the payment for our sin. As we submit to Christ, sin loses its power — Christ’s power takes over. As we choose to trust and follow Him, our sinful habits, thoughts and attitudes lose their control. Guilt disappears, and peace of mind dominates. Right habits become the norm. That’s freedom — true freedom!

We are called to follow in the steps of Jesus .... He is the way the truth and the life. We learn about His life from the bible and with His help walk in it. We will mess up here and there, but He will help us overcome .... it's a life-long walk as He sanctifies us.

John 17:17
Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.

Of course the bible Is truth. Jesus is the foundation.

1 Corinthians 3:11

Berean Literal Bible
For no one is able to lay another foundation, besides the one being already laid, which is Jesus Christ.

It's all about Jesus.

 

[HARK!]

MOD HAT ON

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[YeshuaFan]

Meaning God's truth still needs a middleman to interpret?

Thought that it was the "job" of the Holy Spirit to reveal and help us understand the scriptures, not Rome!