A Day Without Sinning

[frater_domus]

What? Christs work was perfect. It is not that Christ or the spirit are imperfect. It is because we are bound to our flesh while we are in this world. If we are to be without sin in the flesh, it would require God to undo creation, which He will not do because He loves us. As such, we struggle in the war between the flesh and the Spirit. However, we will ultimately win, because he who overcomes is on our side.

 

[razzelflabben]

See my post no. 16 to you.

I stated EXACTLY what you are saying.
You are blaming the Holy Spirit each time you sin.

lol oh my...that is the total opposite of what I said and I showed you that and you still are going off and falsely accusing me of things I did not say...apparently you are not yielding yourself to the HS right now or you would not be sinning against me in this way.

 

[razzelflabben]

You're saying that if we have the Holy Spirit we will not sin.

so your problems is a reading one? I said if we are not YIELDING TO, that is allowing ourselves to be LED by the indwelling HS.....what do you not understand about that...scripture talks about quenching the HS, etc. IF we quench the HS we are NOT allowing HIS POWER in our lives....that has nothing to do with not having the HS it has to do with allowing HIM control over our lives....as I said, it's all on us.

So then why do we sin? Are we not saved?

we sin because we do not give ourselves completely to the control of the indwelling HS

As far as why Jesus came here...
The number one reason was to set up the Kingdom of God here on earth.

I provided scripture how about you do the same?

Not to take away from the fact that He is the Messiah and came to save that which was lost and He defied death and sin.

scripture tells us He came to destroy sin and death...

But, most of all, He broke satan's stronghold on everyone, but not because we don't sin

see related passages...

anymore...because now we have the motive and the power to sin as little as possible, but because WE make the choice not to sin, not because we have the Holy Spirit stopping us - which would put the blame on Him when we DO sin.

I have no idea what you do not understand about yielding ourselves to the working of the HS in our lives but it is tripping you up when it comes to understanding what I am saying.

 

[RaymondG]

You're saying that if we have the Holy Spirit we will not sin.
So then why do we sin? Are we not saved?

As far as why Jesus came here...
The number one reason was to set up the Kingdom of God here on earth.

Not to take away from the fact that He is the Messiah and came to save that which was lost and He defied death and sin.
But, most of all, He broke satan's stronghold on everyone, but not because we don't sin anymore...because now we have the motive and the power to sin as little as possible, but because WE make the choice not to sin, not because we have the Holy Spirit stopping us - which would put the blame on Him when we DO sin.

Why hinder those willing to not sin anymore by telling them it isnt possible.....therefore they should continue to sin and not feel bad about it.

What does it profit you to get others to believe this? Why not push others to do what you haven't done yet, instead of telling them they cant because you haven't?

 

[razzelflabben]

What? Christs work was perfect. It is not that Christ or the spirit are imperfect. It is because we are bound to our flesh while we are in this world. If we are to be without sin in the flesh, it would require God to undo creation, which He will not do because He loves us. As such, we struggle in the war between the flesh and the Spirit. However, we will ultimately win, because he who overcomes is on our side.

Now, according to this you are suggesting that we cannot access the power of God to flee from temptations because we are still in the flesh. I call foul on that notion in that we are told throughout scripture to flee from sin, to pray so that we do not fall into temptation, etc. Why if we cannot avoid sin are we commanded to flee it, to submit ourselves to God so we don't sin, to flee the devil, to pray so that we will not sin....you are defeating yourself before you ever give God a chance to show you How much He Loves you with the power to be set free from sin and death

 

[frater_domus]

Now, according to this you are suggesting that we cannot access the power of God to flee from temptations because we are still in the flesh. I call foul on that notion in that we are told throughout scripture to flee from sin, to pray so that we do not fall into temptation, etc. Why if we cannot avoid sin are we commanded to flee it, to submit ourselves to God so we don't sin, to flee the devil, to pray so that we will not sin....you are defeating yourself before you ever give God a chance to show you How much He Loves you with the power to be set free from sin and death

Check Romans 7:18-20 for that. Paul addresses the issue of us never being able to be free from sin while we inhabit our flesh. Even the most devout Christian will stumble from time to time. What matters is that we come back in repentance.
It does not mean that we may grow lax and sin. No. We must fight it. What I am saying is that we will never be fully victorious until the very end, when we will enter a world that is free from sin.

 

[GodsGrace101]

so your problems is a reading one? I said if we are not YIELDING TO, that is allowing ourselves to be LED by the indwelling HS.....what do you not understand about that...scripture talks about quenching the HS, etc. IF we quench the HS we are NOT allowing HIS POWER in our lives....that has nothing to do with not having the HS it has to do with allowing HIM control over our lives....as I said, it's all on us. we sin because we do not give ourselves completely to the control of the indwelling HS I provided scripture how about you do the same? scripture tells us He came to destroy sin and death... see related passages...I have no idea what you do not understand about yielding ourselves to the working of the HS in our lives but it is tripping you up when it comes to understanding what I am saying.

Here is what you said in post no. 11:

I'm with you on that part about not wanting to be rude and not ignore etc.

So let me say this...according to scripture, Christ came to break our bondage to sin and death....how has He done that if we are still bound in the flesh to sin? WE cannot do it alone, amen...but Christ failed if we cannot be without sin in His power hasn't He? If He came to break our bondage to sin and death and yet we go on sinning, why should be believe that the power of death has no hold?

And just for clarification, I am talking about all sin not just the big ones

I said in another post here that we're giving too much responsibility to the Holy Spirit these days and not enough to US.

You said above that if we cannot be without sin, Christ failed.

My point exactly. CHRIST HAS NOT FAILED. He did what He was supposed to do.

It's US that sin, it's not the Holy Spirit making us sin, Christ did not fail. We still have a free will to obey the Holy Spirit or not to obey the Holy Spirit.

I also said that we sin less and less during our sanctification process, but I do NOT foresee a day when we will not sin at all.

I was going by what you wrote. I do agree that we have to yield ourselves to the Holy Spirit and that it's OUR responsibility if we don't. We just need to be careful what we say. I believe I posted 1 John 1:9 and asked someone to explain it, perhaps it wasn't you.

 

[RaymondG]

Check Romans 7:18-20 for that. Paul addresses the issue of us never being able to be free from sin while we inhabit our flesh.

You are correct, As long as you are your flesh..you will continue to sin. This is why we must be born again....die to the flesh and arize in the newness of life. Yet, how can this be done in one who doesnt believe it possible?

" Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost."

"8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

It does not mean that we may grow lax and sin. No. We must fight it. What I am saying is that we will never be fully victorious until the very end, when we will enter a world that is free from sin.

But why fight a losing battle? If you know you cant win....why waste time trying to win?

 

[GodsGrace101]

Now, according to this you are suggesting that we cannot access the power of God to flee from temptations because we are still in the flesh. I call foul on that notion in that we are told throughout scripture to flee from sin, to pray so that we do not fall into temptation, etc. Why if we cannot avoid sin are we commanded to flee it, to submit ourselves to God so we don't sin, to flee the devil, to pray so that we will not sin....you are defeating yourself before you ever give God a chance to show you How much He Loves you with the power to be set free from sin and death

You're doing it again.
Do YOU ever sin???
I believe you think you're sinless...

 

[razzelflabben]

Check Romans 7:18-20 for that. Paul addresses the issue of us never being able to be free from sin while we inhabit our flesh. Even the most devout Christian will stumble from time to time. What matters is that we come back in repentance.

I never questioned that...what I said is that we can live without sin if we live in the power of the indwelling HS...are you trying to tell me now that Paul is saying in this passage that the HS does not dwell in the believer because "nothing good dwells in me" or that the HS is not good?

See, you and others are trying too hard to inflate what is being said into something it is not so that you can make a point about the flesh being weak....we have passages about that too...the flesh is weak....shall we look at them? Matthew 26:41 is a great place to start....what I and another poster are telling you and what scripture is telling you is that in the power of the Living God we can be without sin...the problem is that we do NOT always live in the power of the LIving God which is on us.

It does not mean that we may grow lax and sin. No. We must fight it. What I am saying is that we will never be fully victorious until the very end, when we will enter a world that is free from sin.

If we must fight sin but will fail before we get out of bed as one poster stated, why fight it?

See, basically the second half of this, "what I am saying is that we will never be fully victorious until the very end, when we will enter a world that is free from sin." Is much closer to what I have been saying than you will be comfortable with accepting. We can be free from sin in this life or God is not nearly as powerful and loving as we know Him to be. The problem is that we are not set from from the flesh only from sin...which means as the Romans passage says, we will be constantly drawn to sin in this flesh....being drawn to it does NOT mean we have to be a slave to it, it means that we will likely fail from time to time to yield ourselves to God's power and leading and when that happens we need to confess and repent and draw back into a right relationship with God were we are allowing His strength into our weakness.

 

[RaymondG]

You're doing it again.
Do YOU ever sin???
I believe you think you're sinless...

It always come down to making it personal.....

Whether he sins or not have no bearing on whether or not you have to. We have to strive to be like Jesus, not like other men.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Why hinder those willing to not sin anymore by telling them it isnt possible.....therefore they should continue to sin and not feel bad about it.

What does it profit you to get others to believe this? Why not push others to do what you haven't done yet, instead of telling them they cant because you haven't?

Oh my. I'm the number one "works" person probably on this whole forum. Far be it for me to tell anyone to sin!

Here's why though, to answer your question:

The O.P. of this thread is worried because maybe he can't go ONE DAY without sinning.

Do YOU ever go one day without sinning?
Did you read my post no. 4?

It's great if you do, which I doubt, but some of us need some help and reassurance.

We can be sure if we remain in the hands of Jesus...He will keep us safe from God's wrath IF we are doing our best.

 

[GodsGrace101]

It always come down to making it personal.....

Whether he sins or not have no bearing on whether or not you have to. We have to strive to be like Jesus, not like other men.

Well Raymond, how right you are.
But we ALL sin.
Even the Pope goes to confession....

 

[frater_domus]

If we must fight sin but will fail before we get out of bed as one poster stated, why fight it?

Out of love for God. I know I can not be perfect outside of God and I know that perfection is out of my reach as long as I am bound to my flesh. But I love God so much, that I will try to my dying breath

1 John 1:8. No one apart from Jesus, saved or not, is free from sin. The difference salvation makes is that those sins will not be held against us by God, for God has established the law of grace through Jesus.

Besides, you asked the same question as Paul addressed in Romans 6:1.

 

[RaymondG]

Oh my. I'm the number one "works" person probably on this whole forum. Far be it for me to tell anyone to sin!

To tell someone that it is not possible to stop sinning, and that trying not to, is ok.......is the same as condoling the occasional sin.

The O.P. of this thread is worried because maybe he can't go ONE DAY without sinning.

Maybe God put this issue in his heart to ponder......Maybe God is trying to set him apart for His work. Maybe you hindered God's plan by introducing the idea that sin is ok if done in moderation and that every "saved" person does it and cant stop.

Do YOU ever go one day without sinning?
Did you read my post no. 4?

It's great if you do, which I doubt, but some of us need some help and reassurance.

We can be sure if we remain in the hands of Jesus...He will keep us safe from God's wrath IF we are doing our best.

I appreciate your doubts, as it assures me that I Am closer to the path that few find.
You cannot get me to boost about God's workings. I will say this, however..... I do not push my shortcomings on others. Even if I found that I cant do something...I would still encourage you to do it. It would be selfish of me to try to hold you back from God's blessings because i could not live up to the standards.

So it matters not whether or not I sin...I still encourage you to "Be Ye perfect, even as your Father in heaven is perfect"

 

[razzelflabben]

You're doing it again.
Do YOU ever sin???
I believe you think you're sinless...

what do you not understand about my posts or are you just trying to be inflammatory and insulting?

Like everyone in the world, I still live in the flesh...I still battle the fleshly desires...we all do but doing battle means that we have been given the tools to overcome and that is all we are talking about here.

In relation to what I am actually saying without your reinterpretations applied, you are saying that God has not given us the power to not sin so anytime temptation comes just give in cause God doesn't really care....I do NOT think for a moment that you really believe that, but hey, maybe you do...please, clarify for us your position since you can't accurately represent mine.

 

[razzelflabben]

Out of love for God. I know I can not be perfect outside of God and I know that perfection is out of my reach as long as I am bound to my flesh. But I love God so much, that I will try to my dying breath

1 John 1:8. No one apart from Jesus, saved or not, is free from sin. The difference salvation makes is that those sins will not be held against us by God, for God has established the law of grace through Jesus.

Besides, you asked the same question as Paul addressed in Romans 6:1.

Praise the Lord!!!!! some hint of understanding...I said from the get go to this very moment that in the power of the indwelling HS we can refrain from sin to which I was told I was wrong. Now here you are saying the same thing...how did that happen?

BTW, we can talk about our record if you want, but that wasn't entered into the discussion by the OPer

 

[~Anastasia~]

I'm with you on that part about not wanting to be rude and not ignore etc.

So let me say this...according to scripture, Christ came to break our bondage to sin and death....how has He done that if we are still bound in the flesh to sin? WE cannot do it alone, amen...but Christ failed if we cannot be without sin in His power hasn't He? If He came to break our bondage to sin and death and yet we go on sinning, why should be believe that the power of death has no hold?

And just for clarification, I am talking about all sin not just the big ones

I will say this. God will provide that grace and power ... but there are very few persons indeed who ever cooperate with Him to that degree in this life. And if you asked any of them if they were sinless, they would quickly assure that they were chief among sinners.

I really am not interested in debate though, which it seems this thread has become. And it may well be that people who are disagreeing with one another are doing so, meaning different things.

Peace to you all.

 

[razzelflabben]

I will say this. God will provide that grace and power ... but there are very few persons indeed who ever cooperate with Him to that degree in this life. And if you asked any of them if they were sinless, they would quickly assure that they were chief among sinners.

I really am not interested in debate though, which it seems this thread has become. And it may well be that people who are disagreeing with one another are doing so, meaning different things.

Peace to you all.

Just because the flesh is weak does not mean I have to give into it...that is the point.

Look at the OP question...can we go one or more consecutive days without sin. To argue that I am wrong is to argue that God does not have the power to keep us from temptation for one or more days in a row....why then are we taught by Christ Himself to pray that God would keep us from temptation? (Lord's prayer) Of course we can be without sin for one or more consecutive days in the power of the Living God...that does not mean we do so...just because we sin from time to time does not mean that we can't or haven't gone one or more days in the power of the Living God without sin. You act like admitting that God has the power to keep us from sin that it somehow diminishes our need to confess and repent when we do sin which is something I find very distasteful which might be why we are still discussing this.

 

[Tree of Life]

Outside of being in a coma (which I'm sure some people would consider sinful for some reason), can a full-grown adult be spiritually disciplined enough to go one or more consecutive days without sinning inwardly and outwardly?

Since the fall, no mere man is able perfectly to obey the commands of God, but does daily break them in thought, word, and deed.