A concept that will greatly help in understanding end time prophecy.

[Biblewriter]

The word of God is very precise. It means what it says. It means exactly what it says. And it does not mean what it does not say. This is particularly true of end time prophecy. So in studying end time prophecy, it is important to give careful attention to the fine details. For it is in them that we learn when and where many prophecies will be fulfilled. End time prophecy contains no synonyms. When different words are used in different places, they are used for a reason.

One detail we will notice in this article is a remarkable absence of the name Israel from the prophecies about the wars and suffering that will take place during Daniel’s seventieth week. It is used of the land where this will happen, but not of the people to whom it will happen. We often say that Israel does not mean the church, and the church does not mean Israel. But in the same way Israel does not mean Judah, and Judah does not mean Israel.

We remember that in the days of king Rehoboam, son of Solomon, the ten northern tribes revolted against the house of David, choosing instead Jeroboam, son of Nebat as their king. In that revolt, Israel was divided into two kingdoms. After that time, the inspired history usually called the northern kingdom Israel and the southern kingdom Judah. But the northern kingdom was sometimes called Ephraim when the point was to stress its distinction from the southern kingdom. The name Israel continued to be used when referring to all twelve tribes. The ten northern tribes were eventually carried away into Assyria, and have not yet been restored to their land. A few generations later the two southern tribes were carried away into Babylon for seventy years. After they were carried away, members of these two tribes were called Jews, both in the Old Testament and the New Testament. So in the Bible, as in modern times, the term Jew does not mean an Israelite, even though all Jews are Israelites. The term Jew means a descendant of one of the two southern tribes, Judah and Benjamin.

These distinctions were carried forward into end time prophecy. A prophecy about Israel speaks either about only the ten northern tribes or about the entire nation. Only the context can show which is meant. But a prophecy about Judah concerns only the two southern tribes.

We will first notice who Daniel’s seventy weeks are determined for:

“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.
(Daniel 9:4)

Daniel’s holy city is unquestionably Jerusalem, but who are Daniel’s people? This is not left to our imagination. We are told in Daniel 1:9 that Daniel was “of the sons of Judah,” in Daniel 2:5 that he was “of the captives of Judah,” and twice (Daniel 5:3 and 6:3) that he was “one of the captives from Judah.” Now since Daniel was “of Judah,” we know that he was also an Israelite. But he was never called this in the inspired record. We find the reason for this in many other prophecies that speak of the troubles coming upon the God’s earthly people. As we have already noticed, in these prophecies they are always called Judah, never Israel.

We see this in Joel:

“For behold, in those days and at that time,
When I bring back the captives of Judah and Jerusalem,
I will also gather all nations,
And bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat;
And I will enter into judgment with them there
On account of My people, My heritage Israel,
Whom they have scattered among the nations;
They have also divided up My land.
(Joel 3:1-2)

We see this again in Obadiah where the Lord says concerning Edom: (see Obadiah 1:1)
“For violence against your brother Jacob,
Shame shall cover you,
And you shall be cut off forever.
In the day that you stood on the other side—
In the day that strangers carried captive his forces,
When foreigners entered his gates
And cast lots for Jerusalem—
Even you were as one of them.

“But you should not have gazed on the day of your brother
In the day of his captivity;
Nor should you have rejoiced over the children of Judah
In the day of their destruction;
Nor should you have spoken proudly
In the day of distress.
You should not have entered the gate of My people
In the day of their calamity.
Indeed, you should not have gazed on their affliction
In the day of their calamity,
Nor laid hands on their substance
In the day of their calamity.
You should not have stood at the crossroads
To cut off those among them who escaped;
Nor should you have delivered up those among them who remained
In the day of distress.

“For the day of the Lord upon all the nations is near;
As you have done, it shall be done to you;
Your reprisal shall return upon your own head.
(Obadiah 1:10-15)

We see it again in Zechariah, where the Lord addresses Israel generally, but specifically mentions a siege “against Judah and Jerusalem” and “the house of Judah.”

The burden of the word of the Lord against Israel. Thus says the Lord, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: “Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem. And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it. In that day,” says the Lord, “I will strike every horse with confusion, and its rider with madness; I will open My eyes on the house of Judah, and will strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. And the governors of Judah shall say in their heart, ‘The inhabitants of Jerusalem are my strength in the Lord of hosts, their God.’ In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan in the woodpile, and like a fiery torch in the sheaves; they shall devour all the surrounding peoples on the right hand and on the left, but Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place—Jerusalem.

“The Lord will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not become greater than that of Judah. In that day the Lord will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the Lord before them. It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. (Zechariah 12:1-9)

And we see this again in Ezekiel 25, where we repeatedly find “the land of Israel” mentioned, but those who experience the trouble are “the house of Judah.”

The word of the Lord came to me, saying, “Son of man, set your face against the Ammonites, and prophesy against them. Say to the Ammonites, ‘Hear the word of the Lord GOD! Thus says the Lord GOD: “Because you said, ‘Aha!’ against My sanctuary when it was profaned, and against the land of Israel when it was desolate, and against the house of Judah when they went into captivity, indeed, therefore, I will deliver you as a possession to the men of the East, and they shall set their encampments among you and make their dwellings among you; they shall eat your fruit, and they shall drink your milk. And I will make Rabbah a stable for camels and Ammon a resting place for flocks. Then you shall know that I am the Lord.”

‘For thus says the Lord GOD: “Because you clapped your hands, stamped your feet, and rejoiced in heart with all your disdain for the land of Israel, indeed, therefore, I will stretch out My hand against you, and give you as plunder to the nations; I will cut you off from the peoples, and I will cause you to perish from the countries; I will destroy you, and you shall know that I am the Lord.”

‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Because Moab and Seir say, ‘Look! The house of Judah is like all the nations,’ therefore, behold, I will clear the territory of Moab of cities, of the cities on its frontier, the glory of the country, Beth Jeshimoth, Baal Meon, and Kirjathaim. To the men of the East I will give it as a possession, together with the Ammonites, that the Ammonites may not be remembered among the nations. And I will execute judgments upon Moab, and they shall know that I am the Lord.”

‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Because of what Edom did against the house of Judah by taking vengeance, and has greatly offended by avenging itself on them,” therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “I will also stretch out My hand against Edom, cut off man and beast from it, and make it desolate from Teman; Dedan shall fall by the sword. I will lay My vengeance on Edom by the hand of My people Israel, that they may do in Edom according to My anger and according to My fury; and they shall know My vengeance,” says the Lord GOD.

‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Because the Philistines dealt vengefully and took vengeance with a spiteful heart, to destroy because of the old hatred,” therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “I will stretch out My hand against the Philistines, and I will cut off the Cherethites and destroy the remnant of the seacoast. I will execute great vengeance on them with furious rebukes; and they shall know that I am the Lord, when I lay My vengeance upon them.”’”(Ezekiel 25:1-17)

Even in Matthew and Mark, the scene of the coming trouble is called Judea, not Israel.

Matthew 24:15-16 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Mark 13:14 “So when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not” (let the reader understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

A second detail we should notice is that end time prophecies about the Lord’s people being brought back to the land always use the name Israel, and specifically say that all of Israel will be brought back. Even when Judah is mentioned in these prophecies, it is “Judah and Israel.” There are too many of these to examine them all, but we will notice a typical one.

“Therefore prophesy concerning the land of Israel, and say to the mountains, the hills, the rivers, and the valleys, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Behold, I have spoken in My jealousy and My fury, because you have borne the shame of the nations.” Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “I have raised My hand in an oath that surely the nations that are around you shall bear their own shame. But you, O mountains of Israel, you shall shoot forth your branches and yield your fruit to My people Israel, for they are about to come. For indeed I am for you, and I will turn to you, and you shall be tilled and sown. I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, all of it; and the cities shall be inhabited and the ruins rebuilt. I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bear young; I will make you inhabited as in former times, and do better for you than at your beginnings. Then you shall know that I am the Lord. Yes, I will cause men to walk on you, My people Israel; they shall take possession of you, and you shall be their inheritance; no more shall you bereave them of children.” (Ezekiel 36:6-12)

This prophecy is addressed to a piece of real estate “to the mountains, the hills, the rivers, and the valleys” of Israel. And tells them that “I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, all of it.” The repeating of the word “all” stresses that this means absolutely all of Israel.

Now why do we find only the name Judah in the details about Daniel’s seventieth week, and only Israel, or “Judah and Israel” in details about the restoration? We find the reason in the last chapter of Isaiah.

The hand of the Lord shall be known to His servants,
And His indignation to His enemies.
For behold, the Lord will come with fire
And with His chariots, like a whirlwind,
To render His anger with fury,
And His rebuke with flames of fire.
For by fire and by His sword
The Lord will judge all flesh;
And the slain of the Lord shall be many.
“Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall be consumed together,” says the Lord.

“For I know their works and their thoughts. It shall be that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come and see My glory. I will set a sign among them; and those among them who escape I will send to the nations: to Tarshish and Pul and Lud, who draw the bow, and Tubal and Javan, to the coastlands afar off who have not heard My fame nor seen My glory. And they shall declare My glory among the Gentiles. Then they shall bring all your brethren for an offering to the Lord out of all nations, on horses and in chariots and in litters, on mules and on camels, to My holy mountain Jerusalem,” says the Lord, “as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the Lord. And I will also take some of them for priests and Levites,” says the Lord. (Isaiah 66:14-21)

Here we see a plain reference to Armageddon. And then we read, “and those among them who escape I will send to the nations... And they shall declare My glory among the Gentiles.” This is followed by the word “then,” that is, at that time. And what will happen “then”? “Then they shall bring all your brethren for an offering to the Lord out of all nations, on horses and in chariots and in litters, on mules and on camels, to My holy mountain Jerusalem.”

Here we see the time specifically stated. The prophesied restoration will take after Messiah has come, not before.

Now what is the point of all this? It is a simple concept that will open up an understanding of many prophecies. The return of the Jews to their land is not directly prophesied anywhere in scripture. It is prophesied indirectly, because they are in the land during Daniel’s seventieth week. But it is not mentioned. This is like the rebuilding of the temple and the resumption of animal sacrifices. Neither is directly prophesied, but both must happen. For both a temple and sacrifices are mentioned in prophecies concerning Daniel’s seventieth week.
When we understand this, we understand that prophecies that speak only of Judah are about Daniel’s seventieth week, and those that speak of Israel are about the time after Messiah returns.

 

[Old Timer]

Absolutely wondrous and again an excellent read for anyone interested in these things which shall be hereafter..

What also caught my attention was the Lord's judgment pronounced upon those who would rejoice in their destruction and captivity... it reminded me instantly of how many are today.. even basing their entire theology upon the destruction of Jerusalem in AD70..

Anyway keep this at the top of the list..

 

[Keachian]

And Luke's editing of the Olivet discourse to align it with the Roman-Judean war means?

 

[Old Timer]

And Luke's editing of the Olivet discourse to align it with the Roman-Judean war means?

Isn't it obviously.. Israel cut off from the root.. their house left desolate?

Israel blinded in part until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in?

Jacob was left alone.. and wrestled with the man until the breaking of the Day..

As we see that Day approaching..

 

[Keachian]

Isn't it obviously.. Israel cut off from the root.. their house left desolate?

Israel blinded in part until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in?

Jacob was left alone.. and wrestled with the man until the breaking of the Day..

As we see that Day approaching..

And that doesn't address the textual data, we have three versions of the Olivet discourse which conservatively are dated to AD60, AD66 and AD72 and have varying conformity to the events of the Roman-Judean War, now Luke being the latest written edits Mark's Olivet discourse to bring it in line with the events that have transpired, what does this tell us of the theology of Luke?

 

[Old Timer]

And that doesn't address the textual data, we have three versions of the Olivet discourse which conservatively are dated to AD60, AD66 and AD72 and have varying conformity to the events of the Roman-Judean War, now Luke being the latest written edits Mark's Olivet discourse to bring it in line with the events that have transpired, what does this tell us of the theology of Luke?

And this dismisses the volumes of prophetic textual data concerning Israel's deliverance in the end... how?

The DofJ (as some call it) was clearly a prophetic fulfillment.. there can be no doubt about that..

But how in the world is that the end of the story for Israel?

God isn't dissing Jacob.. He's going to miraculously DELIVER him in the end even though the entire world comes against him.

Check out the other thread concerning the restoration of Israel if you'd like endless confirmation to these things.

 

[Old Timer]

And I'll add that the mystery concerning Israel which so many willfully ignore addresses the issue perfectly..

Men choose to ignore the warning from the Apostle to the Gentiles rather than be concerned about its ultimate end.. becoming wise in our own conceits.

We're all Israel now right..

Don't worry about that other Israel behind the curtain.. don't mind the endless attacks on them from their enemies who are sworn to destroying them..

To me it's simply amazing how so many can continue to deny the obvious.

 

[Old Timer]

End time eschatology (the end of this age) is all about Israel's deliverance...

Why do you think there is constant denial of that exact thing.. over and over again..

Any ideas?

Anyone..

 

[Biblewriter]

And that doesn't address the textual data, we have three versions of the Olivet discourse which conservatively are dated to AD60, AD66 and AD72 and have varying conformity to the events of the Roman-Judean War, now Luke being the latest written edits Mark's Olivet discourse to bring it in line with the events that have transpired, what does this tell us of the theology of Luke?

You are ignoring the real author of the scriptures, the Holy Ghost who inspired all the writers of the entire Bible. That is why it is so consistent, when it is not wrested.

 

[Old Timer]

Why do you think the holy scriptures... after all of the letters to the church of God.. revert almost entirely back to a Jewish context with the Apostles to the circumcision closing out the NT.. Peter, James, and John... who was given the revelation..

Think...

Why might that be?

 

[ebedmelech]

Let's just show one huge error in what Biblewriter said:

We will first notice who Daniel’s seventy weeks are determined for:

“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.
(Daniel 9:4)

Daniel’s holy city is unquestionably Jerusalem, but who are Daniel’s people? This is not left to our imagination. We are told in Daniel 1:9 that Daniel was “of the sons of Judah,” in Daniel 2:5 that he was “of the captives of Judah,” and twice (Daniel 5:3 and 6:3) that he was “one of the captives from Judah.” Now since Daniel was “of Judah,” we know that he was also an Israelite. But he was never called this in the inspired record. We find the reason for this in many other prophecies that speak of the troubles coming upon the God’s earthly people. As we have already noticed, in these prophecies they are always called Judah, never Israel.

Now...why is this erroneous? That would be beacuse Daniels prayer reveals he is not only concerned with Judah...as Biblewriter asserts.

As Daniel prays in Daniel 9:7, 8, it shows where his concern is:
7 “Righteousness belongs to You, O Lord, but to us open shame, as it is this day—to the men of Judah, the inhabitants of Jerusalem and all Israel, those who are nearby and those who are far away in all the countries to which You have driven them, because of their unfaithful deeds which they have committed against You.
8 Open shame belongs to us, O Lord, to our kings, our princes and our fathers, because we have sinned against You.

So already Biblewriter is off track. Daniel is concermed about Judah and Israel!!! The is why Daniel said "to us" as he prayed...he is not selfishly praying only for Judah, for he knows Israel is also God's people. The kingdom was split because of Solomon's sin and it is God who divided the kingdom.

When Gabriel comes to give Daniel understanding and the “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city,..." It includes Judah and Israel...not just Judah...as Biblewriter erroneously asserts.

 

[Keachian]

You are ignoring the real author of the scriptures, the Holy Ghost who inspired all the writers of the entire Bible. That is why it is so consistent, when it is not wrested.

So do the human authors lose their autonomy as agents, theologians and pastors to the Holy Spirit's actions in Inspiration?

 

[Old Timer]

Daniel is concerned with the deliverance of his people in the time of the end, which just about every Christian knows has not yet happened.

NOW of course there are a lot of rulers in this world who would have us believe that the time of the end was a long time ago.. although we know their reasons..

 

[Biblewriter]

So do the human authors lose their autonomy as agents, theologians and pastors to the Holy Spirit's actions in Inspiration?

No, they do not. But continually stressing who wrote a particular passage of scripture is ignoring the fact that the Holy Spirit inspired all of it, and therefore all of it is from the Holy Spirit, even if individual persinalities shine through.

 

[Biblewriter]

Let's just show one huge error in what Biblewriter said:


Now...why is this erroneous? That would be beacuse Daniels prayer reveals he is not only concerned with Judah...as Biblewriter asserts.

As Daniel prays in Daniel 9:7, 8, it shows where his concern is:
7 “Righteousness belongs to You, O Lord, but to us open shame, as it is this day—to the men of Judah, the inhabitants of Jerusalem and all Israel, those who are nearby and those who are far away in all the countries to which You have driven them, because of their unfaithful deeds which they have committed against You.
8 Open shame belongs to us, O Lord, to our kings, our princes and our fathers, because we have sinned against You.

So already Biblewriter is off track. Daniel is concermed about Judah and Israel!!! The is why Daniel said "to us" as he prayed...he is not selfishly praying only for Judah, for he knows Israel is also God's people. The kingdom was split because of Solomon's sin and it is God who divided the kingdom.

When Gabriel comes to give Daniel understanding and the “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city,..." It includes Judah and Israel...not just Judah...as Biblewriter erroneously asserts.

The truth is that many other scriptures clearly describe Judah in her ancient homeland at the time of the end, even as is true again today. But the scriptures that speak of a return of Israel are very specific that the return they are speaking of is a return of All Israel, not of a part of it. And they are just as clear abut the fact that this return will take place after, not before the Lord Comes "with fire, the render His anger with fury, and His rebuke woth flames of fire." (Isaiah 66:15-23)

 

[daq]

So do the human authors lose their autonomy as agents, theologians and pastors to the Holy Spirit's actions in Inspiration?

No, they do not. But continually stressing who wrote a particular passage of scripture is ignoring the fact that the Holy Spirit inspired all of it, and therefore all of it is from the Holy Spirit, even if individual persinalities shine through.

The word of God is very precise. It means what it says. It means exactly what it says. And it does not mean what it does not say.

Here you say one thing but somewhere else regarding the same subject matter you state something entirely different to suit your momentary predicament. You have likewise said here that the authors do not "lose their autonomy" yet in the other thread from where the quote below is found you made it clear that you believe Paul did not even understand what he wrote because he was writing under the influence of your version of "the Holy Spirit". Do you not understand or believe that Paul was a Torah Scholar and Pharisee of Pharisees? Your claims are audacious and atrocious to say the least and they are an argument based in nullifying the original intent of the authors so that you may insert your own modern interpretations. How can you not see the massive potential for erroneous disaster if the Scriptures do not mean what the authors intended them to mean when they were written to the audiences to whom they were written? If your argument wins then anyone can claim that the Scripture means anything they want it to mean so long as the claim that "the Spirit told them so!" So as you have stated in your opening remarks here in this thread: If the Scripture says what it means and means what it says then why do you change the meaning of "the Temple of God" according to Paul in the Epistles to the Corinthians when it comes to your interpretation of the Epistles to the Thessalonians? Apparently you are not even capable of coming into agreement with your own words much less those of Paul!

One of the first principles when it comes to understanding Scripture is that if the understanding ignores and renders ineffective the primary meaning to the people for whom it is written then the understanding tramples the meaning completely.

This is a principle invented out of thin air, without an atom of scripture to back it up.

But this concept does not only have no scriptural support, it is distinctly contrary to scripture. For we are expressly told thet even the individuals who were used by the Holy Spirit to utter the words did not themselves understand them.

That is an intentionally false statement because it is clearly not contrary to Scripture to uphold the Scripture. Likewise now you foolishly attempt to suggest that Paul wrote things he did not understand as if he were some "new age" auto-writer taking notes from a spirit entity, (which is witchcraft). In this case however Paul clearly understood what he meant but the fact of the matter is that you simply reject what he meant so that you may insert your own idolatrous mindset into the Scripture. It appears fairly clear that your answer is essentially that it is completely acceptable for you to annul the original meaning as it was written to the Thessalonians in their time and insert your own modern meaning. However, Paul likewise told the Corinthians about the "temple of God" when he writes:

1 Corinthians 3:16-20 KJV
16. Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17. If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
18. Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
19. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
20. And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

Do you not understand that this phrase in Greek is exactly the same as the "temple of God" mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2:4? By what authority do you assume the right to change the meanings of such phrases when the author himself clearly tells us what he means in his writings with such a statement so important as "the temple of God"?

1 Corinthians 6:15-20 KJV
15. Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
16. What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
17. But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
18. Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19. What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20. For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

Not only do you annul and trample the original intent from the text of 2 Thessalonians 2:4 but at the same time you completely ignore two other witnesses given by the same author which directly contradict what you proclaim to be truth. Moreover you can provide absolutely no authority or precedent to do what you do!

 

[Biblewriter]

Here you say one thing but somewhere else regarding the same subject matter you state something entirely different to suit your momentary predicament. You have likewise said here that the authors do not "lose their autonomy" yet in the other thread from where the quote below is found you made it clear that you believe Paul did not even understand what he wrote because he was writing under the influence of your version of "the Holy Spirit". Do you not understand or believe that Paul was a Torah Scholar and Pharisee of Pharisees? Your claims are audacious and atrocious to say the least and they are an argument based in nullifying the original intent of the authors so that you may insert your own modern interpretations. How can you not see the massive potential for erroneous disaster if the Scriptures do not mean what the authors intended them to mean when they were written to the audiences to whom they were written? If your argument wins then anyone can claim that the Scripture means anything they want it to mean so long as the claim that "the Spirit told them so!" So as you have stated in your opening remarks here in this thread: If the Scripture says what it means and means what it says then why do you change the meaning of "the Temple of God" according to Paul in the Epistles to the Corinthians when it comes to your interpretation of the Epistles to the Thessalonians? Apparently you are not even capable of coming into agreement with your own words much less those of Paul!

You are accusing me of saying things I never said, or even implied, wresting my words hust as badly as you wrest scripture.


I am not even going to respond to any more of this nonsense.

 

[daq]

You are accusing me of saying things I never said, or even implied, wresting my words hust as badly as you wrest scripture.


I am not even going to respond to any more of this nonsense.

You are continuing to accuse me of "wresting" Scripture as you have done since I began posting here. I have likewise shown you where Yeshua himself claims to be the naos-temple. It is not me who has "wrested" Scripture but yourself in most all of your flesh-minded physical fulfillment prophecy teachings. If you cannot answer any of the difficult questions then why do continue to act as if you know what you speak of when you basically have admitted that you do not simply by your multitude of non-responses to the difficult questions? Yeshua is the Master-Teacher, not you, and therefore his Testimony is what is first and foremost to be upheld before any of your pet theories. We are called to be disciples of the Word rather than to claim the disciples did not really understand what they wrote so that we could insert what it means in the machinations of our vain imagination for today. It is because of the physical and flesh-minded teachings exactly like yours, and the greater shepherds and so-called "prophecy experts" whose names we all know, that now the likewise flesh-minded world is about to be utterly deceived. All that is necessary at this point in humanity is for your puppet masters in Washington and the Kremlin to decide when to push the nuclear trigger because they know they now get to blame it all on "God" because of you and your teachers who are constantly claiming that "The Bible says so!" (yea right; more like *YOU* say "the Bible says so" in the machinations of your vain imagination!).

 

[Old Timer]

So is this what daq is all about here.. Claiming that the man of sin sits in the body of Christ?

So now there's sin in Christ.. It's amazing what men come up with to defile the truth.

 

[By Faith Alone]

Know why Jesus said He was the Temple?