40 Questions

[com7fy8]

Did we ask to be born into sin and death?

no

Who created this situation?

God is indeed in control of all, but He does not cause Satan's spirit to be evil. That problem is of Satan's own nature.

And somehow God takes offense that we are just as he created and planned for us to be? What's up with that?

Again, God has indeed created, using what has its own character that is not good like God. He did not bring the spirit of evil into existence; He just put it into its forms . . . like how humans put nuclear waste into special containers.

What we need to do is make sure that nasty sort of Satan's anger does not spread to us and get us complaining and arguing and being unforgiving and self-righteously looking down on other people, and getting messed up trying to get foolish pleasures which do not love us.

Does God have an anger management problem?

no

When God has wrath about something, He brings a good result to make things better. For example, He is angry at Satan, but He puts Satan in his place so he cannot mess up things like he would. And God uses resistance to manage evil >

"God resists the proud," we have in James 4:6 and also in 1 Peter 5:5.

Therefore, in His anger God is not out of control.

Why do we paint a picture of God that resembles an angry volcano god?

Hell is what might resemble a volcano . . . being a lake of lava.

Wrath is like how sunshine so beneficial can burn a worm that is on a sidewalk. The nature of the worm is the problem.

And fire is wrath only for trash and rubber and a wooden house. But the same fire can make chicken finger-licking good

But Jesus went to the cross and so suffered and died. I would say Jesus would know if there is hell, and so He considered it worthwhile to suffer like that so we don't go there. Because it is so horrible. So, if you don't like hell, trust in Jesus and discover all which God means by His word, for salvation > including how we can personally share with our Father in His own peace, all the time, and grow in this basic of Christianity >

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

And God is almighty; so this peace is almighty to manage anger, to free people from the kind of selfish and uncreative anger you see in people >

"the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus." (in Philippians 4:6-7)

God already is managing the cruel and wicked anger of Satan and his evil spirit which messes with humans. And the spirit and the vessels of such anger are on their way to the flaming . . . volcano. Hell is God's sewer for the selfish and uncreative anger you are seeing in humans. So, hell is good news.

Hell is the place for all the dirty degrading anger and the wrath which messes themselves up and bitterness and unforgiveness and misery and worry of sin. So, already a number of humans are suffering in what will be in hell. They need to get rid of that, by trusting in Jesus and submitting to how our Father cares for us while sharing with us, in His own peace.

 

[GallagherM]

@Clare73 i agree with you on that note even if they fear he’ll but are believing in God that is wonderful. They will receive their reward from God we all will as believers, though those who are not will receive still a spiritual body but a loss in the afterlife being away from God.

I hope that we can go and help them in the afterlife. If that is a choice We can make.

 

[Saint Steven]

Again, God has indeed created, using what has its own character that is not good like God. He did not bring the spirit of evil into existence; He just put it into its forms . . . like how humans put nuclear waste into special containers.

What we need to do is make sure that nasty sort of Satan's anger does not spread to us and get us complaining and arguing and being unforgiving and self-righteously looking down on other people, and getting messed up trying to get foolish pleasures which do not love us.

Are you claiming that humans did not create nuclear waste? And using it as an example of how God didn't create the spirit of evil?

Isn't your description of God as if he is helpless and hapless? As if he created a situation in which he has to contain sin like a disease forever, unable to terminate the problem. ??? Yep, helpless and hapless.

 

[Davy]

Because Satan serves his purpose very well (Romans 9:23).

Really, those that ask that kind of question about why God created Satan show they don't understand what all God's Word teaches about Satan and his original status before he rebelled. God said He made him exalted, and he was perfect in his ways, and served God at the stones of fire (God's Altar). Satan's job was as a covering cherub to guard the Mercy Seat (God's throne). There came a time when Satan coveted that throne for his own, in wanting to be God. This understanding can be found in the parables of Ezekiel 28 and Ezekiel 31, and Isaiah 14.

Thus Satan's status for this present world as the Adversary, was not his original condition. Because he did the first sin, breaking the law, God ended that old world when Satan was perfect in following Him. And instead God brought this present world, and assigned the power of death to Satan. For this world, God uses... Satan against the rebellious. This is something many don't understand; Satan is not co-equal in power with God, for that is the old Zorasterian pagan religious idea. In Isaiah, in a parable about Satan, God applies the idea of Satan being the rod of God's anger, so Satan is used as a punishing rod today. And when this world is over, God will simply cast that punishing rod into the lake of fire. That is actually how God's people are to see Satan.

 

[Tolworth John]

Did we ask to be born into sin and death? Who created this situation? And somehow God takes offense that we are just as he created and planned for us to be? What's up with that?

Does God have an anger management problem? We have human psychiatrists that could help. Maybe some medication? Why do we paint a picture of God that resembles an angry volcano god?

So in asking these questions you do not understand about the holiness of God, or of our responsibility to obey his laws.

Who among your friends naturally seeks God? Ask them to come to church with you. Most will laugh at the idea, a few will refuse. Why do they act like that?

 

[com7fy8]

Are you claiming that humans did not create nuclear waste? And using it as an example of how God didn't create the spirit of evil?

Well, nuclear waste is composed of things which humans did not create. But they did control what that material did.

And God did not bring the spirit of evil into existence, but He has controlled what it does and does not do. But the character of the evil spirit is what makes it able to do what it does. God does not make it that way.

Isn't your description of God as if he is helpless and hapless? As if he created a situation in which he has to contain sin like a disease forever, unable to terminate the problem. ??? Yep, helpless and hapless.

No. God is processing the spirit of evil to where it will stay, in the flaming sewer . . . while also God is bringing His good end for us who have trusted in Jesus . . . right while we are still in the middle of the evil world. This is not hapless, how He is able to so do us good, right while ones are opposing and criticizing this.

You can call Him what you want, but He is doing much better than you are. So, if He is hapless, what are you?? You aren't changing people into the image of Jesus, and you aren't personally guiding people in almighty peace which keeps us from suffering in nasty anger and frustration and being desperate for pleasures to try to make us feel something nicer. I would not say He is hapless if He does this with us.

In case His being almighty does not include being able to take the spirit of evil out of existence, then I see how having the flaming sewer for that stuff is just being practical.

God being almighty does have limits, including how God "cannot be tempted by evil", we have in James 1:13. My opinion is that if God could just take the spirit of evil out of existence, He would have, already. But He is all-controlling with His love purposes.

What would you do with the spirit of evil, if you were not able to take it out of existence, please?

 

[Saint Steven]

So in asking these questions you do not understand about the holiness of God, or of our responsibility to obey his laws.

Who among your friends naturally seeks God? Ask them to come to church with you. Most will laugh at the idea, a few will refuse. Why do they act like that?

I think God wants to have a personal relationship with us. There is nothing personal about a being that claims to be better than us and requires us to keep outdated OT laws. That's ridiculous. If God is too good for us, why would he want to have anything to do with us? What's in it for him? Does he enjoy keeping us under his thumb? Add sadistic to my complaints below.

Saint Steven said: ↑
Did we ask to be born into sin and death? Who created this situation? And somehow God takes offense that we are just as he created and planned for us to be? What's up with that?

Does God have an anger management problem? We have human psychiatrists that could help. Maybe some medication? Why do we paint a picture of God that resembles an angry volcano god?

 

[Saint Steven]

What would you do with the spirit of evil, if you were not able to take it out of existence, please?

There is no such thing as an all-pervasive and unstoppable spirit of evil to my knowledge.

 

[com7fy8]

There is no such thing as an all-pervasive and unstoppable spirit of evil to my knowledge.

There is "the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience," our Apostle Paul says.

I do not think this evil spirit is all-pervasive or unstoppable. But this evil spirit "works" in disobedient people, and has them in torment, already. And you can see how very intelligent and talented people are degraded into very stupidly evil stuff . . . being worked. And humans have not stopped this.

But I understand that God is processing it to the flaming sewer. He is not going to stop it and keep it here, because the earth will be made new for His people.

 

[Saint Steven]

There is "the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience," our Apostle Paul says.

I do not think this evil spirit is all-pervasive or unstoppable. But this evil spirit "works" in disobedient people, and has them in torment, already. And you can see how very intelligent and talented people are degraded into very stupidly evil stuff . . . being worked. And humans have not stopped this.

But I understand that God is processing it to the flaming sewer. He is not going to stop it and keep it here, because the earth will be made new for His people.

Isn't that the spirit of antichrist, who will see an end?

 

[com7fy8]

Isn't that the spirit of antichrist, who will see an end?

I understand . . . Satan and his will see their end on this earth. But they will not come to a total end from existence. "End" can mean different things, of course.

And, by the way, our Apostle John says "the spirit of the Antichrist" "is now already in the world." (in 1 John 4:3).

After the resurrection of God's people, the earth will become the new earth . . . resurrected along with the children of God > Romans 8:20-21 >

"For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God." (Romans 8:20-21)

I have not kept track of when Satan and his will be removed from the earth . . . likely before it is resurrected, since it will not be for them.

And, by the way, Jesus says

"the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father" (in Matthew 13:43)

The sun is hot. We will shine with God's light. And light can burn, even though sunlight is good and can give life; it depends on the nature of what the sunlight touches. I see how we could be hotter than hell would be, for Satan and his, so they won't want to be near us, because of their nature making them able to be burnt.

Because love drives fear away with its "torment" (1 John 4:18). And the spirit of disobedience is the "spirit of fear" (2 Timothy 1:7), and Satan keeps people in slavery by means of "fear of death" > Hebrews 2:14-15. But "our God is a consuming fire," we have in Hebrews 12:29. So, in His love, we can burn Satan and his fear away from us, with its "torment". It says if we submit to God, we can make Satan flee > James 4:7 > burning him away, I now consider.

And worry is a form of fearing death, by fearing however we might lose the selfish lives we want to have. Worry is very cruel and tormenting. God is not the One tormenting people. But their own spirit's character makes them able to give in to the torment of worry. So, ones already have the horribleness of hell, which they could reap (Galatians 6:7-8) so much more once they have no body to use for pleasures to try to feel something nicer. There will be not physical earth, at that time, but only how we have become, spiritually. So, we will be fully how love is, or how Satanic stuff is . . . reaping all the way, one or the other.

If indeed the spirit of evil does not go out of existence, then, its end will not be that it ceases to exist, but that it has gone to its final place to stay there for eternity. A word can have exact opposite meanings, then. And in reading God's word, our own character with our intentions can be exposed, in how we understand or choose to misrepresent what God says

God's word exposes "the thoughts and intents of the heart", we have in Hebrews 4:12.

It is not uncompassionate for the sun to shine, but there are things which can burn in sunlight and even suffer and be killed by sunshine. People can. Jesus is all love, He shines. But there are humans who can be horrified by Jesus > Revelation 6:16. For creatures with a wormy nature, sunshine so life-giving is wrath, because of their own nature.

 

[Tolworth John]

There is nothing personal about a being that claims to be better than us and requires us to keep outdated OT laws. That's ridiculous. If God is too good for us, why would he want to have anything to do with us? What's in it for him? Does he enjoy keeping us under his thumb? Add sadistic to my complaints below.

Let's illustrate it. Imagine you have a great uncle your grandfather's brother..
He is very rich and you as a small child are invited to visit his mansion.
You arrive, are introduced and allowed to play in the garden.
Tea time arrives and you hear this being announced.
You arrive back, covered in dirt, sweat with torn cloths, muddy shoes etc etc and before you can ended it over the soft furnishings you are seized, washed and reclothed in time to to join those at the tea table.


Now that is an illustration a poor one but it demonstrates the attitude of God towards us.

We come to God on his terms, by his method, we don't deserve his love yet we have it.
We don't, or cannot earn his reward all we can do is humbly accept it.

Now you may not like having to be humble or to be grateful for what you don't deserve and cannot earn, that is your problem.

As I first replied to you.

You need to learn about the holiness of God.

 

[Saint Steven]

"For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God." (Romans 8:20-21)

Well, that's telling.
"... not willingly..." ???
Creation was subjected to futility? By whom, if not willingly?
Creation was subjected to futility AGAINST its will.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

40 Questions against traditional Christianity and the doctrine of Hell - Answered

 

[com7fy8]

Well, that's telling.
"... not willingly..." ???
Creation was subjected to futility? By whom, if not willingly?
Creation was subjected to futility AGAINST its will.

As Paul says, "because of Him who subjected it in hope".

To me it seems it was by God.

And He did it "in hope".

 

[Saint Steven]

As Paul says, "because of Him who subjected it in hope".

To me it seems it was by God.

And He did it "in hope".

God subjected the creation to futility? How did he do that?

Saint Steven said: ↑
Well, that's telling.
"... not willingly..." ???
Creation was subjected to futility? By whom, if not willingly?
Creation was subjected to futility AGAINST its will.

 

[com7fy8]

God subjected the creation to futility? How did he do that?

I don't know.

 

[Navair2]

The majority will be saved.

" Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it." ( Matthew 7:13-14 ).

No, the majority of mankind will not be saved.
The majority will sadly end up where we all belong.

That is why anyone who is saved should rejoice in it.

 

[Navair2]

I think that is an Evangelical fallacy. No one chooses to go to hell.

But people still choose to sin, knowing the penalty of it ( Romans 1:30-32 ).
Therefore, they knowingly defy the Lord in the face of certain death...that is what His book says.

 

[Navair2]

I guess you missed understanding what Peter said there then.

How could God, not wishing that any soul perish, then cast those who refuse Him into the future lake of fire? It is based on THEIR CHOICE to refuse Him. It's as simple as that, and a no brainer. You just aren't thinking.

While I do agree with that I've underlined in your quote above,
I also see something you might not have considered here:

" But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up." ( 2 Peter 3:8-10 ).

Who are the "us-ward" here that God is not willing that any perish, but that all come to repentance?
All men everywhere, or the beloved from verse 8?