2 Thess 2:12 teaches eternal security

[LightLoveHope]

This is part of the reason I keep after ya. If you think this is what the Christian way of life is........Your MISSING out on so much.

If following Jesus was so easy you would not fight against it so. If speaking from the heart and letting love flow in all you deeds, you would not bite me so.

This is how Jesus described His ministry

If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love.
John 15:10

What many miss is the how and why. We know as sinner as we start the walk with Jesus, there are many hills to climb and many issues to face. The actual hills and issues are very personal and different. But it is Jesus who needs to be preeminent. I have seen men of God fall, because they assumed they had arrived and yet a clear issue brought them down.

Only at the end do we see our true selves, and whether we have remained true to our beliefs and commitment.

 

[LightLoveHope]

Choice

How can it be we go to hell because we did not choose Jesus, this be justice? You can only choose something you know, else it could be something else to you, which causes confusion. And you have to hear the word to even know what Jesus is.

If you have to actually be in the Kingdom to refuse it, then salvation can be lost, and this choice is the foundation of this theology.

God declares man is lost because of sin. Man is dead, man is not concerned for Gods heart or His reasons or gaining His favour. Mans path is to judgement and destruction.

Jesus declares the light. He declares as the light shines, those called to the Kingdom will come to the light, repent, believe and walk in the light and be the source of light to others as they carry the word of God in their hearts.

But these light carriers can also choose to walk away. Some who discover the light, do fall away again and go back into the darkness.

But those who claim you cannot walk away once you are in the light, have a different gospel. To them Gods people are not people of the light, but pointers to Christ, while being and staying lost sinners.

These two positions are not compatible. One declares defeat and the gospel being an impossible burden, and sin unavoidable, the other declares victory through love and an open heart to God, flowing with His grace and power to the world.

Of course the defeated who believe I am a liar, hypocrite and evil, will never accept these words, because to do so would condemn them, and they would need to repent, which they steadfastly refuse to do. So bad is this conviction, however they are and whatever they believe, they will not accept Jesus calls us to walk a holy walk.

Paul though declares

For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person--such a man is an idolater--has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
Eph 5:5-6

Until this rocks your soul, and shows you our utter lostness without His love and heart, there is no hope for you.

For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
1 Thess 4:7

Until we listen to our emotions and know how they work and who we are, we cannot build the Kingdom, and know how to deal with our impulses that so easily dominate all we do and say. But it all starts here.

Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. Grieve, mourn and wail. Change your laughter to mourning and your joy to gloom. Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.
James 4:8-10

Until you have walked this path, no victory or overcoming will come to pass.
It is here that the doorway to heaven begins, where we die to self and begin to live to Christ.

 

[LightLoveHope]

Possibly instead of quoting John 14:15, in hypocrisy, if we who quote it do not even try to follow it, according to obeying each and every literal command of Christ, it would be better to tell people how to fulfill Christ's law the correct way:
Carry each others burdens(love them) and so fulfill the law of Christ Gal6:2

Hi Timothy,

You assume a lot about others. You also assume a lot about John.
These things are not written in hypocrisy. Loving another is not so hard when you know who we are, our limitations and our struggles.

Our complexity and imprisonment is from the world and the defences and loyalties we have built up in the world. When Jesus starts to change these and build new paths in our souls we find we can love where there used to be anger and hatred, acceptance where there used to be rejection and condemnation.

We think this is impossible. It is not, because when love starts to work within our hearts, we change and become something we do not choose, but which God the potter forms. Letting go and trusting Him, is part of the walk.

We plant our identity, our belonging so deeply into these ideas of who is ok and who is a failure, in Christ the world is very different.

Jesus came with the beatitudes, not so much as aspirations, but the foundations of our hearts in Him.

Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted.
Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled.
Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me.
Matt 5:3-11

Do you feel blessed when you take any of these positions?
We should because God is blessing us in being these things.
This is the true reality of the Kingdom of heaven.

But it is so far from the world and all it aspires to which is the reason the two are so different.

 

[FreeGrace2]

If following Jesus was so easy you would not fight against it so. If speaking from the heart and letting love flow in all you deeds, you would not bite me so.

But you haven't yet describe what biblical love even is, so how do you know how to "let love flow".

Sure sounds sweet and all, but what does it mean? You have not answered that.

This is how Jesus described His ministry

If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love.
John 15:10

OK. Now define this biblical love.

What many miss is the how and why.

Which is why both Gr8Grace and I keep asking you to define biblical love.

 

[Timothy416]

Hi Timothy,

You assume a lot about others.

Not really. In five decades of going to various churches I have found not one person who has even tried to obey each and every literal command of Christ. I doubt the internet is any different. The way to obey Christ's commands is not to look to each and everyone of them and strive to obey them. Christ's teaching can be summed up as: Love God and love your neighbour. Hence Paul tells us that if we carry each others burdens(love them) we fulfil the law of Christ, for love fulfils the law

 

[FreeGrace2]

Choice

How can it be we go to hell because we did not choose Jesus, this be justice?

What kind of silly question is this, from a professing Christian.

I've cited Rev 20:11-15. I guess I'll just have to spoon feed you with it.

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.
13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done.
14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

Given this passage, if you continue to believe that going to hell for not choosing (believing in) Jesus isn't justice, then you HAVE TO reject this passage.

You can only choose something you know, else it could be something else to you, which causes confusion.

Correction. We can only choose what we UNDERSTAND. And when a person is given the gospel, and they understand who Jesus IS and what He DID for everyone, and the results of believing in Him, THEN they have a choice to make.

To believe it or not. It's that simple.

And you have to hear the word to even know what Jesus is.

That is obviously assumed.

If you have to actually be in the Kingdom to refuse it, then salvation can be lost, and this choice is the foundation of this theology.

More correction. One doesn't "have to actually be in the Kingdom to refuse it". That doesn't even make sense. There is no basis for that statement.

Where do you get your information?

God declares man is lost because of sin. Man is dead, man is not concerned for Gods heart or His reasons or gaining His favour. Mans path is to judgement and destruction.

Then why the silly question at the beginning of your post?

But these light carriers can also choose to walk away. Some who discover the light, do fall away again and go back into the darkness.

Sad but true. Jesus noted as much in the parable of the soils, with the second soil, who "believed for a while, and in time of testing, fell away.

However, ceasing to believe doesn't change what Jesus said about those He gives eternal life. They shall never perish, but your emotions won't let you accept the truth and light of Scripture.

Here you talk on about "light" but you yourself are in darkness by rejecting what Jesus said.

But those who claim you cannot walk away once you are in the light, have a different gospel.

This is correct, and describes Calvinists. Of course people can walk away; Jesus said so, as did Paul in 1 Tim 4:1.

Paul though declares

For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person--such a man is an idolater--has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
Eph 5:5-6

More correction. What Paul is saying here clearly is that immoral, impure and greedy persons (believers) will have NO inheritance IN the kingdom of Christ.

What Paul didn't say is that such believers will NOT be IN the kingdom of Christ.

The wording is quite clear.

So, since Paul isn't teaching loss of salvation here, what in the world is he teaching?

He is teaching that such believers (immoral, impure, greedy) will have no part in ownership IN the kingdom, no reward though IN the kingdom.

But this is an advanced doctrine, and you haven't mastered the basics yet.

For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.
1 Thess 4:7

Did you notice that there is no mention in this or any other similar verse about living a holy life for salvation?

Until we listen to our emotions and know how they work and who we are, we cannot build the Kingdom, and know how to deal with our impulses that so easily dominate all we do and say. But it all starts here.

This is the entirety of your problem; listening to your emotions, as if that's the answer to life's problems. The opposite is true. Your emotions get you into trouble, make you a reactor to life's problems.

Here's the truth: until we listen to the Bible and apply the truths therein, we cannot build the kingdom.

Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. Grieve, mourn and wail. Change your laughter to mourning and your joy to gloom. Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.
James 4:8-10

Please explain how to "purify your heart". Specifically.

Until you have walked this path, no victory or overcoming will come to pass.
It is here that the doorway to heaven begins, where we die to self and begin to live to Christ.

More correction. There will be NO victory until one understands the vital issue of fellowship with the Lord, how to have it, and how to be filled with the Holy Spirit, which empowers the believer to live the Christian life.

Are you aware that the Christian life cannot be lived from one's will power?

 

[EmSw]

No, I point out the inconsistencies and lack of faith in the Word when others demonstrate such behavior.

And who gave you such authority? And who decides what lack of faith is? Who are you to judge others?

Wow, really? Are you still on that jag?

Why don't you just tell us you don't believe what Jesus said. Not believing what Jesus told us about entering life by keeping the commandments, shows you only believe what you desire.

I've already shown you HOW one receives eternal life, but since you have rejected those verses, just as LLH has rejected the verses about eternal security, there's really nothing more to add.

Eternal security verses do not show how one receives eternal life. But Jesus did tell us this -

Mark 10:29-31
29 Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or mother, or father, or children, or lands, for my sake, and for the gospel’s sake,
30 but he shall receive a hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

You must reject what Jesus said to fulfill your own interpretation. What a person receives in 'THIS TIME' are houses, brethren, sisters, mothers, children, and lands, but with persecution; AND IN THE WORLD TO COME, ETERNAL LIFE.

Of course, this doesn't come from your lips, because they contradict what you believe.

 

[EmSw]

Amen!!

And if you want eternal life, you must believe (full trust) in the Lord Jesus Christ to give it to you.

John 5:24 - “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

This verse tells us HOW to possess eternal life and teaches eternal security.

It's funny you agree that it is those who hear His word have eternal life, when thousands upon thousands have heard His word, and don't believe His Word, as you. You do not believe His Word where He says, 'if you desire to enter life, keep the commandments'.

It's either you don't desire to enter life, or you don't believe what He said. It's that simple and His Word will prevail over those who don't believe what He said.

John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

This verse informs us of Who gives eternal life, and to whom (believers = His sheep) and eternal security.

This is only to those who believe all of His Words. This is not for 'pick and choosers'. When you pick and choose what you want to believe, His Word holds nothing for you.

1 John 5 -
11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.

More verses about HOW to possess eternal life.

Do you believe these verses?

Now put His Word together; don't leave out parts. Yes, He has given those eternal life, who desire to enter life by keeping His commandments.

 

[EmSw]

If we want to truly live as Christ taught us to live, when people quote the above verse, they should, in honesty and humility admit they themselves do not even try and obey each and every literal command of Christ. Then they will show love and compassion to their brothers and sisters, by not demanding of them what they fail to even try and achieve in their own lives. Crushing others with demands we ourselves deo not even try and keep is definitely not loving them

Why would a true believer not try to obey His commands? Do you have the secret that Jesus did not know? If one does not even try to obey Jesus, how is it they show love and compassion? Do they have this power within themselves.

It's not what I demand, but what the Lord demands. Jesus is 'crushing' others with demands and He Himself did keep them. Do not think I am here to demand anything of you. It is the the Lord Jesus, who is demanding these of you. Do you think the demands of Jesus are of little value?

 

[FreeGrace2]

And who gave you such authority?

What else; Scripture.

And who decides what lack of faith is?

God.

Who are you to judge others?

The Bible describes it as discernment.

This is what Paul says about the subject in 1 Corinthians 5:
11 But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.
12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
13 God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you.”

But I recall your disdain for what Paul wrote.

Why don't you just tell us you don't believe what Jesus said.

Well, that would be stupid, and a lie. For I believe everything He said.

Not believing what Jesus told us about entering life by keeping the commandments, shows you only believe what you desire.

No, I believe what the Bible says a out how to have eternal life. Maybe you just don't understand what "entering life" really means. Huh?

Eternal security verses do not show how one receives eternal life.

Correction needed and given.'

Jesus said He gives eternal life to His sheep in John 10:28. So that's HOW one receives eternal life. But do you believe that?

Jesus also said "whoever believes in Him HAS (possesses) eternal life" in John 5:24, 6:47. And John the Apostle (do you have disdain for his writings as well asw Paul's?) said the same thing in 1 John 5:11, 13.

Do you believe these verses?

But Jesus did tell us this -

Mark 10:29-31
29 Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or mother, or father, or children, or lands, for my sake, and for the gospel’s sake,
30 but he shall receive a hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

You must reject what Jesus said to fulfill your own interpretation.

No I don't. It's just that you fail to understand my position.

What a person receives in 'THIS TIME' are houses, brethren, sisters, mothers, children, and lands, but with persecution; AND IN THE WORLD TO COME, ETERNAL LIFE.

Of course, this doesn't come from your lips, because they contradict what you believe.

No, not at all.

It's your view that is unbiblical; that one must work for salvation. But you'll have plenty of company among the Pharisees when you enter eternity some day.

 

[FreeGrace2]

It's funny you agree that it is those who hear His word have eternal life, when thousands upon thousands have heard His word, and don't believe His Word, as you.

I just love all these opportunities to correct your misunderstandings and errors.

John 5:24 doesn't say only "hear". Here's the verse in its entirety:
“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

Maybe it's just not obvious to you, but one must hear before they believe. How can anyone believe something if they haven't heard what to believe?

The Greek word for "hear" means to understand, not just be able to make out sounds.

You do not believe His Word where He says, 'if you desire to enter life, keep the commandments'.

No, I understand what that means. It's you who don't believe all the verses I've shared.

It's either you don't desire to enter life, or you don't believe what He said.

It's neither of these 2 stupid claims.

It's that simple and His Word will prevail over those who don't believe what He said.

You have directly rejected the verses that teach how one receives eternal life. It's that simple.

This is only to those who believe all of His Words.

Said the hypocrite who doesn't believe all of His words.

This is not for 'pick and choosers'.

This describes your views directly.

When you pick and choose what you want to believe, His Word holds nothing for you.

For sure true in your case.

Now put His Word together; don't leave out parts. Yes, He has given those eternal life, who desire to enter life by keeping His commandments.

Just remember all the company you'll be keeping with the Pharisees some day.

 

[Timothy416]

Why would a true believer not try to obey His commands? Do you have the secret that Jesus did not know? If one does not even try to obey Jesus, how is it they show love and compassion? Do they have this power within themselves.

It's not what I demand, but what the Lord demands. Jesus is 'crushing' others with demands and He Himself did keep them. Do not think I am here to demand anything of you. It is the the Lord Jesus, who is demanding these of you. Do you think the demands of Jesus are of little value?

So you would not invite friends or family home for a meal, but rather the poor, lame, blind and beggars so you may receive your reward in Heaven
If someone stole anything of yours, you would offer them more besides what they stole with nothing but love in your heart for them
If someone wanted to borrow from you, you would gladly give to them without ever expecting anything back
If you have ever fasted, you have not so much as hinted to anyone else you were fasting
If you are persecuted you leap for joy
You love your enemies fully from your heart, those who may be unkind to you or mistreat you


I can go on if you like
BTW
To comply with Jesus teaching, you should respond with complete honesty

 

[LightLoveHope]

Given this passage, if you continue to believe that going to hell for not choosing (believing in) Jesus isn't justice, then you HAVE TO reject this passage.

The passage quoted is those not being found in the Lambs book of Life being thrown into the Lake of Fire.

Jesus put rejecting Him, in these words

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me.
John 6:44-45

He who listens to you listens to me; he who rejects you rejects me; but he who rejects me rejects him who sent me
Luke 10:16

Rejecting Jesus is about rejecting His words. And His words are the words of the Father. If anyone rejects Gods words they are not part of Him.

The Lords truth is eternal. We may react badly to Gods words and aspirations, but He is our saviour and Lord, the one who guides us into the light.

So anyone who says, "I believe in Jesus, but His words condemn me and I cannot listen to them" does not know Him. Jesus's words are life and love, eternity and freedom. They challenge where our treasure is and what we hold most dear to our hearts. Nothing in the world lasts, and it is all struggling against the wind. It is only through love and humbleness do we find true worth and measure. But our pride and desire to be respected that rises up and so easily obscures the very truths of Jesus's message and the way of the Kingdom.

Jesus's Kingdom came on the mountain of transfiguration. Seen only by 3 disciples, anointed by the Fathers words, yet so easily overlooked by believers and its significance miss-understood. The age of the Holy Spirit was dawning, the gifts of indwelling in His people by the Holy Spirit, so easily turned by some into drunken euphoria, without the ability to think, to see or to know the truth. And to others denial of the heart and victory of love flowing from a cleansed spirit, but intellectual assent to salvation via belief without fruit, and without a life reflecting its reality.

the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
Gal 5:22-23

When a wolf comes to destroy ones faith, their fruit is thorns and thistles not the fruit of the Spirit. And in their anger and frustration, they will try and calm themselves down, while disowning and destroying ones foundations and understanding in Christ and in His love. No sheep, no leader, no follower of Christ does this.

 

[LightLoveHope]

Dear brothers and sisters in Christ

When people reject Gods word that we bring with an open heart and in love, they are rejecting the very God we serve.

So take heart, because in doing this they declare they do not know Him

He who listens to you listens to me; he who rejects you rejects me; but he who rejects me rejects him who sent me
Luke 10:16

It troubled me at first how could a brother and sister who knows love, redemption, cleansing, rebuilding, being a child, listening, following, learning and growing in His grace, throw over the very words of Jesus, like they are just legalism and evil. But then I saw, they were sinners who had not repented, who were striving to justify rebellion and struggling against His words. And as they rejected Christ, they rejected me. And worse still, I was evil in bringing what they called condemnation, and that I was a hypocritical liar.

We are called to be light, and the light shows up evil deeds, and asks the question as to why sin has taken such a hold in another. But we are only aware of the light, because for us there are no unresolved issues.

Praise God for His cleansing of our hearts and the knowledge we have in the victory of the cross over sin and death, Amen.

 

[LightLoveHope]

So you would not invite friends or family home for a meal, but rather the poor, lame, blind and beggars so you may receive your reward in Heaven
If someone stole anything of yours, you would offer them more besides what they stole with nothing but love in your heart for them
If someone wanted to borrow from you, you would gladly give to them without ever expecting anything back
If you have ever fasted, you have not so much as hinted to anyone else you were fasting
If you are persecuted you leap for joy
You love your enemies fully from your heart, those who may be unkind to you or mistreat you

I can go on if you like
BTW
To comply with Jesus teaching, you should respond with complete honesty

The answer is yes.
This list obviously declares that you have no aspirations to follow Jesus.
And when we find it hard, we learn how to change our approach and reach out in love. It takes time and humbleness to know this reality.

 

[LightLoveHope]

To comply with Jesus teaching, you should respond with complete honesty

Above all, my brothers, do not swear--not by heaven or by earth or by anything else. Let your "Yes" be yes, and your "No," no, or you will be condemned.
James 5:12

Dear Timothy,

You sound like a rebellious sinner who mocks at the ways of the Kingdom, rather than taking the reality seriously.

Turning the other cheek to insults and hurts is not easy to learn about.
Knowing that our hurts are part of the suffering of Christ, that we can bare as righteous followers of our Lord, is part of carrying our cross daily.

anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.
Matt 10:38

 

[Timothy416]

The answer is yes.
This list obviously declares that you have no aspirations to follow Jesus.
And when we find it hard, we learn how to change our approach and reach out in love. It takes time and humbleness to know this reality.

It is not love to demand of others what you do not demand of yourself. For it is not love to crush others with things you do not demand of yourself. Love is building your brother or sister up, not promoting self as someone who leads an extremly holy life and others need to be where you are in order to receive salvation. That is showing no love to your neighbour. The second greatest commandment is being ignored

 

[Timothy416]

Above all, my brothers, do not swear--not by heaven or by earth or by anything else. Let your "Yes" be yes, and your "No," no, or you will be condemned.
James 5:12

Dear Timothy,

You sound like a rebellious sinner who mocks at the ways of the Kingdom, rather than taking the reality seriously.

Turning the other cheek to insults and hurts is not easy to learn about.
Knowing that our hurts are part of the suffering of Christ, that we can bare as righteous followers of our Lord, is part of carrying our cross daily.

anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.
Matt 10:38

I refer you to my response just given

 

[LightLoveHope]

It is not love to demand of others what you do not demand of yourself. For it is not love to crush others with things you do not demand of yourself. Love is building your brother or sister up, not promoting self as someone who leads an extremly holy life and others need to be where you are in order to receive salvation. That is showing no love to your neighbour. The second greatest commandment is being ignored

But I do demand loving my neighbour as myself.
You assume no one does this, ie all are in rebellion.

And you fail to understand love and holiness. It has never been about show but about reality. Our focus in life in the world is on our happiness, our security, our success.

In Christ our focus is on others and helping them in the best way we can. For me this has been a search in theology, in life, in love to find the words, the concepts that convey the very love Jesus has planted in my soul and my heart echoes to.

You have turned love and righteousness into condemnation and evil. All I can say is you do not know what evil is and how it crushes people, and what love and empathy is given from a pure loving heart. I have seen both.

Many confuse the failure to connect with people, and to know them, as not part of loving another. They believe loving God is a spiritual thing, and loving others is just putting up with them, though they are not worthy of any attention at all.

I know with my children, connecting and empathy is the core issue in loving another, and getting alongside them in their situation, part of the reality of being Christ to them.

But a cleansed open heart, resolved and grounded in the cross and love is essential, or else everything gets turned merely to self indulgence. And what I find most from people who take your position, is a closed heart and a rejection that God resolves and changes who we are, at a fundamental level, so we are a new creation in Him. The old boundaries and limits have gone, behold the new is here.

But oddly though people declare this "spiritually" they deny its outworking in their life or the need to see it, for the spiritual to be real. And all that is left is rebellion against Jesus's words, which is just a rejection of the gospel in the delusion eternity has arrived.

"I murdered someone" "Oh it does not matter, God has forgiven you, so whatever you do cannot change this reality"

But the reality is if you can murder someone, your treasure is not in heaven but on the earth, and your desire the kingdom of this world more than the kingdom of heaven. And in justice all the judgement due for sinners is due for you.

 

[LightLoveHope]

Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also may be tempted.
Gal 6:1

If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over.
But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that 'every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.'
If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.
"I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."
Matt 18:15-18

Sin is not part of our walk or our fellowships. We are not open to wickedness or rebellion against love or Gods law.

For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
What harmony is there between Christ and Belial? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?
What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people."
2 Cor 6:14-16

Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness
2 Tim 2:19