The Power Of One Article

keras · Mar 21, 2025

Jamdoc said:
If you add works, it's not grace.

As 1 Corinthians 3:15 says: those whose works are worthless, are still saved but only by the skin of their teeth.
People who have misled others by promoting false theories, are the best example. They will receive no rewards and will occupy a lowly position in the Kingdom.

Jamdoc · Mar 22, 2025

keras said:
As 1 Corinthians 3:15 says: those whose works are worthless, are still saved but only by the skin of their teeth.
People who have misled others by promoting false theories, are the best example. They will receive no rewards and will occupy a lowly position in the Kingdom.

Yes, they're still saved.
That's the point. they weren't saved by works
works can result in rewards on top of salvation, but it isn't the basis of salvation.

Minister Monardo · Mar 22, 2025

Mr. M said:
These are they which came out of great tribulation,
and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues,
standing before the throne and before the Lamb,

This great multitude includes every martyr since Steven and James the son of Zeb in Acts.
Has not tribulation followed the Gospel globally, as the Lord promised?
Has every martyr washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb?

There is no decapitation for rejecting the beast as in Rev 20, who are assigned exclusive roles in the Millennium,
and they are blessed by immunity to the second death.
This is not said of the great multitude in Rev 7.

Jamdoc · Mar 22, 2025

so you agree, then why do you profess that salvation needs works?

keras · Mar 22, 2025

Jamdoc said:
so you agree, then why do you profess that salvation needs works?

The Parable of the Talents tells you why.

keras · Mar 22, 2025

Mr. M said:
9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues,
standing before the throne and before the Lamb,

This great multitude includes every martyr since Steven and James the son of Zeb in Acts.

This multitude is all the living Christians who survived the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.
They are not dead, nowhere does Rev 7 say that and they are on earth, in the holy Land, as described in the first 3 verses.

Jamdoc · Mar 22, 2025

keras said:
The Parable of the Talents tells you why.

but 1 Corinthians 3 shows works burned up but they're still saved. That means those works weren't worth anything. They weren't saved by them.

Minister Monardo · Mar 22, 2025

keras said:
This multitude is all the living Christians who survived the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.
They are not dead, nowhere does Rev 7 say that and they are on earth, in the holy Land, as described in the first 3 verses.

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,

This takes place on earth??

Minister Monardo · Mar 22, 2025

keras said:
This multitude is all the living Christians who survived the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.
They are not dead, nowhere does Rev 7 say that and they are on earth, in the holy Land, as described in the first 3 verses.

What does a worldwide disaster have to do with washing robes in the blood of the Lamb?

keras · Mar 22, 2025

Mr. M said:
What does a worldwide disaster have to do with washing robes in the blood of the Lamb?

The terrible shock of the Sixth Seal, will be our great test of faith. 1 Peter 4:12
Those who maintain their faith and trust in the Lord on that Day, will be deemed to have cleansed themselves and will receive white robes. Hebrews 6:12

Jeffrey Bowden · Mar 30, 2025

Mr. M said:
Revelation 7:
KJV:
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me,
What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me,
These are they which came out of great tribulation,
and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

NKJV:
13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me,
“Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”
14 And I said to him, “Sir, you know.”
So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation,
and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

We see one difference in comparing the translations; the modern version adds the article 'the', changing the meaning to the saints who have gone through great tribulation beginning in Judea shortly after Pentecost, to some future event that people refer to as 'The Great Tribulation", which apparently the Church will not experience if they are gathered before said tribulation. So who are being persecuted during "The Great Tribulation"?

Note: the article 'the' is not in the original. Surely an agenda is afoot.

The GM (“great multitude”) will, in Rev 7:14, come out of the GT (“great tribulation”), but that is not where they originated.

Please read Rev 7:16. The GM were once unbelievers. We know this because Rev 7:16 proves they were subjected to God’s wrath in the Trib. Famine and scorching heat are mentioned in Rev 7:16. Those are part of the 21 judgments of God’s wrath in the Trib. The famine begins in Rev 6:8 (the 4th seal) and the scorching heat occurs in Rev 16:8 (the 4th bowl).

There are billions of unbelievers who will enter the Trib. Many will see their mistake in rejecting Jesus.

The 144k (Rev 7:1-8) act as evangelists in the Trib. They facilitate the salvation of anyone willing to repent and accept Jesus as their Savior. Millions of new converts will be made this way in the Trib.

All of the new converts give public testimony of Jesus Christ, and they are killed for this testimony by the hsrdcore unbelievers in the Trib.

All of the new converts become martyrs. The first group of martyrs ends up under the altar in Rev 6:9. In verse 11, they are told they must wait a while more for their “fellow servants” to be killed as they were.

Those fellow martyrs are found in Rev 20:4. All of the martyrs from the Trib are resurrected together in the last sentence of Rev 20:4. They are then seen in Heaven, in Rev 7:9-17. In Rev 7:10, the first word they sing is “Salvation!” They are glorifying God for saving and removing them from the Trib.

Jeffrey Bowden · Mar 30, 2025

keras said:
The terrible shock of the Sixth Seal, will be our great test of faith. 1 Peter 4:12
Those who maintain their faith and trust in the Lord on that Day, will be deemed to have cleansed themselves and will receive white robes. Hebrews 6:12

Keras, what’s to test of someone whose sins have been blotted out? What’s to test of someone who cannot boast for any reason for being saved?

Where are the believers in Rev 6:15-17 since everyone on Earth gathers for the 6th seal? All there behave only as unbelievers for running to hide from an alleged sighting of Jesus.

You are altering the Bible and teaching falsehoods.

keras · Mar 30, 2025

Jeffrey Bowden said:
Keras, what’s to test of someone whose sins have been blotted out? What’s to test of someone who cannot boast for any reason for being saved?

1 Peter 4:12 and several other scriptures, tell us how the Lord will test His people. We must prove our trust in the Lord for His protectio during all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

The Sixth Seal will be an unexpected disaster, which all people will experience. There will be no escape from it.

Jeffrey Bowden said:
You are altering the Bible and teaching falsehoods.

What you consistently do, as you promote the false rapture theory.

Jeffrey Bowden · Mar 31, 2025

keras said:
1 Peter 4:12 and several other scriptures, tell us how the Lord will test His people. We must prove our trust in the Lord for His protectio during all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

The Sixth Seal will be an unexpected disaster, which all people will experience. There will be no escape from it.

What you consistently do, as you promote the false rapture theory.

Show me the believers in Rev 6:15-17, Keras.

Your Preterism is on the chopping block. It’s full of falsehoods.

Jamdoc · Mar 31, 2025

Jeffrey Bowden said:
The GM (“great multitude”) will, in Rev 7:14, come out of the GT (“great tribulation”), but that is not where they originated.

Please read Rev 7:16. The GM were once unbelievers. We know this because Rev 7:16 proves they were subjected to God’s wrath in the Trib. Famine and scorching heat are mentioned in Rev 7:16. Those are part of the 21 judgments of God’s wrath in the Trib. The famine begins in Rev 6:8 (the 4th seal) and the scorching heat occurs in Rev 16:8 (the 4th bowl).

There are billions of unbelievers who will enter the Trib. Many will see their mistake in rejecting Jesus.

The 144k (Rev 7:1-8) act as evangelists in the Trib. They facilitate the salvation of anyone willing to repent and accept Jesus as their Savior. Millions of new converts will be made this way in the Trib.

All of the new converts give public testimony of Jesus Christ, and they are killed for this testimony by the hsrdcore unbelievers in the Trib.

All of the new converts become martyrs. The first group of martyrs ends up under the altar in Rev 6:9. In verse 11, they are told they must wait a while more for their “fellow servants” to be killed as they were.

Those fellow martyrs are found in Rev 20:4. All of the martyrs from the Trib are resurrected together in the last sentence of Rev 20:4. They are then seen in Heaven, in Rev 7:9-17. In Rev 7:10, the first word they sing is “Salvation!” They are glorifying God for saving and removing them from the Trib.

What does Jesus say happens immediately after the tribulation of those days in Matthew 24?

When does that happen in Revelation, before the trumpets and bowls or after the trumpets and bowls?

If it happens before the trumpets and bowls, what does that say about what tribulation is when Jesus says that the sun and moon darken after the tribulation?
What would that make the trumpets and bowls then?

keras · Mar 31, 2025

Jeffrey Bowden said:
Show me the believers in Rev 6:15-17, Keras.

Revelation 6:15 The Kings of the earth, the nobles and the commanders, and all people, slave or free.......

What you must provide is any scripture that says the faithful peoples will be removed from the Lords Day of wrath.
As there is no such scripture, we can all see what a false teacher you are.

Jeffrey Bowden · Mar 31, 2025

Jamdoc said:
What does Jesus say happens immediately after the tribulation of those days in Matthew 24?

When does that happen in Revelation, before the trumpets and bowls or after the trumpets and bowls?

If it happens before the trumpets and bowls, what does that say about what tribulation is when Jesus says that the sun and moon darken after the tribulation?
What would that make the trumpets and bowls then?

The seals and trumpets are in the first half of the Trib. Matt 24:15 is accepted as the midpoint of the Trib. That toughly aligns with the 7th trumpet sounding in Rev 11:15 (which occurs shortly before the midpoint).

What happens immediately after the Trib is Matt 24:29 (the Trib is seen to have ended). Then, Matt 24:30 will occur which is the 2A (2nd Advent).

Jeffrey Bowden · Mar 31, 2025

keras said:
Revelation 6:15 The Kings of the earth, the nobles and the commanders, and all people, slave or free.......

What you must provide is any scripture that says the faithful peoples will be removed from the Lords Day of wrath.
As there is no such scripture, we can all see what a false teacher you are.

Rev 4:1 is the verse that raptures the Church to Heaven before the Trib, before “the hour of trial” as Jesus called it, in Rev 3:10. Jesus also said in Rev 3:10, “You will be kept from the hour of trial.” Rev 3:10 is unfulfilled. It will be fulfilled upon the pre-Trib rapture, being Rev 4:1. That is why you can’t find any verse that says believers enter the Trib. All believers are raptured pre-Trib.

keras · Apr 1, 2025

Jeffrey Bowden said:
Rev 4:1 is the verse that raptures the Church to Heaven before the Trib, before “the hour of trial” as Jesus called it, in Rev 3:10. Jesus also said in Rev 3:10, “You will be kept from the hour of trial.” Rev 3:10 is unfulfilled. It will be fulfilled upon the pre-Trib rapture, being Rev 4:1.

Revelation 4:1-2 refers exclusively to John. No mention of anyone else. Your belief is wrong.
Revelation 3:10, will be fulfilled by the Lord protecting His own people.

Jeffrey Bowden said:
That is why you can’t find any verse that says believers enter the Trib

Revelation 12 and 13 both mention Gods people as being on earth during the 3 1/2 year period of world Satanic control.

The rapture to heaven theory is a false teaching and will never happen.

Jeffrey Bowden · Apr 1, 2025

keras said:
Revelation 4:1-2 refers exclusively to John. No mention of anyone else. Your belief is wrong.
Revelation 3:10, will be fulfilled by the Lord protecting His own people.

Revelation 12 and 13 both mention Gods people as being on earth during the 3 1/2 year period of world Satanic control.

The rapture to heaven theory is a false teaching and will never happen.

Rev 12 is exclusively about Jews. 70% of the Bible is exclusively about Jews. They are on a different track in the Trib.

Rev 13 is about new converts who become martyrs who fulfill Rev 6:11’s requirement for “fellow servants” to be killed for the GM.

The Power Of One Article

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Watching and Praying Always

Well-Known Member

Watching and Praying Always

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Watching and Praying Always

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Well-Known Member

Watching and Praying Always

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Well-Known Member

Similar threads