The hypocrisy of "repent of your sins" salvation

Swag365 said:

Huh? Are you suggesting here that literally every action that a man does is sinful?

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Just try to stop thinking of each action as either good or bad and realize that without God we are an outcast species, unacceptable to God. The fact that God nevertheless purposes to save some or all of us despite our unworthiness is the big story of the Bible.

But most people, I suspect, go on thinking that "this will please God, but that will anger him, and I can make up for the latter one if I do X, etc."

This makes life an endless contest of pleasing God (and thereby earning merit) or doing something wrong (and being back on the "outs" with him).

Albion said:

Just try to stop thinking of each action as either good or bad and realize that without God we are an outcast species, unacceptable to God. The fact that God nevertheless purposes to save some or all of us despite our unworthiness is the big story of the Bible.

But most people, I suspect, go on thinking that "this will please God, but that will anger him, and I can make up for the latter one if I do X, etc."

This makes life an endless contest of pleasing God (and thereby earning merit) or doing something wrong (and being back on the "outs" with him).

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Thanks for your fine opinion, but I already have a spiritual director. I do not want another one.

I wanted to know whether you were suggesting that literally every action that a man does is sinful. Is this a part of your theology, or did you state too much in your initial post?

If you don't want to answer the question, that's perfectly fine.

Swag365 said:

Thanks for your fine opinion, but I already have a spiritual director. I do not want another one.

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Then you can stop asking me these questions.

Albion said:

Then you can stop asking me these questions.

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If only there were another Anglican.

Swag365 said:

If only there were another Anglican.

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There are others here. You can always turn to the Anglican subforum with your questions, so long as they are in keeping with the Statement of Purpose.

BibleBeliever1611 said:

The Bible teaches that it's possible to commit sins without even knowing that it was a sin. So my question for those people who teach that you need to repent of your sins in order to have your sins forgiven, would be, did you repent of every sin that you committed? You certainly didn't. Everyone has committed sins through ignorance without even realizing that it was wrong.

Are you supposed to tell God, "I'm so sorry for committing this mystery sin that I don't even know that I committed"? That doesn't make any sense. How can you be sorry for something that doesn't exist, or you don't remember?

I heard Paul Washer say, "I didn't repent of what I did, I repented of what I was."

He probably meant that he repented of the fact that he was a sinner. But the only reason why anyone would know that they are a sinner is because they know that they have broken God's law. However, you can never know about every little sin that you committed. It's foolish to think you can. And this "repent of your sins for salvation" teaching is also foolish and unbiblical. The Bible never says "repent of your sins" even though people repeat that phrase like a parrot.

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Actually, it all depends on what dispensation you're in. I get your point, and it's a good one, generally, in so far as it matches church-age doctrine, but the doctrine of repentance is not the same monolithic doctrine all across the Bible. I go through many verses in sundry dispensations here:

George Antonios said:

Actually, it all depends on what dispensation you're in. I get your point, and it's a good one, generally, in so far as it matches church-age doctrine, but the doctrine of repentance is not the same monolithic doctrine all across the Bible. I go through many verses in sundry dispensations here:

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Paul says,

1. We can fall from grace (Galatians 5:4).
   
   
2. We can be moved away from the hope (Colossians 1:23).
   
   
3. We can be a castaway (1 Corinthians 9:27).
   
   
4. We can be cut off just like the Jews if we do not continue in God’s goodness (Romans 11:20-22).
   
   
5. We can sow to the flesh and reap corruption instead of sowing to the Spirit which reaps everlasting life. (Galatians 6:8).
   
   
6. We can deny God by a lack of good works (Titus 1:16).
   
   
7. We can shipwreck our faith (1 Timothy 1:19).
   
   
8. We can deny the faith and be worse than an infidel if we do not provide for our own household (1 Timothy 5:8).
   
   
9. We can err from the faith and pierce ourselves thru with many sorrows if we love and covet after money (1 Timothy 6:10).
   
   
10. Hymnenaeus and Philetus have overthrown the faith of some (2 Timothy 2:18).
    

George Antonios said:

Actually, it all depends on what dispensation you're in. I get your point, and it's a good one, generally, in so far as it matches church-age doctrine, but the doctrine of repentance is not the same monolithic doctrine all across the Bible. I go through many verses in sundry dispensations here:

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Paul says,

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

3 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing,..." (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble."
(James 4:6).

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:21-22).

19 "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21).

9 “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. “ (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

5 "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affe
ction, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them." (Colossians 3:5-7).
5 “...God;
6 ...will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law” (Romans 2:5-12).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

So things are not as you say.

Bible Highlighter said:

Paul says,

1. We can fall from grace (Galatians 5:4).
   
   
2. We can be moved away from the hope (Colossians 1:23).
   
   
3. We can be a castaway (1 Corinthians 9:27).
   
   
4. We can be cut off just like the Jews if we do not continue in God’s goodness (Romans 11:20-22).
   
   
5. We can sow to the flesh and reap corruption instead of sowing to the Spirit which reaps everlasting life. (Galatians 6:8).
   
   
6. We can deny God by a lack of good works (Titus 1:16).
   
   
7. We can shipwreck our faith (1 Timothy 1:19).
   
   
8. We can deny the faith and be worse than an infidel if we do not provide for our own household (1 Timothy 5:8).
   
   
9. We can err from the faith and pierce ourselves thru with many sorrows if we love and covet after money (1 Timothy 6:10).
   
   
10. Hymnenaeus and Philetus have overthrown the faith of some (2 Timothy 2:18).

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All true, and none spoke of loss of salvation.

BibleBeliever1611 said:

The Bible teaches that it's possible to commit sins without even knowing that it was a sin. So my question for those people who teach that you need to repent of your sins in order to have your sins forgiven, would be, did you repent of every sin that you committed? You certainly didn't. Everyone has committed sins through ignorance without even realizing that it was wrong.

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The Bible teaches that repentance of sins is the "fruit" of someone
who has already been regenerated (born again).


Repentance is always the RESULT of regeneration and never
the CAUSE.* Moreover, those regenerated produce different levels
of "fruit"... some thirty-fold, others sixty-fold and some one hundred
fold. But ALL who are regenerated repent and produce fruit.


* If repentance is the CAUSE of regeneration then we have
a "works gospel" where MAN initiates salvation and then God
is OBLIGATED to save that man. That is a false gospel.

.