Another Trump lie that matters:

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Aldebaran

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Remember when Trump promised he'd never cut Medicare or Social Security? Guess what?

His last budget proposal called for a total of $1.9 trillion in cost savings from mandatory safety-net programs, like Medicaid and Medicare. It also called for spending $26 billion less on Social Security programs, the federal retirement program, including a $10 billion cut to the Social Security Disability Insurance program, which provides benefits to disabled workers.

Spending on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid is expected to cost the federal government more than $30 trillion through 2029, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

Mr. Trump’s willingness to consider such cuts marks a shift from four years ago, when he stood out in a field of deficit-minded Republicans in the 2016 primary race with a promise to shield entitlements from cuts.
Trump Opens Door to Cuts to Medicare and Other Entitlement Programs

Those lavish tax cuts he got for himself and his friends, didn't "pay for themselves" as he said they would.


So someone has to pick up the tab. He thinks that retired people should be the ones to pay for the tax cuts.

Did anyone really believe he'd keep his word?

From the article:
Mr. Trump suggested that curbing spending on Medicare, the government health care program for the elderly, was a possibility.
“We’re going to look,” he said.
The interview left many questions unanswered, including whether Mr. Trump would consider touching Social Security or what part of Medicare he would be willing to shave.


This sure doesn't make it sound like he cut anything. However, even a reduced rate of increase in spending is now labeled as being a cut. But not even that has been done.
 
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JLB777

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Do you hold yourself to the same degree of honesty to which you hold Trump?

What Trump said was he'd not cut SS benefits. Trump has been unabashed in his efforts to cut government spending. The two, government spending and SocSec benefits, are not necessarily mutually exclusive conditions and when it is argued to omply otherwise that is a false dichotomy.

Furthermore, I just wen to the ss.gov website and according to that source SS benefits are slated to increase this year with a COLA increase of 1.6% (one to two tenths below inflation), following a COLA increase of 2.8% last year, and a 2% increase the year before. This is comparable to the previous administration.

Would you not say it is a good thing to make sure benefits keep up with the cost of living while making sure government costs are managed more effectively? If so then why isn't this op giving the man credit for something that should have been done every year for the last 30 or 40 years?

Revenues under Trump have set records. Well above the current rate of inflation. This, in and of itself, isn't anything particularly novel because the US economy has been expanding similarly for decades. What is worth noting is that we were all told such growth was impossible and Trump's bragging about being able to boost the economy was impossible. We were told 1% growth would be amazing.

Now it hasn't made much difference because the House is the part of the government that controls the purse strings, and the House has spent the money at a rate greater than that which is brought in. It's almost always been that way going beck to the early 1900 under Wilson. Once in a blue moon there will be a "balanced" budget (they don't truly reconcile to zero when all legislated expenditures are counted).

So, again, why isn't this op giving POTUS credit where credit is due and not applying the same metric to Congress that it applies to POTUS?

I've never traded posts with you, Barbarian, so I don't know you history. Have you ever given the current POTUS credit for anything done correctly or well?

One last question: Is the NYTimes reliable as an objective news source?


MAGA!


The winning just keeps coming and the dims just keep crying!



JLB
 
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Aldebaran

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MAGA!


The winning just keeps coming and the dims just keep crying!



JLB

The tears are going to flow as rivers when November comes!
 
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The Barbarian

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From the article:
Mr. Trump suggested that curbing spending on Medicare, the government health care program for the elderly, was a possibility.
“We’re going to look,” he said.
The interview left many questions unanswered, including whether Mr. Trump would consider touching Social Security or what part of Medicare he would be willing to shave.


This sure doesn't make it sound like he cut anything.

Trump's proposal would cut $465 billion from Medicare providers such as hospitals...The Trump budget is a blueprint written under Washington rules as if he could enact it without congressional approval. It relies on rosy economic projections of 2.8% economic growth this year and 3% over the long term — in addition to fanciful claims of future cuts to domestic programs — to show that it is possible to bend the deficit curve in the right direction. The economy grew by 2.1% last year.
Trump's election year budget proposal slashes Medicaid, other social safety nets
 
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The Barbarian

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We took a big step in 2018. Still some work left to do.

The winning just keeps coming

That's what Trump said when he made the mid-term elections a referendum on himself. He lost, but America won.
 
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Aldebaran

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Trump's proposal would cut $465 billion from Medicare providers such as hospitals...The Trump budget is a blueprint written under Washington rules as if he could enact it without congressional approval. It relies on rosy economic projections of 2.8% economic growth this year and 3% over the long term — in addition to fanciful claims of future cuts to domestic programs — to show that it is possible to bend the deficit curve in the right direction. The economy grew by 2.1% last year.
Trump's election year budget proposal slashes Medicaid, other social safety nets

Aldebaran observes:

"....all while leaving Social Security and Medicare benefits untouched."
 
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The Barbarian

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The tears are going to flow as rivers when November comes!

Maybe so...
A growing number of Republicans are privately warning of increasing fears of a total wipeout in 2020: House, Senate, and White House.

House Republicans in swing districts are retiring at a very fast pace, especially in the suburbs of Texas and elsewhere. (Republicans talk grimly of the "Texodus.") Rep. Greg Walden — the top Republican on the House Energy and Commerce Committee, and the only Republican in Oregon's congressional delegation — yesterday shocked the party by becoming the 19th GOP House member to not seek re-election.
The Republican Senate majority, once considered relatively safe, suddenly looks in serious jeopardy. Democrats are raising more money, and polling better, than Republican incumbents in battleground after battleground.
...
President Trump trails every major Democratic candidate nationally and in swing states — and his favorable ratings remain well under 50%.
The biggest recent change is Republicans' increasingly precarious hold on the Senate.

National Journal's Josh Kraushaar writes ... "If Trump doesn’t win a second term, Democrats only need to net three seats to win back the majority."
...
third-quarter fundraising reports showing three Republican senators being out-raised by Democratic challengers (in Arizona, Iowa and Maine) "are a three-alarm fire."

https://www.axios.com/republican-pa...ump-3ca4a371-cdfb-4213-9ff0-2cf058aa7537.html
 
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Josheb

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It's not that complicated. With more people qualifying for Social Security, if you cut the amount of money available, someone has to get less than before.
You're repeating yourself in different words.

You are not proving anything.
It's not an investment. It's insurance. Look it up.
rotflmbo! Yes, it is labeled "insurance." But in fact of reality it is not and the fundamental premise of both that article and this discussion is that you're not assured of your insurance. Nor is this the best means of providing for insurance.
How Social Security Works

Social Security is an insurance program. Workers pay into the program, typically through payroll withholding where they work. They can earn up to four credits each year.
Social Security[/indent]
Don't be obtuse. I can insure my future in much more effective ways than giving that money to the government. Given the fact I have to give the government that money for "insurance," there are ways for both the mney and the administration of that money to be a profitable endeavor, not one chronically in jeopardy.
But that error alone is enough to derail your argument, but you probably don't care because you're more ideological than you care to admit.
Except 1) you haven't proven benefits will suffer nor 2 anything I actually posted incorrect.

Give this article HERE a read.

Or this article HERE, and notice how they spin the percentages coming out ahead (82-21%) and not reporting 18 to 79 percent lose money. If you do a little research you'll also find most of these tax revenues get spent on Medicare, which is money that goes to the medical industry, not the SocSec citizen recipient. You're 72. Could you live on your SocSec? Had you invested that same money in money markets could you live on it? Which would be more likely the better "insurance"?



And you're still not addressing the original concern: the NYTiemes doesn't report anything but an announcement of consideration. Nothing has actually changed.

And you have not proven otherwise.
 
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The Barbarian

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As an incumbent Republican running in a swing state in the same year an unpopular president is up for reelection, Iowa’s Joni Ernst already had a target on her back. In light of controversial comments on Social Security, a struggling farm economy and an impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump, her path to a second term has become more difficult.

Ernst’s photo was the lead image in a Morning Consult article released today, detailing the woes of “2020’s most vulnerable Senate Republicans.”

According to Morning Consult’s latest poll of registered voters, Ernst’s net approval rating had dropped 9 percentage points, the “biggest slide among vulnerable senators.”

The poll “places her underwater with Iowa voters,” with 39% approving of Ernst and 43% disapproving.
Ernst In Trouble As More Ads On Social Security, Impeachment Target Her | Iowa Starting Line
 
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Josheb

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It won't, only so long as there are only a few independent sources....
Proving my point.
So I look at the information, keeping an open skepticism, and it works better than anything else I can do.
The method is good and commendable, and shared. The application flawed. Use more diversity and more objectivity. Doing so will bring you a better outcome. If nothing else meaningless fluff like this NYTimes article won't be considered veracious and your skepticism will actually have worked for you (and the rest of us).


Do please give Tuchman's book a read.
 
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Aldebaran

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President Trump trails every major Democratic candidate nationally and in swing states — and his favorable ratings remain well under 50%.
The biggest recent change is Republicans' increasingly precarious hold on the Senate.

Perhaps you should be telling this to the democrat candidates themselves. On stage during the debate, they themselves had to keep reminding each other that the important thing was to have a candidate that can beat Trump. Aside from everything else being at least secondary, it indicates that even the dems running for president don't believe those polls that claim Trump loses to any of them in an election.
 
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The Barbarian

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Barbarian observes:
It's not that complicated. With more people qualifying for Social Security, if you cut the amount of money available, someone has to get less than before.

You're repeating yourself in different words.

It's simpler language, but it's still true. You can't repeal math for being politically incorrect.

You are not proving anything.

I'm just pointing out a fact.

rotflmbo! Yes, it is labeled "insurance."

Because it's an insurance program. That's how it works.

But in fact of reality it is not and the fundamental premise of both that article and this discussion is that you're not assured of your insurance.

You were perhaps under the impression that any insurance policy is absolutely guaranteed? Private policies are based on less assurance, unless they are backed by the government. Which has had fewer failures to pay; private insurers or Social Security?

Yep.

Nor is this the best means of providing for insurance.

Fact remains. If you have more people qualifying, and less money allocated to pay, benefits will be cut. No imaginative accounting will change that.
 
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The Barbarian

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Barbarian observes:
It won't, only so long as there are only a few independent sources. When when had the local paper and three networks, everyone got the same stuff, and there was little need to pander to a particular political demographic.

Proving my point.

Yep. But that world has passed. Today, you've got to be more careful and sample more sources.

Do please give Tuchman's book a read.

She seems to have been indoctrinated in the ideology of postmodernism. That alone sets off some cautions.

"However, this framing theory is the development of cognitive psychology and anthropology [4]. Furthermore, it has been adopted by other disciplines, such as sociology [5], economics [6], linguistics [7], social movements [8], policy research [9], communication science [10], public relations research [11], and health communication [12]. The purpose of framing is to convey meaning and to focus the public's attention on the part of the message or topic, as well as to get a good response. ..."

Uh, yeah... it ain't Barbara Tuchman, that's for sure.
 
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The Barbarian

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Perhaps you should be telling this to the democrat candidates themselves.

Let's take a look...
RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Biden
RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders
RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Bloomberg
RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Buttigieg
RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Warren

They differ only in how many points they have over Trump.

On stage during the debate, they themselves had to keep reminding each other that the important thing was to have a candidate that can beat Trump.

At the moment, we don't have any who can't beat Trump. :scratch:
 
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Aldebaran

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The Barbarian

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Like I said, tell it to the democrat candidates.

They seem to already know. So do the republicans, it seems...

Republicans fear 'suburban revolt' against Trump in 2020

Secret recording of Texas House speaker and influential conservative indicates worries about waning support in suburbs
Some Republicans are sounding the alarm over Donald Trump’s devastating effect on their support among suburban voters.

The latest evidence of panic came in a secret audio recording of a conversation between Dennis Bonnen, speaker of the Texas house of representatives, and an influential conservative activist.

According to the Washington Post, Bonnen can be heard saying: “I just think we’ve got to get through 2020, guarantee if we try and hold this majority – which, with all due respect to Trump, who I love by the way – he’s killing us in the urban-suburban districts.”
Republicans fear 'suburban revolt' against Trump in 2020
 
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Aldebaran

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They seem to already know. So do the republicans, it seems...

Republicans fear 'suburban revolt' against Trump in 2020

Secret recording of Texas House speaker and influential conservative indicates worries about waning support in suburbs
Some Republicans are sounding the alarm over Donald Trump’s devastating effect on their support among suburban voters.

The latest evidence of panic came in a secret audio recording of a conversation between Dennis Bonnen, speaker of the Texas house of representatives, and an influential conservative activist.

According to the Washington Post, Bonnen can be heard saying: “I just think we’ve got to get through 2020, guarantee if we try and hold this majority – which, with all due respect to Trump, who I love by the way – he’s killing us in the urban-suburban districts.”
Republicans fear 'suburban revolt' against Trump in 2020

Yes, but on the other hand: 'We can lose this election': what top Democrats fear could go wrong in 2020

But as they seek to oust Trump in 2020’s election what most worries many top Democrats is what’s shaping up in their own party: an extended Democratic primary resulting in a fractured party struggling to rally around the eventual nominee.

That’s the overall sentiment of Democrats based on interviews with over a dozen senior party figures – including ex-mayors and former governors – and top strategists during a chaotic month in the Democratic primary leading up to the Iowa caucuses.

Recent polling has shown the progressive senator Bernie Sanders surging in Iowa, to the chagrin of centrist Democratic leaders who hoped a candidate like former vice-president Joe Biden or even the young and charismatic former South Bend, Indiana, mayor Pete Buttigieg might score an early win.

Even though the field has now shrunk from two dozen candidates, Democrats are increasingly expecting a drawn-out primary with deep-pocketed frontrunners bashing each other and long-shot candidates refusing to drop out, further splintering the vote and leaving scars that will last in the general election.
 
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Aldebaran

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Yes, it's their election to lose. But they can lose it.

Hillary proved that.

It's going to be harder to lose this one, though. People know what Trump is, and that's killing him.

They've also watched the impeachment fiasco and they've seen how the democrats behave after they lose. Since then, the president's approval rating has gone up even more. I wouldn't say that he's the one being killed here.
 
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The Barbarian

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Hillary proved that.

Trump's only hope is that they run a campaign as badly as Clinton did.

tedium060617.gif


They've also watched the impeachment fiasco

Yep...

The Cook Political Report, Inside Elections and Sabato’s Crystal Ball, three nonpartisan election services, estimate that between five and seven incumbent Senate Republicans are at risk of losing their seats, as do two incumbent Democrats.
There's something else at stake in Trump impeachment: control of U.S. Senate

Since then, the president's approval rating has dropped again.

Iowa
Trump 43% approve 55% disapprove. Worst since he was inaugurated.
Trump approval down in new state polling

I wouldn't say that he's the one being killed here.

Iowans would. So would voters in Wisconsin, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Michigan:
 
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