Can we find Eden, the biblical site of our origin?

guevaraj said:

Brother, Israel is told to observe Passover when they enter the land. The Passover sacrifice is offered during the light period and is eaten during the night period and the law says that they must eat the meat on the day they offer it, making one day the commonly known light first followed by the night and not as the Jews assumed the night first because of the way instructed to remember the Sabbath in Israel as a time displaced from the local seventh day in Israel from what was in Eden.

God was giving instruction on what to do when they enter the promised land and the Passover confirms that the Sabbath is not the local seventh day in Israel as it was in Eden. United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

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LittleLambofJesus said:

I was looking over the event of Passover in Exodus 12, I noticed the word "destroyer<h7843> used.
I would like to compare that to the word "destroyer<623> used in Revelation 9:11.
First the OT and NT verses along with the Hebrew Greek words used:

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

7843 shachath a primitive root;
to decay, i.e. (causatively) ruin (literally or figuratively):--batter, cast off, corrupt(-er, thing), destroy(-er, -uction), lose, mar, perish, spill, spoiler, X utterly, waste(-r).
שָׁחַת (shachath), occurs 147 times in 136 verses

Exo 12:11
11 ‘And thus you shall eat it: with a belt on your waist, your sandals on your feet, and your staff in your hand. So you shall eat it in haste. It is the LORD’s Passover<6453>.
23 And Yahweh passes<5674> to strike the Egyptians and He sees the blood on the lintel and on two of the jambs and Yahweh passes-over<6452> the portal and not He shall allow the ruiner/destroyer<H07843>/<G1842 oleqreuonta> to come to houses of ye to strike.[Revelation 9:11]
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623. Apolluon active participle of 622; a destroyer (i.e. Satan):--Apollyon.
622. apollumi ap-ol'-loo-mee from 575 and the base of 3639; to destroy fully (reflexively, to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively:--destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.
3639. olethros from a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. death, punishment:--destruction.

The destroyer mentioned in Exodus 12:23 is also mentioned in Revelation 9:11 concerning 1st century Jerusalem:

Revelation 9:11
and they are having of them a king the Messenger of the Abyss, name to him to Hebrew abaddwn <3>, and in the Greecian name is having destroyer/apolluwn<623/622> [Exodus 12:23]
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Was it just coincidence that Titus and the Roman army came upon Jerusalem during the feast of the Passover?

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive @ PreteristArchive.com, The Internet's Only Balanced Look at Preterist Eschatology and Preterism
The Historical Fall of Jerusalem in AD70
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover; and it is deserving of the very particular attention of the reader, that this was the anniversary of that memorable period in which the Jews crucified their Messiah! At this season multitudes came up from all the surrounding country, and from distant parts, to keep the festival. How suitable and how kind, then, was the prophetic admonition of our LORD, and how clearly he into futurity when he said "Let not them that are in the countries enter into Jerusalem." Luke xxi. 21.
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Revelation 6:6
And I hear a voice in midst of the four living-ones saying: "a measure of grain/wheat a denari and three measures of barleys a denari,
and the oil and the wine no you should be injuring"."

............................

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Christ is Lord said:

I’m pretty sure I didn’t distort the scriptures. But as is usually the case with Adventist, they like to condemn anyone (by quoting scripture such as that) because they presume that they are God’s remnant people and everyone’s denominational beliefs is error. All I can say is I hope you meet you in heaven, brother.

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mmksparbud said:

Again--Please do not take this persons views as belonging to all SDA's!! Not even close. Jesus rose on the 1st day of the week, He died on fri, preparation day.

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Der Alter said:

None of this states that gentiles are required to observe the Sabbath.

Romans 14:5-6
(5) One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
(6) He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
​

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guevaraj said:

Brother, Israel is told to observe Passover when they enter the land. The Passover sacrifice is offered during the light period and is eaten during the night period and the law says that they must eat the meat on the day they offer it, making one day the commonly known light first followed by the night and not as the Jews assumed the night first because of the way instructed to remember the Sabbath in Israel as a time displaced from the local seventh day in Israel from what was in Eden. This displacement of 10 hours before the local seventh day in Israel marks the site of Eden from Israel because the Sabbath in Israel is remembered at a different time than God kept in Eden on the first seventh day of the creation week.

When the Lord goes through the land to strike down the Egyptians, he will see the blood on the top and sides of the doorframe and will pass over that doorway, and he will not permit the destroyer to enter your houses and strike you down. “Obey these instructions as a lasting ordinance for you and your descendants. When you enter the land that the Lord will give you as he promised, observe this ceremony. (Exodus 12:23-25 NIV)​

God was giving instruction on what to do when they enter the promised land and the Passover confirms that the Sabbath is not the local seventh day in Israel as it was in Eden. United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

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Elteqay said:

So you think those weak in the Faith Pa'al is discussing are the believers who want to keep the Sabbath and don't want to eat pork or other unclean animals that Elohim said was not food ?
No where in the Renewed Covenant did The God of all Creation change the Sabbath. It is a sign forever to those who Love GOD.

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guevaraj said:

The Bible shows me that Eden falls on the International Date Line (IDL). Genesis 1:3-5 shows that the first day is from light to light or from morning to morning. In Israel, the Sabbath is not the seventh day of the week as it was in Eden: Israel remembers to keep the seventh-day Sabbath established in Eden holy by remembering the Sabbath in the time zone of Eden from evening to evening, ten hours before its local seventh day of the week from morning to morning in obedience to God's instructions. This shift of ten hours point to the site of Eden from Israel and fall on the International Date Line. The International Date Line comes from all of us from the beginning: when God taught the human race to count the days with the week to remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy; before humanity spread throughout the world. This tradition of counting days established the International Date Line without us appreciating its significance in our history until these last days. I have written a book on the subject, "Proof of God in the International Date Line: Site of our Origin", available on all major platforms. I welcome everyone to challenge my point of view. I am willing to provide a free PDF copy to influential people who can promote this book through reviews or other means. Sincerely, Jorge

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Der Alter said:

What/who do you mean by "Pa'al?" I assume it is a pejorative term for Paul.
There is a person named Παῦλος/Paulos in the NT. Παῦλος means "little." There is no word "Pa'al" in Biblical Greek .
I quoted scripture which you did not address. Which part of that scripture do you not understand?
I addressed the Sabbath and gentiles did you not understand my post?
Only 9 commandments are mentioned in the NT as applicable to gentiles. The sabbath is not mentioned in the NT as applicable to [/QUOTE

I understood your post, you quoted Scriptures from Torah and yes the Ger keeps the Sabbath, no different today as Roman's 11 says you're grafted into Israel. From where I sit, the only one having a hard time understanding is you.

You give Roman's 14 and I asked you if you thought the weak in Faith were the ones keeping the Sabbath and not wanting to eat pork or other unclean animals that God said was not food.

You totally missed Genesis 2:3 where Elohim made Holy the Sabbath day.

Pa'al goes to worship 84 times in Acts on the Shabbat.

Pa'al is a Hebrew word for worker, why would Shaul change his name to Paul a Greek name...when he died to his self.

This I know, you will not keep the 4th Commandment until Messiah opens your eyes. Heaven and earth will pass away before one jot or tittle of the Torah passes away.

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Elteqay said:

I understood your post, you quoted Scriptures from Torah and yes the Ger keeps the Sabbath, no different today as Roman's 11 says you're grafted into Israel. From where I sit, the only one having a hard time understanding is you.
You give Roman's 14 and I asked you if you thought the weak in Faith were the ones keeping the Sabbath and not wanting to eat pork or other unclean animals that God said was not food.
You totally missed Genesis 2:3 where Elohim made Holy the Sabbath day.
Pa'al goes to worship 84 times in Acts on the Shabbat.
Pa'al is a Hebrew word for worker, why would Shaul change his name to Paul a Greek name...when he died to his self.
This I know, you will not keep the 4th Commandment until Messiah opens your eyes. Heaven and earth will pass away before one jot or tittle of the Torah passes away.

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Der Alter said:

Living within the gates of Israel is different than being grafted into Israel.

Exodus 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger [גרך] that is within thy gates:
Deuteronomy 5:14 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger [גרך] that is within thy gates; that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.
Deuteronomy 16:14 And thou shalt rejoice in thy feast, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, and thy manservant, and thy maidservant, and the Levite, the stranger, [גרך] and the fatherless, and the widow, that are within thy gates.
Deuteronomy 24:14 Thou shalt not oppress an hired servant that is poor and needy, whether he be of thy brethren, or of thy strangers that are in thy land within thy gates:
Deuteronomy 26:12 When thou hast made an end of tithing all the tithes of thine increase the third year, which is the year of tithing, and hast given it unto the Levite, the stranger [גרך] , the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within thy gates, and be filled;
Deuteronomy 31:12 Gather the people together, men, and women, and children, and thy stranger [גרך] that is within thy gates, that they may hear, and that they may learn, and fear the LORD your God, and observe to do all the words of this law:
Mark 7:19 For it doesn't go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)
Acts of the apostles 10:11-15
(11) And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
(12) Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
(13) And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
(14) But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
(15) And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.​

Saul did not change is own name.

Acts of the apostles 13:9 Then Saul, (who also is called Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him,​

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guevaraj said:

begin

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Der Alter said:

<GJ>Brother, I think the most important part of this discovery is that it shows that Jesus did not resurrect on Sunday, exposing Sunday as an invented tradition that the bishops of Rome have pushed as a replacement for the Sabbath because they believe they are the leaders of the church of Jesus with an authority superior to the word of God through the prophets, when God never wanted a king over Israel because He is our king. The popes of Rome are a repetition of the sin of rejecting God as our king by wanting another king over the church.

The people all said to Samuel, "Pray to the LORD your God for your servants so that we will not die, for we have added to all our other sins the evil of asking for a king." (1 Samuel 12:19 NIV)​

United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge<GJ>
According to Justin Martyr the church worshiped on Sunday about 900 years before there was a bishop is Rome who could replace anything.

Justin [A.D. 110-165.]The First Apology. Chap. LXVII. — Weekly Worship of the Christians.
And we afterwards continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Ghost. And on the day called Sunday,76 all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things.
But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.​

There is another rumor about passion week. There was only one Sabbath in passion week, the weekly sabbath.
The first day of the feast of unleavened bread fell on the Sabbath, making it a "high Sabbath." Even if it did not ULB was a holy convocation not a sabbath. All work, including preparing and cooking food, was prohibited on the sabbath but the preparation and cooking of food was specifically permitted on the first and seventh day of ULB.

Exodus 12:15-16
(15) Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.
(16) And in the first day there shall be an holy convocation, and in the seventh day there shall be an holy convocation to you; no manner of work shall be done in them, save that which every man must eat, that only may be done of you.​

All four gospels agree that Jesus was crucified on parasceue, which means preparation. Parasceue was and still is the Greek name for the day we call Friday. ULB did not have or need a day of preparation. Thus there was only one sabbath during passion week.

​

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Elteqay said:

Like I said, you will not keep the 4th Commandment until Elohim opens your eyes.
My....what a Scripture twister you are, Peter's vision is not about unclean animals becoming clean, this sheet with the animals did this 3 times in the vision, ....gentiles were considered dogs which are unclean, verse 19 Peter was pondering the vision and the Spirit said to him to go with the 3 men without hesitation. Elohim cleansed gentiles not animals. You need to rethink what you have been taught and not read into Scripture things that are not there.

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Christ is Lord said:

I hope I am not sounding harsh but you're wasting your breath with @guevaraj. I posted basically what said in this thread here.
He's trying to twist history where it suits him. All we can do is pray for him because he is still our brother.

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Der Alter said:

I might warn the unwary about the misinformation.

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guevaraj said:

When a prophet writes under inspiration, it is not the prophet who speaks, but God speaks through her and the prophet does not have to understand what she is writing. For our prophetess it may have seemed a good adaptation for children, but it was not the words she wrote under inspiration, she delegated the art of adapting it for children to an uninspired writer.

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guevaraj said:

Sister, our prophetess did not say that Jesus died an a Friday in the book: "The Story of Jesus" that you probably read as a child. When a prophet writes under inspiration, it is not the prophet who speaks, but God speaks through her and the prophet does not have to understand what she is writing. For our prophetess it may have seemed a good adaptation for children, but it was not the words she wrote under inspiration, she delegated the art of adapting it for children to an uninspired writer. This did not concern the Lord because His words were in the other book, "the Desire of Ages" she actually wrote for those who are aware of the difference between an inspired work and an uninspired work; like the translations of our Bibles come from people that are not inspired.

The Saviour was buried on Friday, the sixth day of the week. The women prepared spices and ointments with which to embalm their Lord, and laid them aside, until the Sabbath was past. Not even the work of embalming the body of Jesus would they do upon the Sabbath day. (The Story of Jesus, page 157)​

This book read by many children in the church is an uninspired "adaptation" for the children of her real inspired words for the book "The Desire of Ages", where that statement is not found. She wrote "day of preparation" and someone without inspiration adapted it for the children by interpreting "Friday" when in monthly lunar Sabbaths the day of preparation can fall on any day of the week and it is not always Friday. United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

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