On demand abortion is murder

Davidnic said:

So we are to do what they command when evil leaders command it because their law is Gods law and Gods Morality to use your phrasing. Even if that means that preaching Christ is illegal and we do not do it because it is local law. Even when it means that we hand over the innocent to death?

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Yup. Follow the law...no, I mean follow scripture, for the sake of conscience.

Davidnic said:

Do what is good and you will receive his approval. Evil does not approve good. The implication also of not a terror to good conduct is that they are godly rulers. To argue differently ignores context.

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I didn't write this:

Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.

redleghunter said:

Does financial means change the moral worth of a human being developing in the womb?

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The government has controlled the system and it gears all towards giving society one option. Being healthy itself is overly expensive, just check the price on a salad to a hotdog. Our education system is seriously overpriced that people end up being held in financial prison called loans, in fact there are a lot of girls who end up going to inappropriate content just so they can have the money to stay in school and have a future. Now you have the medical industry, everything is so expensive that it is rather cheaper for the person to die. This is also a factor as to why women decide to do abortion..
We are in the belly of the beast.

SkyWriting said:

Yup. Follow the law...no, I mean follow scripture, for the sake of conscience.

Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.

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So the Apostles were wrong to preach Christ when Rome said it was illegal.

SPF said:

This is honestly nothing short of asinine and utterly false. In fact, I would be willing to bet money that you couldn't find a single credible theologian who actually agrees with you.

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Could be. I got the idea from obscure scripture. No one has raised scriptural opposition so far.

Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.

redleghunter said:

Keep reading Daniel past chapter 2.

Also, the first rule of holes is stop digging.

In your universe you as a Christian would have to turn in other Christians in China and other despotic nations.

Are you truly going to defend that?

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Not a scriptural rebuke. Sorry.

Again I think we see where the logic needed to allow abortion leads. No matter the argument it usually comes to some logical extension of the reasoning that can not be justified.

SPF said:

If we follow this out logically, then we could say that cold blooded murder of adults does not kill souls or spirits, only flesh. Yet, I'm pretty sure we would say that cold blooded murder of adults is immoral and wrong.

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"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."

So yes, it is true that the killer of even the adult, only kills the flesh.
The only thing is, the adult has breathe the breath of life.....and became a living soul......we are almost certain that the body was attached to a soul/spirit. Im not so certain that the soul/spirit attaches before the breath.....but this is only important to the one who believes that they are the soul and not the body.

I would not be for needless termination of human bodies or animals.. However, I do believe a life meant for a body that was terminated will still get to live.

Davidnic said:

Again I think we see where the logic needed to allow abortion leads. No matter the argument it usually comes to some logical extension of the reasoning that can not be justified.

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I honestly believe that no one would justify it........The issue is that there are those who would condemn those that do not condemn this act........Those who choose to honor another's free will in this matter.

dogs4thewin said:

It feel and you are free to disagree with me that if done in the first trimester it should be legal, and therefore by that logic it is not murder ( otherwise I would be saying murder should be legal which of course not.

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We are people at conception ,psalm51:5
Jeremiah was know by God before he was born,jer1:5

SkyWriting said:

Could be. I got the idea from obscure scripture. No one has raised scriptural opposition so far.

Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience.

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He uses the term uJperecouvsai in connection to those in high places.

It has the connotation of a high quality of goodness. Justness. Good rulers. So...it does not mean what you think it means. And we could go through this over and over...verse after verse after verse. But this is why no theologian agrees with your view. And why there are many things refuting it.

ICONO'CLAST said:

We are people at conception ,psalm51:5
Jeremiah was know by God before he was born,jer1:5

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Wouldnt this be proof that we are "here" even before the flesh is conceived? How then, can the decision of a Dr or state or mother, affect us?

SkyWriting said:

These women should be given life in prison? I don't feel that is scriptural.
I don't think God would approve of them found guilty of murder.

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Numbers 35 is clear, blood defiled the land. Nothing cleanses the land but the blood of the murderer.
The murderer shall surely be put to death.

redleghunter said:

Keep reading Daniel past chapter 2.

Also, the first rule of holes is stop digging.

In your universe you as a Christian would have to turn in other Christians in China and other despotic nations.

Are you truly going to defend that?

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Obey local government.

1 Peter 2:13-17
Be subject for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme, or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good.

ICONO'CLAST said:

Numbers 35 is clear, blood defiled the land. Nothing cleanses the land but the blood of the murderer.
The murderer shall surely be put to death.

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So women who have abortions and their doctors should be put to death.
I remember the arguments. I'm no fan.
A Brief History of Deadly Attacks on Abortion Providers

Titus 3:1
Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work,

SkyWriting said:

Obey local government.

1 Peter 2:13-17
Be subject for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme, or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good.

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Also Peter in action (Acts 5:28-29) we see that submission does not mean always obedience and that when human law opposes God we go with God.



So as we see Peter could not have meant what you incorrectly interpret.

So you are wrong or Peter is a hypocrite. Add this to the Greek that disproves your view of the other verse. This is going to keep happening if people want to keep refuting. I have to make supper. But again...there are reasons theologians for 2000 years have not held your version of these passages and have opposed the verses being used to justify all kinds of horrible things.

And that reason is they do not mean what you interpret them to mean.

God alone

RaymondG said:

Wouldnt this be proof that we are "here" even before the flesh is conceived? How then, can the decision of a Dr or state or mother, affect us?

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God alone Is in control of body ,soul/spirit.1 thess5:23.
There is a physical body, there is a spiritual body.1 cor15
The psalm 139 speaks of God knowing our substance being yet informed. Raymond...think that out slowly, read and reread how such knowledge was too wonderful for him
Then picture the abortionist crushing the babies skull in the birth canal

That degenerate governor in ny was laughing when signing a bill allowing abortion right up to birth
That smirk face will not be there at the white throne judgment.

Davidnic said:

Also Peter in action (Acts 5 28-29) we see that submission does not mean always obedience and that when human law opposes God we go with God.

28 “We gave you strict orders not to teach in this name,”he said. “Yet you have filled Jerusalem with your teaching and are determined to make us guilty of this man’s blood.”

29 Peter and the other apostles replied: “We must obey God rather than human beings!​

So as we see Peter could not have meant what you incorrectly interpret.

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He was speaking to a panel of Bishops and to the High Priest.
Legally, I don't know the context. Is that the correct context
for your sermon? If that is what you intended, speaking to
a high priest and panel....is that all you got? It's really kind
of historical and not very "instructional" as my dozen passages.

James 1:26
If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person's religion is worthless.

SkyWriting said:

Yes, and my argument is that your local law is God's Law now.

1 Peter 2:13-17
Titus 3:1
1 Timothy 2:1-3

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Sorry but God's law is revelation from God, it is not reasonable to equivocate the authority of the law of God in Scripture with local laws which may be contradictory from one locality to another.