Evidence for a gap of time between Gen.1:1 and Gen.1:2

Quasar92

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It has long been debated whether there exist a vast period between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2. Opposing authors have eloquently presented their own views and also their skepticism of the opposition. Yet, neither side has presented their view with an eye on the eternal plan of God. Unless the opposing sides mutually agree on the purpose and plan of God, neither can reconcile nor modify their position. We at Charis Seminary have chosen the Gap theory because it is the only one that seems to address the plan of God as it is completely revealed in the Bible. Instead of maligning the Gap theory, the reason for a Gap must be settled, once and for all.

Opponents of the Gap say that it was first developed by Dr. George Chalmers of Edinburgh University in 1814 in an attempt to incorporate George Culvers concepts of geologic castasrophism into a biblical framework. It was finally popularized in the footnotes of the “Scofield Reference Bible”, in 1917. However it was Arthur Custance, Without Form and Void, who revealed that the Gap theory had been periodically referred to for centuries. It is this fact that demands that we take a serious look at the Gap. Christian teachers and authors have long alluded to an apparent Gap between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2. Long before either George Culvers or Charles Darwin had presented their theories on the age of the earth and the evolution of the species, Christians were investigating a Gap in the creation account. So, the original investigation of the Gap had nothing to do with either the age of the earth or evolution. Unfortunately, no reason for the Gap could be found and therefore no real investigation was begun and completed.

The reason that no one could find a purpose for the Gap lay in the fact that until recently, the Plan of God and the true purpose for the Church were not understood. In our short exercise entitled “The Plan Of God” it was shown that Gods plan revolves around His desire to share His love with creation. This was not possible to an omniscient God who could see that eventually all creatures possessing freewill would make decisions outside of His will. Therefore a way had to be found to allow creation to make mistakes without suffering the terrible consequence of judgment from God’s immutable righteousness. Since it has always been Gods purpose to share His love with His creatures by entering into creation by means of mankind, one can only conclude that the omniscience of God found the entrance of sin a necessary component of His Plan. God’s essence dictated how the plan was to be accomplished, and He has recorded enough of His purpose in the Bible for the children of God through the illumination of the Spirit to understand His plan and purpose.

We therefore, have one more link in the chain of evidence supporting the contention that the view did not originate with Chalmers at all, but predated Chalmers as well as modern geologist by some 2500 years. It was not until 1814 or some 50 years later that Dr. Chalmers attempted to reconcile the Divine and geologic records in an Examination of Cuvier’s Theory of the Earth. Chalmers paper stated that the first act of creation was that of creating something from nothing, and that the first day’s work recorded in Genesis may have taken place after long periods of time. He further stated the earth may have had “a fair residence of life” but it had become desolate: and that although the sun, moon, and stars continued their existence in relationship to the earth, they had somehow become obscured. In itself, this was no new thought to the very learned theologian of the day, but it did begin a trend in certain Christian quarters which laid emphasis on what is now called the “Gap Theory”.

How Chalmers’ work became the premier document for proponents of the Gap, and how he became known as the one who popularized this theory is confusing; since at that time, the belief in an interval between Gen.1.1 and 1.2 was already well document. Even more confusing is why so many “Young Earth Theorist” refuse to acknowledge the real history of the Gap and persist to declare that it is of early origin. However, whether through ignorance and lack of scholarly research or purposely omitted in order to lend credence to an even more implausible theory of creation, Young Earth Theorist have perpetrated a great injustice to the truth and an even greater injustice to their readers. As we shall later see, only an interval can explain the complete purpose of God in creating man in order to bring into existence His true purpose … the creation of His Church. For now it can confidently be stated that the belief in an interval between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2 is the foundational belief of the early Church and of Judaism. Science finally caught up with the truth that has always been in scripture, and even as archeology now proves the accuracy of Biblical history, geologic science proves the accuracy of the origins of this earth as presented in the Bible. “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth”. The Church was the main opponent to the acceptance of the earth being round and revolving around the sun. I hope history will not record that we were also the main opponents to the scientific evidence as to the age of the earth.

What the true Bible scholar should be doing is determining why man was recently introduced into such an old universe. Since there shall never be a missing link found by science to continue any form of belief in evolution, the next step is for man to begin thinking he was placed here by some alien race. The universe is indeed old, yet man is a very recent addition to it, the question is why. The teleological proof of the existence of God demands that we recognize that the order in the universe also includes time. Since history is a component of time, even the history of the freewill of the creatures that live within time, as measured by the fixed units of measure that transpire within time (ie …. The rotation of the earth and the moon around the sun, etc.) is an effect who’s existence finds its source from a cause. God did not cause Angelic creation to fall. Yet, the fall of the perfect Angelic crea tion was a necessary part of His plan. Therefore, Angelic freewill became the cause of the fall as a part of God’s plan. Because of that fall, God caused man to be placed in time at what seems to be billions of years since time began. Man is therefore an effect with purpose and plan caused by God. Only the science of theology can explain mans recent entrance into Gods created universe. As we shall see, God has not left us blind. Yet, only with the recognition of a interval or Gap between Gen. 1.1 and 1.2, can a complete Biblical understanding be sought and eventually found as we look at what God has openly declared to us is the end of the entrance of man.

For much more go here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Origin...a/message/2461


Quasar92
 
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Halbhh

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I wonder if just explaining anything even helps at all for someone caught up in preaching and defending their viewpoint about Genesis chapter 1. It may for a very few (so I suppose for those few it's good).

What they need isn't really a better theory or a better knowledge (not even that!), but instead to actually trust (fully) God!

What they actually need is more faith.

So that instead of fearing God's truth or power or His existence somehow depends on their viewpoint about Genesis chapter 1 -- instead of feeling this is God's basis -- they could, with the reassurance of more faith, be less attached to their doctrine because they would no longer cling to it in fear. With more faith, they'd finally be able to see it's only a viewpoint, some assumptions about things not specified, and not the actual scripture. (The actual scripture does not say either way how much time passed in verse 1)

What would give them more faith? Paul tells us only the good news of the gospel itself is the way to faith. (Romans chapter 10, verse 17)

In other words, they need to read the gospel accounts, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John (or again), and not imagine they already know all about the gospel!

Just like all of us. Every person needs this. But of course, it's severely needed when it's not being done much. How might we aid them in that?
 
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geiroffenberg

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The gap theory only is needed for people that sees the verses on a timeline. The first verse serves rather as a headline, and the story starts with the world beingempty and dark. GOd did not create the world empty and dark so something had gone on before that, and therefore we can conlcude that while mans fall was at the tree of knowledge of good and evil, the fall of creation happened before verse 2 in chapter 1.
This also makes sense from the fact that the world was empty and had to be "restored" (the word uses, replenished) so at one point it must have been made perfect and something gone wrong.
Also satan was evil and existed before the fall of man!
So definitly there was a fall of some sort, involving satan, BEFORE the story told in genesis. We know from the last book of the bible that satan was driven out of heaven to earth. This then can only fit before verse 2. Gap or not, something still went on before that verse, i think its self evident by the text in genesis 1-3. However, what earth was before verse 2 may have been referred to other places in the bible. IMO there can not have been any difference between heaven and earth, so basically the state of the material universe as we conceive it, was a fall from heaven itself. Hope it makes sense. Im rambling. gotta stop. hey hey hey.
 
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SeventyOne

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For some time now, I've considered myself a young earth recreationist for a variety of reasons. The earth is older than we think, but at some point God recreated what was on the earth and made what we have now, including man, some 6,000 years ago.

In essence, we read about an upcoming new earth. I don't think that's the first time it's been made new. Peter said the last time the earth was destroyed, it was by water. He references the creation of earth out of the water, and not the flood of Noah's day, and the earth covered by water is where Genesis picks up. He then further references the next time it's destroyed it will be by fire, and that will be when we have the prophesied new earth. As fire will precede the next earth, water preceded this version.
 
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Soyeong

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It has long been debated whether there exist a vast period between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2. Opposing authors have eloquently presented their own views and also their skepticism of the opposition. Yet, neither side has presented their view with an eye on the eternal plan of God. Unless the opposing sides mutually agree on the purpose and plan of God, neither can reconcile nor modify their position. We at Charis Seminary have chosen the Gap theory because it is the only one that seems to address the plan of God as it is completely revealed in the Bible. Instead of maligning the Gap theory, the reason for a Gap must be settled, once and for all.

Opponents of the Gap say that it was first developed by Dr. George Chalmers of Edinburgh University in 1814 in an attempt to incorporate George Culvers concepts of geologic castasrophism into a biblical framework. It was finally popularized in the footnotes of the “Scofield Reference Bible”, in 1917. However it was Arthur Custance, Without Form and Void, who revealed that the Gap theory had been periodically referred to for centuries. It is this fact that demands that we take a serious look at the Gap. Christian teachers and authors have long alluded to an apparent Gap between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2. Long before either George Culvers or Charles Darwin had presented their theories on the age of the earth and the evolution of the species, Christians were investigating a Gap in the creation account. So, the original investigation of the Gap had nothing to do with either the age of the earth or evolution. Unfortunately, no reason for the Gap could be found and therefore no real investigation was begun and completed.

The reason that no one could find a purpose for the Gap lay in the fact that until recently, the Plan of God and the true purpose for the Church were not understood. In our short exercise entitled “The Plan Of God” it was shown that Gods plan revolves around His desire to share His love with creation. This was not possible to an omniscient God who could see that eventually all creatures possessing freewill would make decisions outside of His will. Therefore a way had to be found to allow creation to make mistakes without suffering the terrible consequence of judgment from God’s immutable righteousness. Since it has always been Gods purpose to share His love with His creatures by entering into creation by means of mankind, one can only conclude that the omniscience of God found the entrance of sin a necessary component of His Plan. God’s essence dictated how the plan was to be accomplished, and He has recorded enough of His purpose in the Bible for the children of God through the illumination of the Spirit to understand His plan and purpose.

We therefore, have one more link in the chain of evidence supporting the contention that the view did not originate with Chalmers at all, but predated Chalmers as well as modern geologist by some 2500 years. It was not until 1814 or some 50 years later that Dr. Chalmers attempted to reconcile the Divine and geologic records in an Examination of Cuvier’s Theory of the Earth. Chalmers paper stated that the first act of creation was that of creating something from nothing, and that the first day’s work recorded in Genesis may have taken place after long periods of time. He further stated the earth may have had “a fair residence of life” but it had become desolate: and that although the sun, moon, and stars continued their existence in relationship to the earth, they had somehow become obscured. In itself, this was no new thought to the very learned theologian of the day, but it did begin a trend in certain Christian quarters which laid emphasis on what is now called the “Gap Theory”.

How Chalmers’ work became the premier document for proponents of the Gap, and how he became known as the one who popularized this theory is confusing; since at that time, the belief in an interval between Gen.1.1 and 1.2 was already well document. Even more confusing is why so many “Young Earth Theorist” refuse to acknowledge the real history of the Gap and persist to declare that it is of early origin. However, whether through ignorance and lack of scholarly research or purposely omitted in order to lend credence to an even more implausible theory of creation, Young Earth Theorist have perpetrated a great injustice to the truth and an even greater injustice to their readers. As we shall later see, only an interval can explain the complete purpose of God in creating man in order to bring into existence His true purpose … the creation of His Church. For now it can confidently be stated that the belief in an interval between Gen. 1:1 and 1:2 is the foundational belief of the early Church and of Judaism. Science finally caught up with the truth that has always been in scripture, and even as archeology now proves the accuracy of Biblical history, geologic science proves the accuracy of the origins of this earth as presented in the Bible. “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth”. The Church was the main opponent to the acceptance of the earth being round and revolving around the sun. I hope history will not record that we were also the main opponents to the scientific evidence as to the age of the earth.

What the true Bible scholar should be doing is determining why man was recently introduced into such an old universe. Since there shall never be a missing link found by science to continue any form of belief in evolution, the next step is for man to begin thinking he was placed here by some alien race. The universe is indeed old, yet man is a very recent addition to it, the question is why. The teleological proof of the existence of God demands that we recognize that the order in the universe also includes time. Since history is a component of time, even the history of the freewill of the creatures that live within time, as measured by the fixed units of measure that transpire within time (ie …. The rotation of the earth and the moon around the sun, etc.) is an effect who’s existence finds its source from a cause. God did not cause Angelic creation to fall. Yet, the fall of the perfect Angelic crea tion was a necessary part of His plan. Therefore, Angelic freewill became the cause of the fall as a part of God’s plan. Because of that fall, God caused man to be placed in time at what seems to be billions of years since time began. Man is therefore an effect with purpose and plan caused by God. Only the science of theology can explain mans recent entrance into Gods created universe. As we shall see, God has not left us blind. Yet, only with the recognition of a interval or Gap between Gen. 1.1 and 1.2, can a complete Biblical understanding be sought and eventually found as we look at what God has openly declared to us is the end of the entrance of man.

For much more go here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Origin...a/message/2461


Quasar92

The problem is that Genesis was never intended to give a chronology of Creation. There our thousands of chiasms in the Bible, with at least one in every book, which usually usually express a sequences of thoughts, and then express the same sequence of thoughts in the reverse order. This was a poetic method used in place of bold or italics to emphasize the center of the chiasm, with secondary emphasis on the beginning and end. However, repeating the same elements in the reverse order is going to completely throw off someone who is trying to get a precise chronology of out of it, a bit like trying to get blood our of a turnip. I can recommend an excellent study on this if you are interested.
 
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Dkh587

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Gap theory is easily debunkable

Exodus 20:8-11 LXX
Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy.
Six days thou shalt labour, and shalt perform all thy work.
But on the seventh day is the sabbath of YHWH thy God; on it thou shalt do no work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy servant nor thy maidservant, thine ox nor thine ass, nor any cattle of thine, nor the stranger that sojourns with thee.
For in six days YHWH made the heaven and the earth, and the sea and all things in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore YHWH blessed the seventh day, and hallowed it.

There's no gap because God created everything in 6 days. God creating everything in 6 days leaves no room for an unspecified gap of time.
 
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Quasar92

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Gap theory is easily debunkable



There's no gap because God created everything in 6 days. God creating everything in 6 days leaves no room for an unspecified gap of time.


You have debunked nothing. The OP is a reference to the first two verses of Genesis. Your reference does not enter the picture until verse three.


Quasar92
 
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Quasar92

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Gap theory is easily debunkable



There's no gap because God created everything in 6 days. God creating everything in 6 days leaves no room for an unspecified gap of time.


Reference to the gap in the OP pertains to verses 1-2. The six dsys of creation do not begin until verse 3.


Quasar92
 
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Dkh587

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You have debunked nothing. The OP is a reference to the first two verses of Genesis. Your reference does not enter the picture until verse three.


Quasar92
i don't have to debunk anything because the Scriptures debunk any kind of gap.
 
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DavidPT

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Let me see the Scriptural debunking of the gap between verses 1-2 of Genesis you allude to!


Quasar92

Why though? You obviously have your mind already fully made up, thus nothing one might submit will you actually accept as proof that your theory has been debunked.
 
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mark kennedy

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Let me see the Scriptural debunking of the gap between verses 1-2 of Genesis you allude to!


Quasar92
Hey Quasar92,

I've always been of the opinion that the age of the earth and the universe is irrelevant to the doctrine of creation. All we really know about the original creation is that it was 'in the beginning', the creation of life is another matter entirely. It cleared up some real problems with radiometric dating I was having, perhaps the elements that mineralized fossils really are very old. That is one of the reasons for me dismissing arguments from cosmology and geology and focused almost exclusively on the life sciences.

Some time after the original creation, perhaps minutes, perhaps billions of years later God begins his creative works on earth, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the deep.

However, Gap Theory rarely stops there and the days of creation are another matter entirely. I did enjoy the historic perspective you offered in the OP, it's pretty interesting that I'm not the only one who ever thought of it. That's always a little unsettling.

Interesting OP, nicely done. :)

Grace and peace,
Mark
 
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DavidPT

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Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


Matthew 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,

Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.


If the beginning meant in these latter two verses ties in with the beginning meant in Genesis 1:1, that means that Jesus actually lied if there is this huge gap of perhaps millions of years between Genesis 1 and when He made the male and female humans on day 6. It would no longer be considered the beginning some millions of years after Genesis 1:1. If I'm correct here, this alone easily debunks the OP and that it took very little effort to do so.
 
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lismore

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Let me see the Scriptural debunking of the gap between verses 1-2 of Genesis you allude to!


Quasar92

Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Exodus 31:17
It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed.’”

God Bless :)
 
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Quasar92

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Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Exodus 31:17
It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed.’”

God Bless :)


Which does not apply, because it all comes AFTER the gap, between verses 1 and 2.


Quasar92
 
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Quasar92

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Why though? You obviously have your mind already fully made up, thus nothing one might submit will you actually accept as proof that your theory has been debunked.


Your contribution is classic cop-out because you are unable to field an argument against the evidence provided in the OP at all. Opinion is meaningless without Scriptural support to verify it by.


Quasar92
 
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Postvieww

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Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


Matthew 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,

Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.


If the beginning meant in these latter two verses ties in with the beginning meant in Genesis 1:1, that means that Jesus actually lied if there is this huge gap of perhaps millions of years between Genesis 1 and when He made the male and female humans on day 6. It would no longer be considered the beginning some millions of years after Genesis 1:1. If I'm correct here, this alone easily debunks the OP and that it took very little effort to do so.


There is a third option, Jesus did not lie and you misapplied these scriptures.
 
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DavidPT

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There is a third option, Jesus did not lie and you misapplied these scriptures.


Of course Jesus never lied. So that leaves us with only two options. That the beginning meant is the same beginning that involved the 6 24 hour days of creation, or as you proposed, I misapplied those Scriptures. Since I'm assuming you think it's the latter, it is then upon you to show how I misapplied those Scriptures.

Once again, the Scriptures in question.

Matthew 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?

Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.

There is also this verse in the NT.

2 Peter 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.


And this one as well.

Revelation 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;


How can one make logical sense out of 2 Peter 3:4 if there is a gap between Genesis 1 and the first day in Genesis 1:3-5? Plus, how can that be the first day if other days have already preceded it? And as to these other alleged days that precede the first day recorded in Genesis 1:3-5, what was being used to measure time at the time?

Genesis 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

It couldn't have involved any of the above, that's for certain.
 
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Quasar92

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Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Exodus 31:17
It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed.’”

God Bless :)


What you have posted ll comes AFTER the void and darkness of the earth in verse 2, and debunks none of it.


Quasar92
 
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Dkh587

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Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Exodus 31:17
It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed.’”

God Bless :)

It's really this simple! God created everything in 6 days and rested on the 7th. No room for some manmade "gap theory" of undetermined time in 6 days of creation.

HalleluYah for God creating everything in 6 days and resting on the 7th, and giving us an example to follow
 
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