Are we God's "Experiment"?

[Aseyesee]

I'm sorry, but I just can't get away from the idea that mankind is God's "experiment". Look at the proof. First, Gods seems to be caught off guard when Adam and Eve sin and all of mankind from then on are considered by God to be sinners. Then comes the time of Noah (Genesis 6:6-7) 6 "The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. 7 So the Lord said, I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them". But instead of wiping us out, He continues His "experiment" by allowing Noah and his family to live and replenish the earth. So, the earth is replenished but most of mankind continues to sin and ignore God. Moving up to the time of Jesus, He makes this statement: John 3:16 - "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life". So, God goes from "I regretted that I have made human beings" to "He so loved the world". That is confusing.

I believe in God and the Trinity, but I just don't get His plan for mankind. Today there are billions of people who are lost, and I just don't understand why He continued His experiment, only to send billions to annihilation. I try to visualize the day of judgement with billions standing before Jesus and that one person in the midst of those billions who will be judged. Can you visualize it? How can that one person be judged in the midst of billions? It just boggles my mind. And yes, I know that God does things that are above our mind, but some things just don't make sense.

I don't believe the Bible is about the perception of God of his creation but rather our perception of God in relationship to us ... hence you find things in scripture like God coming down to see if what he heard is true ...

 

[Jeff Saunders]

I don't believe the Bible is about the perception of God of his creation but rather our perception of God in relationship to us ... hence you find things in scripture like God coming down to see if what he heard is true ...

Also much of the OT is about how man saw God and what they thought, they often got God wrong, that's why they killed Jesus, they did not understand what God was doing.
Here is an example- before the flood in Genesis , we read God regretted making man, or in the KJV God repented for making man, that's totally from mans perspective, God can't do anything he regrets and he definitely has nothing to repent about , but that is the way man saw what had happened and was trying to explain things. Trying to explain the infinite with finite terms is difficult, but finite is all we can understand.

 

[Aseyesee]

Also much of the OT is about how man saw God and what they thought, they often got God wrong, that's why they killed Jesus, they did not understand what God was doing.
Here is an example- before the flood in Genesis , we read God regretted making man, or in the KJV God repented for making man, that's totally from mans perspective, God can't do anything he regrets and he definitely has nothing to repent about , but that is the way man saw what had happened and was trying to explain things. Trying to explain the infinite with finite terms is difficult, but finite is all we can understand.

Yup ... when you reason with God, you reason with an absolute from a finite position ... and become clean if you do so ...

 

[Jeff Saunders]

I'm sorry, but I just can't get away from the idea that mankind is God's "experiment". Look at the proof. First, Gods seems to be caught off guard when Adam and Eve sin and all of mankind from then on are considered by God to be sinners. Then comes the time of Noah (Genesis 6:6-7) 6 "The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. 7 So the Lord said, I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them". But instead of wiping us out, He continues His "experiment" by allowing Noah and his family to live and replenish the earth. So, the earth is replenished but most of mankind continues to sin and ignore God. Moving up to the time of Jesus, He makes this statement: John 3:16 - "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life". So, God goes from "I regretted that I have made human beings" to "He so loved the world". That is confusing.

I believe in God and the Trinity, but I just don't get His plan for mankind. Today there are billions of people who are lost, and I just don't understand why He continued His experiment, only to send billions to annihilation. I try to visualize the day of judgement with billions standing before Jesus and that one person in the midst of those billions who will be judged. Can you visualize it? How can that one person be judged in the midst of billions? It just boggles my mind. And yes, I know that God does things that are above our mind, but some things just don't make sense.

If you are not satisfied with the western way of understanding God, look into this on youtube -Dr Bruce Wauchope- The gospel and soul health. its a long set of seminars divided up into about 20 minutes sections, it may help you see things differently.

 

[timothyu]

If you are not satisfied with the western way of understanding God,

Aren't we supposed to be satisfied with the Hebrew way? Pre-Gentile and Greek/Latin influence? Do westerners need to make Him over in our own image, or are we to make ourselves over in His?

 

[DragonFox91]

In regards to "did God change between the Flood & Jesus?" immididiately after the famous John 3:16, we find "whoever does not believe is condemned already." Most of the NT is actually about the wrath to come for those not in Christ. The need for Judgement didn't go away.

I'm not sure where you're getting God was caught off guard by Adam & Eve sinning.

In regards to God allowing Noah to repopulate: until recently I thought "God let the Tower of Babel people off soft. Why didn't he smite half of them there. He must be pretty weak." What we call foolishness or weakness, is actually his great patience & love for his people. Jonah wants to see God smite Ninevah but he doesn't do it in order that they may be saved.

The 'regret he made mankind' verse, all is saying that he was troubled & mankind's behavior to him was that severe. I don't think it's saying he made a mistake or regretted it. I also don't think it's saying it from the human perspective. In fact, in the next verse he promises Noah & family deliverance.

So we see 2 human attitudes here: one: why isn't God wrathful, & why is God not wrathful. "Why is Jesus not wrathful? Why isn't God not wrathful after the Flood? Why is God wrathful w/ the Flood? Since he's not always wrathful, he must not know what he's doing."

This is simlar to in 1st Peter I think it is, where people are questioning where is the Coming Judgement, & Peter says he has great patience.

 

[Aseyesee]

In regards to "did God change between the Flood & Jesus?" immididiately after the famous John 3:16, we find "whoever does not believe is condemned already." Most of the NT is actually about the wrath to come for those not in Christ. The need for Judgement didn't go away.

I'm not sure where you're getting God was caught off guard by Adam & Eve sinning.

In regards to God allowing Noah to repopulate: until recently I thought "God let the Tower of Babel people off soft. Why didn't he smite half of them there. He must be pretty weak." What we call foolishness or weakness, is actually his great patience & love for his people. Jonah wants to see God smite Ninevah but he doesn't do it in order that they may be saved.

The 'regret he made mankind' verse, all is saying that he was troubled & mankind's behavior to him was that severe. I don't think it's saying he made a mistake or regretted it. I also don't think it's saying it from the human perspective. In fact, in the next verse he promises Noah & family deliverance.

So we see 2 human attitudes here: one: why isn't God wrathful, & why is God not wrathful. "Why is Jesus not wrathful? Why isn't God not wrathful after the Flood? Why is God wrathful w/ the Flood? Since he's not always wrathful, he must not know what he's doing."

This is simlar to in 1st Peter I think it is, where people are questioning where is the Coming Judgement, & Peter says he has great patience.

Gen 18:21 I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and if not, I will know.

 

[Hawkins]

No, it's not about experiment. It's about how things work in an environment where the high ability/intelligence angels (the bad ones can be described as "crafty snake") interact with the (relatively) low ability/intelligence humans. Humans are captive in that situation without exception (don't count Jesus Himself). In front of Law, no one is righteous not even one.

On earth then all have sinned without exception. Faith and repentance are a test of human capability on their correctability. All of us sinned but only those with the capability of faith and repentance are deemed correctable. And only those correctable are seen as being able to live with a completely sin-incompatible God in Heaven. Heaven is a place where no one gets hurt, including God. Sin harms God making Him unhappy while Heaven is a place everyone is happy including God. If one is correctable he will be holy at the end.

The rest will be in a state of being separated from God. God cuts His knowledge and disconnects Himself from them, this is referred to as the permanent separation from God. God won't live a life of being continually hurt and painful.

A place absent of God is a place where the most evil and the most powerful will naturally and eventually rule, his name happens to be Satan. By then Satan is literally the god of the world where God is absent. On the other hand, this universe is never the true nature, as it's God-made. The true nature is supposed to be filled with energy and fire which is out of Satan's ability to counter. It is thus prophesied that Satan's realm will finally run into an eternal fire.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

Aren't we supposed to be satisfied with the Hebrew way? Pre-Gentile and Greek/Latin influence? Do westerners need to make Him over in our own image, or are we to make ourselves over in His?

Is it not the Hebrew way the thing that got him killed? The Hebrew way is what Jesus came against, if they had done things Gods way then they would have known God and recognizes when he showed up, but we know that's not how it happened.

 

[timothyu]

if they had done things Gods way then they would have known God and recognizes when he showed up, but we know that's not how it happened.

It would be no different today. People are good at skimming over the surface of Christianity. People think the messiah came to save us, good enough. Yet few stop to consider from what. The Jews thought from the Romans and Christians seem to think some adversary. But if all would have paid attention Jesus came to save His people from institutional religion. The same would apply today. These are who He jousted with. He taught us God’s way while humans have other ideas and yes refused to hand authority over to the Father. He taught us a better way which was ignored because people were looking for self-satisfaction.

 

[Strong in Him]

Is it not the Hebrew way the thing that got him killed?

No. God sent Jesus to die for our sins; the Lamb of God, John 1:29, slain from the foundation of the world, 1 Peter 1:19-20. God knew what would happen; Jesus knew what would happen.
Besides, Jesus was crucified for blasphemy, not dispute over the law.

if they had done things Gods way then they would have known God and recognizes when he showed up, but we know that's not how it happened.

As far as the Pharisees etc were concerned, they were doing things God's way. They were faithful, and obedient, to the law that God himself had given to Moses.

And I'm not sure they would have recognised him when he showed up. Yes, the Messiah's coming was prophesied in Scripture, but no one expected him to come the way he did. This is why they didn't recognise him and why when anyone did guess/Jesus told them, he told them not to tell anyone else. If the religious authorities had, for one minute believed the Messiah was standing in front of them, they would have expected him to raise an army, overcome the Romans and start a war.
Their belief was that anyone who looked at God would die - as God had told Moses in the OT. Also, God's name was so sacred they did not even say it. God was holy, pure, only to be contacted by special people and, in the minds of many, may have been seen as unapproachable. No one could have expected that the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob would come to earth as a frail human and live among the poor and outcast.

We have the advantage of hindsight, but if we had believed as they did, I'm not sure we would have expected Jesus either.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

It would be no different today. People are good at skimming over the surface of Christianity. People think the messiah came to save us, good enough. Yet few stop to consider from what. The Jews thought from the Romans and Christians seem to think some adversary. But if all would have paid attention Jesus came to save His people from institutional religion. The same would apply today. These are who He jousted with. He taught us God’s way while humans have other ideas and yes refused to hand authority over to the Father. He taught us a better way which was ignored because people were looking for self-satisfaction.

I agree that it is no deferent today, we have made what Jesus did for us a religion and not a relationship.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

I agree that it is no deferent today, we have made what Jesus did for us a religion and not a relationship.

Was not blasphemy part of the law?

 

[timothyu]

made what Jesus did for us a religion and not a relationship.

Agreed, Jesus brought us the Father and religion, both Jewish and Christian, move Him further away.